PDA

View Full Version : 3.5 Artificer - Need help with anything/everything



TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 02:33 PM
After my campaign last night...we moved on to decide that my buddy who we are gonna call 'X' is going to run a game on fridays. However, I discussed my character idea with him and he is willing to let me play it.

I am going to play an artificer

we start at level 10.

This artificer is a researcher on mimicing/cloning magical items. He has allowed me a craft check dc 15 +level of item to clone a magical item with the properties. Im also allowed to strip the magic from an item and store in a special device to apply to another item of my choosing.

I need a way to make myself powerful and be able to succeed at said thing. Including race, stats to main in order of 1/2/3 and so on and stats I can dump. I need some help on ways to hunt artifacts and such so that I may abuse my power.

Any dips/feats and such I should take.

gorfnab
2010-03-29, 04:20 PM
Here is a handbook that might be of some use to you: Artificer Handbook (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872330/Artificer_Handbook_%28rough_draft%29)

PinkysBrain
2010-03-29, 04:33 PM
This artificer is a researcher on mimicing/cloning magical items. He has allowed me a craft check dc 15 +level of item to clone a magical item with the properties.
I assume you can only clone a limited amount of magic items at a time? (And no consumables.) Otherwise you break the economy into itty bitty pieces ;)

I need some help on ways to hunt artifacts and such so that I may abuse my power.
Artifacts are placed by the DM and the setting ... what setting will you be playing in?

Any dips/feats and such I should take.
The persistificer using persistent unfettered heroism and wandsurge is undoubtedly the more optimal route, but it's also terribly cheesy. Ignoring persistent spell for a moment ... I like Prophecy's Artifex to get free quickening on wands.

jiriku
2010-03-29, 04:33 PM
The artificer handbook gives you all the advice I could give and more, but if you truly intend to abuse your power, make sure you practice you maniacal laughter and learn to give entertaining monologues about how you plan to take over the world.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 04:53 PM
Reading the guide now


any ideas on how to abuse that given power he allotted?

I mean I need feats/skills or w/e that allow me to search for artifacts or gain ways to achieve them easier.


any ideas on the stats?

Also yeah...he set no limit to how many I can have at one time...however I think if I clone it too many times it destroys it.

HunterOfJello
2010-03-29, 06:25 PM
I don't have my Eberron books with me at the moment, but I'll give them a look over later.



Off the top of my head, here are several options:

Detect Magic is the fastest way to obtain information about a magical item or detect one in close range. Divination Spells can also achieve a similar effect. Detect Magic is obtainable easily from wands.

If you want to go around seeking out powerful magic items then one good method would be to abuse the often abused Leadership feat. Get Leadership and then find a wizard cohort with the Collegiate Wizard feat (gives bonus spells to them per level) who will be able to scribe scrolls for you and also use divination spells to seek out those magical items.

Other ways of obtaining information about the locations of magical items are diplomacy checks mixed with gather information and the various knowledge skills.

~~~

Overall if you overpower your character you may very quickly become the most powerful character in the party. When this happens you need make sure to turn your character into a team player. DM's and groups dislike players who take all the glory and overshadow everyone else. However, groups LOVE a party member who goes around building fancy new magic items for them at very low costs and uses their abilities to buff up the entire group. Overall if you play an Artificer properly your entire group will love you to death and your DM will have no choice but to leave your character alone or face the wrath of the entire party.


~~~

The Artificer Guide that was already linked is going to be your best friend along with the Magic Item Compendium and Dungeon Master Guide (the back section with all the item information).

Stat priority is
1. Int
2. Dex
3. Cha/Con

Races are the typical best races. Human and Strongheart Halfling are great. If you don't mind playing a halfling then go with Strongheart halfling. The Artificer Guide explains some options for Warforged. They also have nice substitution levels.

Item Familiars from Unearthed Arcana are fun to have. I would suggest playing a few games to see if the DM is the type to deprive players of items just to spite them. An Item Familiar can really hurt your character if you lose it, so be careful in your decision. (One option I've always wanted to try is to play a Warforged with his armor as an Item Familiar. Warforged are allowed to enchant their own armor that they use and it would be extremely difficult to remove a Warforged's armor off of him if it's even possible.)


