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Mystic Muse
2010-03-21, 07:10 PM
I'm wondering what class/es are best for attacking with a bow. I'm also looking to increase my range as far as possible. anybody have any ideas?

I'm trying to replicate Simo Hayha.

JaronK
2010-03-21, 07:26 PM
I'm wondering what class/es are best for attacking with a bow. I'm also looking to increase my range as far as possible. anybody have any ideas?

Cloistered Cleric/PrC Ranger who uses Persistent Guided Shot and Divine Power combined with the Chain of Eyes spell (cast on the party scout) which allows him to detect anything the scout can detect. This should allow for incredible range. Consider also persisting Lesser Visage of the Deity so you can fly. Use Knowledge Devotion for more damage.

For your bow, use Strongarm Bracers of Archery and have Persistent Enlarge Person so that you can wield a Huge Greatbow of Distance. Each size increase brings range up by 25% (according to A&EG) so that's going to have incredible range. Then make it Splitting and you'll be really happy.

JaronK

PinkysBrain
2010-03-21, 07:28 PM
Ignoring pun-pun level cheese ... the best archer is the archivist, second best archer is the artificer using ranger spells, third best archer is a ranger or a prestige class with ranger spellcasting. Or in other words, ranger spellcasting is really good for archery (it's just sad that the ranger is not the best class to cast ranger spells).

What level? What books? To what extent do you mind relying on spells? To what extent do you mind relying on magic items?

Eldariel
2010-03-21, 07:29 PM
I'm wondering what class/es are best for attacking with a bow. I'm also looking to increase my range as far as possible. anybody have any ideas?

I'm trying to replicate Simo Hayha.

Range

Classes:
- Deepwood Sniper [MotW; 3.0]: +10ft/level
- Cragtop Archer [RoS]: 15 increments (on Arcing Shot)

Feats:
- Far Shot: *1.5
- Ranged Weapon Mastery [PHBII]: +20ft

Weapon Material:
- Dragonbone [Draconomicon]: +20ft

Enhancements:
- Distance: *2
- Flight-arrows [Don't remember]: +25ft

Spells/Powers:
- Extend Range [CPsi]: *2, extra 100% for each 4 PP.
And just plain increasing your own size (*1.25 increment per increase).

With Composite Greatbow, this gets you 255' increment with just feats & equipment, 405' (and up to 15 increments) with classes and feats and further 885' with magic.


Now, the real issue is that D&D doesn't really do "One shot, one kill", especially not at huge ranges without magic. The best way to deal damage at huge ranges is to shoot a whole ton of arrows.

For that, Warblade is a great chassis with Dancing Mongoose, Raging Mongoose and Time Stands Still (eventually). You'll want some way to qualify for Ranged Weapon Mastery, be it Fighter, Warblade or Pious Templar.

If you're open to using Magic, Arcane Archer (that is, e.g. Bard 8/Arcane Archer 2/Sublime Chord 2/Sacred Exorcist 4/Abjurant Champion 4) could do much what you want, giving you one really nasty shot. Purely martially though, there's very little you can do; all the tricks like Hunter's Mercy, Sniper's Shot + SA, etc. rely on magic.

Purely martially, you can shoot enough arrows to turn your opponent into cheddar in 3 turns, but you cannot do it nice and clean á la Häyhä. So...yeah, caster is probably a good starting point. Oh, and 3.0 sources help. KSB Snow Owl's Archer Builds (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=194.0) incorporate 3.0 classes and may interest you. Again though, magic.

Mystic Muse
2010-03-21, 08:04 PM
What level? Minimum of 8
What books? anything that isn't campaign specific and isn't from dragon magazine.
To what extent do you mind relying on spells? I'd rather not if it's possible but it's not a huge problem.
To what extent do you mind relying on magic items? don't really care.

Last Laugh
2010-03-21, 11:40 PM
Play a soulbow. They have the wonderful ability to shoot at anyone they KNOW IS IN RANGE. You don't have to mess with those pesky -40 spot checks, Pair it with Cragtop archer and have the party caster pick up summon elemental reserve feat. (earth glide through wall, earth glide back, report)
The only problem with this is that you can kill things through walls, which will piss off your DM.

Mystic Muse
2010-03-21, 11:41 PM
Play a soulbow. They have the wonderful ability to shoot at anyone they KNOW IS IN RANGE. You don't have to mess with those pesky -40 spot checks, Pair it with Cragtop archer and have the party caster pick up summon elemental reserve feat. (earth glide through wall, earth glide back, report)
The only problem with this is that you can kill things through walls, which will piss off your DM.

Probably. this DM doesn't like charging builds, and thinks that Monks are overpowered while wizards are underpowered.

I wish I was lying. He's not a bad DM. just a little naive.

Last Laugh
2010-03-22, 12:00 AM
My vote is still for soulbow. The seeking arrows are useful (ignore armor and concealment I think) if you use it sparingly (when you see a rogue dash around a corner you don't follow him you shoot him until he bleeds)
A naturally magical weapon is certainly useful.
you should try to get your dm to make the mindblade a full BA class.
If you do this grab the psycrystal affinity and containment feats.

PhoenixRivers
2010-03-22, 12:14 AM
If you don't mind throwing over shooting, then Bloodstorm Blade is nice. There is an item in MIC (gauntlets, I believe) that double your range. Add that to far shot, and your range is tripled. Get a distance weapon, and it's quadrupled. Now your javelin has a 200 foot range increment, and can be thrown to 1000 feet.

BSB allows you to use melee abilities at range, which will now equate to power attack/etc. Your weapons will also have returning, but will return instantly, rather than on a 1 round delay.

At the top level of the PrC, you can, as a full round action, make one attack at as many targets as you like within range. Think of it as Whirlwind Attack on crack.

Pair this with a seeking ghost touch weapon. Choose every square within 1000 feet, and attack. As ghost touch treats your weapon as corporeal or incorporeal, whichever is more advantageous, you can now throw through walls up to 5 feet thick (treating the javelin as incorporeal on the trip, and corporeal on the hit, which allows it to pass through solid objects, as long as it stays within 5 feet of open air). If there's a creature in a square, you'll automatically veer to hit it (ignore concealment miss chances).

In other words? Attack just about everything within 1000 feet as a full round action. Through most walls.

Seffbasilisk
2010-03-22, 12:14 AM
There's some glasses-type magic object that effectively gives you Far shot, and stacks with it that I used for a Warlock once...can't find book/page at the minute though.

Mystic Muse
2010-03-22, 12:16 AM
I'll probably go with soulbow. Going through walls seems like a good way to replicate a Sniper.

@phoenix rivers. Sorry, but in this group, even ATTEMPTING something like that would get me lynched.

Kantolin
2010-03-22, 12:30 AM
Spells/Powers:
- Extend Range [CPsi]: *2, extra 100% for each 4 PP.
And just plain increasing your own size (*1.25 increment per increase).

Where is this stated?

PhoenixRivers
2010-03-22, 12:37 AM
I'll probably go with soulbow. Going through walls seems like a good way to replicate a Sniper.

@phoenix rivers. Sorry, but in this group, even ATTEMPTING something like that would get me lynched.

You can also tone it down, and only attack things you can see, or small sections of land.

That said, the build I presented was a toned down version of a Hulking Hurler build that destroyed cities with ease.

Note: You won't get that "super whirlwind" until Character level 15. At that time, you really should be strong. Prior to that, you'll have the ability to full attack at range, so with rapid shot, at level 11? That's 4 attacks per round. It's good, but not disgustingly so, and you need to know where people are to hit them through walls (like the soulbow).

In addition, the build I gave you doesn't have crazy high damage, so it's not that bad, even at higher levels.

JaronK
2010-03-22, 12:41 AM
Where is this stated?

Arms and Equipment Guide, near the beginning.

JaronK