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taltamir
2010-03-27, 12:05 AM
According to detect magic, http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/DetectMagic.htm
{table]Faint|Moderate|Strong|Overwhelming
5th or lower|6th-11th|12th-20th|21st+ (artifact)[/table]

However, in the wondrous items page, http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/WondrousItems.htm
I have looked and noticed that
Faint = 1-6
Moderate = 7-12
Strong = 13-20

Which is correct? detect magic, or the value given with each item?

AslanCross
2010-03-27, 01:34 AM
Text trumps table, so I'd go with the item descriptions prevailing over the Detect Magic table.

Gralamin
2010-03-27, 01:55 AM
Text trumps table, so I'd go with the item descriptions prevailing over the Detect Magic table.

I'd say the opposite: The Detect Magic spell describes the rules for detecting magic with the Detect Magic spell. So if it states something different then the item descriptions, logically you use the item descriptions for detecting magic without detect magic, while you use the Detect Magic spell rules for when a player casts the spell Detect Magic.

PhoenixRivers
2010-03-27, 02:01 AM
Detect magic is in the PHb, and outlines most means of aura detection, even for more powerful spells, such as Arcane Sight.

Magic Item tables are in the DMG.

While "text trumps table" is one of the more often cited Priority clauses, the entire basis is that the more valid source has priority.

PHb has more authority for the functioning of spells than the DMG. Therefore, for Detect Magic and all derivatives, it is primary source.

KillianHawkeye
2010-03-27, 09:01 AM
PHb has more authority for the functioning of spells than the DMG. Therefore, for Detect Magic and all derivatives, it is primary source.

However, the DMG is the primary source for magic items. Troubling. :smallconfused:

taltamir
2010-03-27, 10:16 AM
Text trumps table, so I'd go with the item descriptions prevailing over the Detect Magic table.

if it was a single item I would be inclined to say so too... but EVERY item uses the exact same values in its description.

taltamir
2010-03-27, 10:26 AM
well, I emailed WOTC about it...

KillianHawkeye
2010-03-27, 11:32 AM
well, I emailed WOTC about it...

I wouldn't expect them to still be answering questions about pre-4th Edition D&D if I were you. :smallamused:

taltamir
2010-03-27, 03:14 PM
I wouldn't expect them to still be answering questions about pre-4th Edition D&D if I were you. :smallamused:

i indeed seriously doubt that they will answer...
actually I can see their answer now: "as you have observed 3.5e has problems, those were fixed in 4e, you should go buy 4e and play that instead.
- WOTC employee"

Kaiyanwang
2010-03-27, 03:22 PM
i indeed seriously doubt that they will answer...
actually I can see their answer now: "as you have observed 3.5e has problems, those were fixed in 4e, you should go buy 4e and play that instead.
- WOTC employee"

"Easy, easy, one flawed product at time"

ericgrau
2010-03-27, 07:44 PM
What's worse is that there is a CL 6 ring that's listed as moderate and a CL 12 ring that's listed as strong. Ditto for rods. Ditto for armors. Ditto for weapons, except flame tongue. I think they made a mistake on the wondrous items. If it makes you feel better the guy who screwed it up doesn't work for WotC anymore... b/c no author of 3.5e works at WotC anymore :smallbiggrin:.

absolmorph
2010-03-27, 07:55 PM
What's worse is that there is a CL 6 ring that's listed as moderate and a CL 12 ring that's listed as strong. Ditto for rods. Ditto for armors. Ditto for weapons, except flame tongue. I think they made a mistake on the wondrous items. If it makes you feel better the guy who screwed it up doesn't work for WotC anymore... b/c no author of 3.5e works at WotC anymore :smallbiggrin:.
Which means the table for Detect Magic was used for those items.
6-11 is listed as moderate. 12-20 is listed as strong.
How is that worse? :smallconfused:

ericgrau
2010-03-27, 08:19 PM
Good for those items, worse for wondrous items. A clear contradiction. I think it's best to stick to the detect magic tables on this one.

taltamir
2010-03-28, 04:30 PM
According to the PHB page 19, the aura strengths of magic items are
Faint = CL1-5
Moderate = CL6-11
Strong = CL12-20

According to the DMG entire chapter 7, looking at every individual item and the listed aura strength for it I have noticed that:
Faint = CL1-6
Moderate = CL7-12
Strong = CL13-20
There are no exceptions to this, all items on the DMG list the strength of the aura based on the CL of the item based on this chart which contradicts the values given in the PHB in the spell detect magic.

These two values obviously contradict, which one is correct?

********************
Page Number: p19 for PHB, DMG entire ch7
Book Name: 3.5e PHB & DMG

Hello Tal,

What page of the DMG has this chart repeated? On my initial review I was unable to fin anything. Happy Gaming!

Shawn

Status changed to solved.

the chart isn't replicated in the DMG.
Each and every individual item in the DMG lists its "aura strength" as well as the CL. I have observed that all CL1-6 items in the DMG are listed as having a faint aura, contradicting the chart in the PHB's detect magic spell description, likewise for moderate and strong.

So its not that the chart is replicated.
let me actually list some examples:
p249 folding boat is "Faint Transmutation; CL6"

p252 circlet of blasting "Faint evocation; CL 6th; Craft Wondrous Item, Searing light; Price 6,480 gp."

p252 Cloak of Arachnida "Faint conjuration and transmutation; CL 6th; Craft Wondrous Item, spider climb, web; Price 14,000 gp; Weight 1 lb."

Actually, now that I take a better look, it seems to only be the case for wondrous items. If you simply go through the wondrous items you will see all of them incorrectly list the aura strength. but other items such as rings etc will list it correct.

ex: page 233: x-ray vision "Moderate divination; CL 6th; Forge Ring, true seeing; Price 5,000 gp."
This one is clearly matching the chart in the PHB, as it lists CL 6th as moderate aura.

Tal,

I apologize, Customer Service does not have the ability to answer questions about versions of Dungeons and Dragons other than Fourth edition. We have collected some information here that may answer your question, but if it is not there the only advise I can give is to have your Dungeon Master make the best call he can and go forward from there.

Thanks, and Good Gaming!