*edit*

http://69.8.198.229/wotc_archive/index.php/t-719014 might be helpful too


~~~

When building your character, be sure to take your time and make use of all the XP that Artificers get each level to create items with. That XP pool doesn't transfer or build up over levels so you either spend it or lose it when you level up.


Some fun magical items to start off making are Magic Wands, Eternal Magic Wands (2 uses/day, infinite charges!) and Weapon and Armor Gems. Weapon and Armor Gems can be removed and placed on any weapons and armor to enchant them with bonus abilities. If you're a warforged you can just stick an armor gem on yourself to gain the benefit.

Be sure to make a nice big number of magical items to pass out to each of the other player characters once you get friendly enough with them. Also ask them about their character goals and try to identify items that you could build for them as surprises. If you play this character right (and don't be stingy with your item creation) your party is really going to love you.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 06:40 PM
Thank you very much

going to play human just so there is no dm throwing a book at me. Usually he is very easy on us finding stuff...however most of his "missions" are extremely complicated but some of the tools I can buy/get help that easily. I do think that the items will come up often just have to look for them.

HunterOfJello
2010-03-29, 06:46 PM
Do you know what your starting gp will be?

You definitely want a Handy Haversack and Belt of Many Pockets for all these items you're going to be hauling around.

*edit*


http://www.enworld.org/forum/local_links.php?action=jump&catid=2&id=109 could be useful for keeping track of your infusions. (Check out the infusions pdf)

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 06:55 PM
He said level 10...so i figure he will give us the DMG amount specific to that level w/e that may be.


I really like that magic guide.


I do believe he is letting me transfer magic from one item to another and such..so not sure if he is letting it stack..but really gonna take the leadership thing and alot of crafts...

any ideas on whether I should be ranged or melee?

HunterOfJello
2010-03-29, 07:15 PM
He said level 10...so i figure he will give us the DMG amount specific to that level w/e that may be.


I really like that magic guide.


I do believe he is letting me transfer magic from one item to another and such..so not sure if he is letting it stack..but really gonna take the leadership thing and alot of crafts...

any ideas on whether I should be ranged or melee?


definitely ranged.

melee is best left to barbarians, fighters and rogue. you're better off in the back boosting everyone, sniping with wands, and controlling the battlefield

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 07:18 PM
Ok, not sure ill really have to travel or combat much...was wondering with the items I should have access too. Ranged does sound better. Might just stick to wands though instead of bow/crossbow.


He is doing the system like this:

3k gold per level

so 3000 x 10 = 30,000 gp

Plus my earnings per week of being roughly 100gp


So Im able to start with a few things to get me going.


Im slightly frightened by how much he is handing out. Either he is scared we wont like the game so is giving too much. Or He is hoping we dont hate him in the end of the first game.

HunterOfJello
2010-03-29, 08:17 PM
Ok, not sure ill really have to travel or combat much...was wondering with the items I should have access too. Ranged does sound better. Might just stick to wands though instead of bow/crossbow.


He is doing the system like this:

3k gold per level

so 3000 x 10 = 30,000 gp

Plus my earnings per week of being roughly 100gp


So Im able to start with a few things to get me going.


Im slightly frightened by how much he is handing out. Either he is scared we wont like the game so is giving too much. Or He is hoping we dont hate him in the end of the first game.

hopefully that isn't the case. I can already tell that he doesn't use the Dungeon Master's Guide properly though, considering that he's giving you less than half of what your character wealth should be.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 08:22 PM
What is the recommended gold?


any ideas on any prestige classes or anything that would be good to take? or just stick to artificer all the way up?

Tinydwarfman
2010-03-29, 08:39 PM
What is the recommended gold?


any ideas on any prestige classes or anything that would be good to take? or just stick to artificer all the way up?

Hereis the chart:

2 900
3 2700
4 5400
5 9000
6 13000
7 19000
8 27000
9 36000
10 49000
11 66000
12 88000
13 110000
14 150000
15 200000
16 260000
17 340000
18 440000
19 580000
20 760000

Sinfire Titan
2010-03-29, 08:45 PM
