A Question(Or Two) About Historical Linguistics

[Maximum Zersk]

Well, Linguistics is a science, so I guess this would go here.

Hello, people of the playground. I have a somewhat broad question about Historical Linguistics. I need it for a conlang I'm working on.

When a language changes over time, what changes are made to the grammar?

I know what happens to sounds and words (Stuff like changing voicing, and such, or specialization, and other fancy words like that), but I don't quite understand the changes made to a language as it slowly evolves over time.

Also, does anyone know if there is a website about Linguistics that I could get my answers from?

Thanks!

[llamamushroom]

Also, does anyone know if there is a website about Linguistics that I could get my answers from?

Wikipedia?

On a more helpful note, I think you need to distinguish between written and conversational forms of the language. With written language, the grammar tends to 'stagnate' from the point widespread systematic education is introduced, but stays roughly the same as it was. Word usage in writing changes as people's vocabularies skew, but the grammar stays the same. Speaking tends to lose the structure a lot more easily - owing to the other dimension of gestures, tone of voice, etc., the grammar gradually becomes more simplistic.

Be warned, though; sometimes you get systems where the written language then changes to match the spoken. Not sure how you'd synthesise that.
E.g.: In Chinese, there are two separate prepositions you put between an adjective and a noun ([adjective]的[noun], or an adverb and a verb ([adverb]地[verb]). In recent writing, the former (的) has been used in both contexts, as when spoken they sound fairly similar.

[Maximum Zersk]

I meant conversational, sorry. :smallredface:

I'm not sure I understand you. What do you mean by more simplistic? Would that mean that Proto Indo-European had more complex grammar rules than every single language that evolved from it?
I need it, to make changes from the proto-conlang to the other conlangs. Also, how would you show the change different languages that grow from the proto-lang?

I'm sorry if I'm being too vague. I am checking the internet for stuff that may help though.

[llamamushroom]

To be honest, I was the vague one there.

What I meant by "more simplistic" was actually over a much shorter space of time than what you want - compare how you speak to how people spoke in the 1800s, and then to the 1500s; the reason peasants could understand Shakespeare was because he wrote how they spoke (that and the fact he was using defined dramatic conventions, but that's another matter).

Over a long period of time? I don't think anything much happens to the grammar. Oh, it might flip-flop from [verb][subject][object] to [object][verb][subject], or any other pattern, but spoken language drifts in any direction; like how some dialects of languages (again, thinking Chinese here) are completely different in syntax and structure to other dialects.

Really, unless your audience is ludicrously pedantic and incredibly well-read, it shouldn't be too much of an issue. Good luck, and I hope someone with more than an interest in the subject turns up.

[Maximum Zersk]

Well, thanks for helping. I think the info will be useful.

And I don't think I'll have to worry about the audience, considering I'm conworlding just fer fun. Kinda like Tolkien, only I don't nearly have as much experience as him with linguistics. :smalltongue:

[Mary Leathert]

Well, I only have familiarity with the history of English, but I think that there actually aren't changes that would affect every language in the same way as time passes. For example, almost all European languages have developed from Proto-Indoeuropean, as that supposed root language is called. And they're grouped according to how closely the changes that separated them from each other resemble each other.

That said, things that affect language change are quite multiple. One is the other languages surrounding the language in question. The more interraction there is between the users of two languages, the more they borrow from each other. This mostly affects non-lexical vocabulary, i.e. nouns, verbs, adjectives, adverbials. And sometimes all this borrowing of words affects grammar, for example, one of the reasons English dropped the complex inflections of verbs and nouns was the borrowed words from French, which were difficult to inflect in the traditional way.
Sometimes grammar changes directly because of the surrounding languages. But that is rarer, and usually only happens if the surrounding languages have a lot of prestige among the users of the language inspected.

So, in theory, your conlang can change in any way you like, if the changes are logical, i.e. they have some reason behind them, and consistent, i.e. not just random.

[rakkoon]

And if you forget a change in the new language, just say it is a leftover (don't know the correct English term) like "What can I do you for?". So you're covered :smallsmile: