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PersonMan
2010-03-20, 04:34 PM
Alright. As the title says, this is going to be my first time DMing an epic campaign. I have a few months to prepare for it, since there are several mini-campaigns between now and when we'll start playing it.

Background info: The PCs were killed in a huge, cataclysmic explosion that sent an extraplanar invading army back to their home dimension while also putting a huge crater in the main continent of the world and shattering several others. The PCs will now be venturing into the enemy home plane, and I'm running very low on both adventure ideas and a general idea of what I'm doing with epic levels.

They'll be starting at level 20, full WBL gear. Next week I'll be getting the Epic Level Handbook and can start learning the rules. But for now I'd like to see if the playground has any advice.

Also, none of the PCs will be using the epic spell system.

deuxhero
2010-03-20, 04:37 PM
I'd create new epic feats for melee. Beyond the the casting ones (not just casting, but auto metamagic and spellslots over the 9th level are WAY better than simple AC bonuses), almost every epic feats are worthless.

Eldariel
2010-03-20, 05:08 PM
There's some good work in the Homebrew forum for the epic martial types.

This thread has a good bunch (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=122765).
I wrote a lot of decent ones here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=92986).


But yeah, use something to bring warriors up to speed. Getting higher numbers on your attacks and AC doesn't really have any weight whatsoever when people can teleport 100s miles per second (good luck reaching an opponent capable of constant teleportation), dodge attacks through just warping space, be immune to every attack ever, Gate Hecatoncheireses and such.

Other than that, reword Epic Spellcasting so it's actually usable, but not completely and utterly busted. E.g. derive it off Caster Level (much harder to boost than skills) and limit mitigation to ½ the DC at most so it's impossible to get free epic spells. Then make healthy amounts of use of the DM fiat clause in the feat.

Other than that, just make sure to drive home the point Epic is more than just bigger numbers; the nature of threats, abilities and such changes quite a bit on the leap from level 20 to epic. Previously unanswerable things become trivial, just about every attack is counterable, healthy amounts of contingencies should be used, etc.

Grumman
2010-03-20, 05:18 PM
Do not use the Epic Spellcasting rules. 10th level spell slots are one thing, but Epic Spellcasting is either so broken it's useless or so broken it breaks the game, depending on how much effort you put into abusing it.

Tinydwarfman
2010-03-20, 05:19 PM
Epic slides all over the spectrum. Some feats are terrible even outside of epic, while others are game-breakingly good. I agree with eldariel, make heavy use of homebrew and be even more ready to veto anything a player brings up.

Masaioh
2010-03-20, 05:24 PM
Depending on how you do martial classes, I would recommend replacing fighter with something else. Not necessary ToB either if you don't want to learn it, because there's tons of 3rd party sources you can use, as well as homebrew T2 and T1 martial classes you can find on the internet.

A quick google search tells me 20th WBL is 760,000 GP. If that's all they get, and there's no epic spellcasting, you'll need to go a little easy on them.

Temotei
2010-03-20, 05:39 PM
I tried to fix the current epic feats on the SRD in the homebrew forum.

Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=139786)'s the thread.

Post #33 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7865285&postcount=33) finishes the list.

I think I wanted help with a few I thought might not be good enough for use, but I don't remember exactly which ones. A quick look through the thread should give you an idea though.

Harperfan7
2010-03-20, 05:48 PM
What are you looking for? Adventure ideas? What kinds of badguys to use?

FishAreWet
2010-03-20, 05:51 PM
20th level should play like a strategy game. It is trivial for single players to topple nations at this level of power. Be ready for PCs with game breaking power if you put them in basic fights.

Instead, make them protect things. Make them assault deities.

PersonMan
2010-03-20, 06:20 PM
Depending on how you do martial classes, I would recommend replacing fighter with something else. Not necessary ToB either if you don't want to learn it, because there's tons of 3rd party sources you can use, as well as homebrew T2 and T1 martial classes you can find on the internet.

A quick google search tells me 20th WBL is 760,000 GP. If that's all they get, and there's no epic spellcasting, you'll need to go a little easy on them.

I can't use ToB, as I don't have it. The only primarily martial character in the party is a partial caster, too, so I don't have to worry about that much.

I've found that they're able to do quite well against what I send against them. The only real hardcore optimizer in the party isn't doing anything cheesy, and the casters are primarily blasters, so I haven't had to deal with anything game-breaking yet.


What are you looking for? Adventure ideas? What kinds of badguys to use?

Well, it's sort of general advice/tips/ideas. I'm basically out of adventure ideas at the moment, so those would be nice.