What is the recommended gold?


any ideas on any prestige classes or anything that would be good to take? or just stick to artificer all the way up?

Very few PrCs are worth it for an Artificer. Cannith Wand Adept is the major exception if you are going to be a Blastificer. It isn't that the class is that good, its that the PrCs don't refill your Craft Reserve, so you need to set aside XP every level for it.

Not much of a problem, but enough to deter some people.


A 3 level dip into Incarnate gets you a massive bonus to your UMD checks through the Mage's Spectacles soulmeld. It also gives you the Incarnate Weapon soulmeld, which is a great target for your Infusions.

Endarire
2010-03-29, 08:57 PM
See Edymnion's work (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19579430/The_Unofficial_Artificer_Players_Guide_3.0?post_id =332789022#332789022).

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 08:57 PM
What book is incarnate in?


on another issue. Ive read the artificer multiple times and I see it as being great with that salvage ability.

It seems like a very fun class and I think I can make it happen.


Lets see if this looks right to yall.


Human Artificer

STR: 14
DEX: 16
CON: 17
INT: 18 +2 = 20
WIS: 14
CHA: 18

Feats:
Scribe Scroll (artisan)
Exceptional Artisan (human)
Legendary Artisan (1st)
Extraordinary Artisan (3rd)
Leadership (6th)
Wand Mastery (9th)
Brew Potion (Artisan)
Craft Wonderous Item (Artisan)
Craft Homunculus (Artisan)
Craft Magic Arms and Armor (Artisan)
Craft Wand (Artisan)
Craft Rod (Artisan)
Contingency Spell (Bonus)
Still need 1 bonus Feats


Skills:
These are for sure

Spellcraft 13
Craft * 13


not sure what else though.

shadow_archmagi
2010-03-29, 08:57 PM
Very few PrCs are worth it for an Artificer. Cannith Wand Adept is the major exception if you are going to be a Blastificer. It isn't that the class is that good, its that the PrCs don't refill your Craft Reserve, so you need to set aside XP every level for it.

Not much of a problem, but enough to deter some people.


A 3 level dip into Incarnate gets you a massive bonus to your UMD checks through the Mage's Spectacles soulmeld. It also gives you the Incarnate Weapon soulmeld, which is a great target for your Infusions.

Well, the thing about PrC's is that none of them advance any artificer features. Whereas a wizard who takes, say, abjurant champion, gets to keep spellcasting exactly the way a wizard would AND fancy bonuses, an artificer who PrCs does not get more infusions, more crafting feats, or more craft reserve.

So taking a PrC is like saying "I'm done with accumulating artificer related class features"

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 09:00 PM
No need to PrC then. I think I can just maximize the class by going all the way to 20 as an artificer and just improve with gear.

Sinfire Titan
2010-03-29, 09:01 PM
What book is incarnate in?


Magic of Incarnum. Be prepared for a headache, though you are playing the one class more complicated than the entire book.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 09:03 PM
Lol. thanks for that then. Im most likely not going to Prc since there isnt anything I actually "gain"

Lycanthromancer
2010-03-29, 09:03 PM
What book is incarnate in?Magic of Incarnum. Wonderful book. The system is relatively simple, but there's lots of complexity from such simple details. The incarnate and totemist are strong but balanced (though there aren't any other classes in the book NO THERE AREN'T). It does get feat-intensive, and you have to make choices between magic items and soulmelds, but there's enough variety and fun stuff to play with that you can make character after character and not have the same build twice, even going MoI-only.


Feats:
Scribe Scroll (artisan)
Exceptional Artisan (human)
Legendary Artisan (1st)
Extraordinary Artisan (3rd)
Leadership (6th)
Wand Mastery (9th)
Brew Potion (Artisan)
Craft Wonderous Item (Artisan)
Craft Homunculus (Artisan)
Craft Magic Arms and Armor (Artisan)
Craft Wand (Artisan)
Craft Rod (Artisan)

Still need 2 bonus FeatsFirst level feat should be Apprentice (Craftsman), from the DMG II. 10% off all crafting costs. ALL crafting costs.

Also, Extra Ring is nice. Or possibly Item Familiar, if you can swing it. Craft Graft would be nice, except grafts aren't all that good.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 09:08 PM
Extra rings require me to be level 12th..unfortunately im only level 10.

what about contigiency spell? or w/e its called..where is item familiar and is it just a bad idea?

Sinfire Titan
2010-03-29, 09:14 PM
Extra rings require me to be level 12th..unfortunately im only level 10.

what about contigiency spell? or w/e its called..where is item familiar and is it just a bad idea?

1: Craft Contingent Spell is liable to get books thrown. It's in CArc. In other words, use at personal risk, but it is a good feat.

2: Item Familiar is in UA. As long as you don't abuse the Skill Points thing, and apply the bonus XP to your craft reserve only, it's a great way to improve your character's UMD abilities.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 09:18 PM
I think I can dodge the first book..I might attempt it...is it really that good of a feat?

and on the familiar one...UA is?

shadow_archmagi
2010-03-29, 09:20 PM
Take some metamagic feats!

Artificer <3 metamagic.



Check out "Metamagic Item" a third level infusion. Spend one round casting it, and then any spell trigger item (Wand, Staff) has a metamagic applied to it for rounds-per-level.

Take something like Twin Spell and then enjoy spending one infusion to make your wand twice as effective for the rest of the fight. Double fireballs? Double enervation?


NOTE: In the event that you do this, you are contractually obliged to make a wand of blind and then announce that for scientific accuracy you're going to make it a double blind

Sinfire Titan
2010-03-29, 09:21 PM
I think I can dodge the first book..I might attempt it...is it really that good of a feat?

and on the familiar one...UA is?

It effectively gives you an answer to every possible situation you could be in. The reason the spell version is so good is because it gives you an out without needing an action during combat. The feat is even better because it gives you more actions. Requires a good amount of Min-Maxing to make it work, so talk to some of our fellow optimizers for more information.


Unearthed Arcana. AKA the SRD. (http://www.d20srd.org/)

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 09:25 PM
taking the "amazing" feat

not taking the familiar one...it seems like it could hurt more than end up helping me...or force the dm to strip it when i get strong.


At the heart metamagic guy:

Is twin spell really worth the slot? or is there better out there?

shadow_archmagi
2010-03-29, 09:30 PM
taking the "amazing" feat

not taking the familiar one...it seems like it could hurt more than end up helping me...or force the dm to strip it when i get strong.


At the heart metamagic guy:

Is twin spell really worth the slot? or is there better out there?

I love twin spell, personally. Damage-wise, it's about as good as maximize on average. (3d6=18 damage maximized, or 6d6=18 damage on average). Except that you can use it for other stuff.

Save-or-dies become "Save TWICE or die" which is brilliant. Like it sounds, it's just the same spell twice. Look at all your wands and ask "Would it be worth a feat to DOUBLE this?" and then answer yourself "Of course it would! Magic is awesome. Double magic, therefore, is double awesome!"

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 09:31 PM
hmmm..so twin spell allows me to double the spell coming from a wand? and it would be used for blind or sleep or the better one of both depending...

shadow_archmagi
2010-03-29, 09:35 PM
hmmm..so twin spell allows me to double the spell coming from a wand? and it would be used for blind or sleep or the better one of both depending...

Twin Spell is a metamagic that basically says "When you cast this spell, it gets cast again in exactly the same way."

So a Twin Fireball would basically be firing two fireballs at the enemy.

Twin Blind would mean your enemy is hit by two magical bolts of blindness (Mechanically, this is exactly the same as being blinded once. You cannot be double blinded. But you DO have to roll the save twice, so your enemy has double the chance of being blinded.)

Twin Sleep would mean your enemy is put to sleep twice (Functioning just like a double blind)

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 09:43 PM
Thats the plan...now does it work with a wand cast?

shadow_archmagi
2010-03-29, 09:45 PM
Thats the plan...now does it work with a wand cast?

Wand Cast?

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 09:47 PM
Ill be creating wands to use my spells and rarely really casting unless necessary (just the playstyle i want with this character)...

If I were to use a wand can the spell coming from wand be affected?

The Shadowmind
2010-03-29, 10:55 PM
You take the metamagic feat, then you use the Artificer's metamagic spell trigger ability to apply the metamagic feat to the wand. It uses up X+1 number of charges thought, where X is equal to the spell levels that the metamagic feat would add.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 11:00 PM
Oh that is just nice...Ill take twin spell then. Thank you for verifying that for me.


anyone else have any ideas?

Reluctance
2010-03-29, 11:01 PM
The only "spells" your character casts directly are his infusions. Most of what you do is from wands and other items. And yes, you have special abilities to allow you to metamagic up your items.

One drawback you should be aware of is that wands have really sucky save DC's. Throwing around save-or-whatever is not your forte. Battlefield control, buffs, and even the occasional big boom are your specialties.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 11:05 PM
so dont go for double sleep/blind?

go for fireball/grease and area spells?

and cats grace and such in my wands?

im thinking now that the metamagic might not be worth it if it wastes so many charges...I might as well just stack up another worthwhile defensive feat just in case.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-29, 11:10 PM
Wand Mastery is feat you could take at the 9th level feat.
+2 to caster level and DC's for wands.
Get rid of the 25% reduced crafting time feat, a Dedicated Wright Homunculus is a better crafting method, and lets you save 7 hours a day you would be spending on crafting.

Staffs are the powerful magic item, since they allow you to apply your own caster level, and use your own stats for the DC's, but most are expensive and finding a decent one is tricky. If custom staffs are allowed then...:xykon:

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 11:13 PM
Wand Mastery is feat you could take at the 9th level feat.
+2 to caster level and DC's for wands.
Get rid of the 25% reduced crafting time feat, a Dedicated Wright Homunculus is a better crafting method, and lets you save 7 hours a day you would be spending on crafting.

Staffs are the powerful magic item, since they allow you to apply your own caster level, and use your own stats for the DC's, but most are expensive and finding a decent one is tricky. If custom staffs are allowed then...:xykon:

I already grabbed wand mastery.

how does one get a dedicated wright homunculus?

custom staffs are allowed since I can transfer spells/magical abilites from item to item...so i can take a wand and drop it into a quarterstaff i believe to make a powerful staff.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-29, 11:20 PM
how does one get a dedicated wright homunculus?

custom staffs are allowed since I can transfer spells/magical abilites from item to item...so i can take a wand and drop it into a quarterstaff i believe to make a powerful staff.

Craft Homunculus, which artificers get, 2200 gold, and 160 craftR/exp.
Check page 285 of the Eberron Campaign setting for the Homunculus stats.

Can't comment on the weird spell item transfer ability, since I have no clue how that will work.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 11:22 PM
Craft Homunculus, which artificers get, 2200 gold, 160 craftR/exp.

Can't comment on the weird spell item transfer ability, since I have no clue how that will work.


ahh so just an homonculus that crafts for me...very nice system there..also took leadership to grab some others to craft for me as well...

yeah dm let me do it for a character concept im work on. I can copy/clone magical items and also transfer spells/magical things from one object to another. Hoping to have fun this game..but dont want to be dead weight the whole time.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-29, 11:39 PM
If you know what you are doing artificers are in the top 6 classes in the game.

A crafted standard Staff of Fire costs 28,500.
Crafted it would be 14250 gp, add the 25% price discount on the feat it becomes 10,687gp 5sp. This is before you start applying cheese.
Warning the following will likely gets books thrown at your
10% discount for skill use,: Speak-Common
30% discount for having it be alignment restrictive.
Those price the cost down to 6,733.125gp. 539 CraftR/exp.

A staff has 50 charges, and use the option fireball normally takes one.
Using the Maximize feat increase the level by 3, making each Maximized use, deal 60 damage, (10d6, max possible).
You can do that 12 times before you run out of charges.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-29, 11:41 PM
Wow so take maximize thats a given..

what do you mean by skill? just the craft skill?

also on another front alignment restrictive? like have it be lG or something?

The Shadowmind
2010-03-29, 11:50 PM
Skill use as requiring the ability to have a specific skill to use, the guide line is very vague. Any skill.
Alignment restriction, meaning only those of the alignment priced at creation can use it, so typically it would be your alignment or the alignment of who ever is going to use it. Unless you can make the DC 30 UMD check to fake an alignment for the purpose of using a magic device.
That kind of why it is likely that option will be banned quickly.

I also advise not having the cohort take leadership, since one that is overpowered, and the paperwork is a nightmare.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 12:00 AM
I have leadership I meant. I plan to make a crafting army once I get enough time and people heh. But im sure it will get banned lets hope I can pop out a few staves first.

Fireball the best one?

Reluctance
2010-03-30, 12:05 AM
Taking Leadership to get an army of crafters is cheesy. Check with your DM before doing so. Plus, due to the way cohorts gain XP, having one craft for you will cause a permanent drag.

And I think you're ignoring an important question. What do you see your character doing in combat? Blasting things with wands? Buffing his teammates? Wading in with weapons and armor he enhances in the moment with his infusions? Sitting back and having a swarm of constructs fight for him? These are all viable options for an artificer, so it'd help to pick a tactic rather than trying to make the One True Artificer Build.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 12:08 AM
Honestly I dont see myself in combat that much. I think if anything I would previously or on the run infuse/enchant my parties armor and reap the benefits....Im more of the assist/guide. If anything im the buffer....but need some sort of protection incase someone gets too close...

was thinking of making if at all possible a wand of sanctuary for myself...or an amulet or something


and why is the army of crafters cheesy? it allows me to travel with the group while my cohorts craft items for me...saving me time.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-30, 12:11 AM
I have leadership I meant. I plan to make a crafting army once I get enough time and people heh. But im sure it will get banned lets hope I can pop out a few staves first.

Fireball the best one?

You are level 10 with an 8th level cohort, the 8th cohort could take leadership as well and get a 6th level cohort, the 6th level could take leader ship and get a 4th level cohort. That leads to a bunch of followers. That is part of the reason Leadership is broken. The other part is basically getting an extra character and a bunch of nameless pack-mule people.

Only 1 Dedicated Wright can work on the magic item, since you can only make 1 magic item at a time, but more can work on the mundane/alchemical items. Improved familiar from Magic of Ebberon could help with make better homunculus

Fireball isn't the best spell for that, but it is the most well known.
I don't know which is the best, maybe someone else knows which the the best blasting spell. Control spells tend to be much better which groups though.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 12:15 AM
You are level 10 with an 8th level cohort, the 8th cohort could take leadership as well and get a 6th level cohort, the 6th level could take leader ship and get a 4th level cohort. That leads to a bunch of followers. That is part of the reason Leadership is broken. The other part is basically getting an extra character and a bunch of nameless pack-mule people.

Only 1 Dedicated Wright can work on the magic item, since you can only make 1 magic item at a time, but more can work on the mundane/alchemical items. Improved familiar from Magic of Ebberon could help with make better homunculus

Fireball isn't the best spell for that, but it is the most well known.
I don't know which is the best, maybe someone else knows which the the best blasting spell. Control spells tend to be much better which groups though.

I like that leadership ruling heh. I think that will get me hit with books...however I do think that I can just have him craft while I collect ya know? I dont want to be the guy always having to get shot at...I like assisting and watching. That way the group of tier 3-4s im going to be with will be able to do stuff and possibly conquer things due to my help and not me blowing everything up.

Coidzor
2010-03-30, 12:18 AM
That's... less than ideal usage of your character's time to try to sit out of fights. And you don't really have the ability to be actively buffing during fights very well, either. And unless you're using the "get up to a 3rd level spell stored in an item for later use" infusion to cast sanctuary on yourself, the DC to avoid getting attacked is going to be low enough that anything that is going to be able to get at you is going to get at you.

As far as blasting, I believe that Scorching Ray spell is a fairly popular one. As is Enervation, especially when they're combined with twinned, split ray metamagics and the infusions that one uses to get extra charges on the wand for such things.

It's still going to be nova-y, but with cost-saving things and the loot one gets from the slain foes and adventuring, it should work out to be a net gain.

Still, probably not going to be the tactic of choice for more routine combats.

The personal weapon augmentation infusion's ability to add X-bane to one's weapon is useful though, and reason enough to have a crossbow or bow. About the only infusion that can be used for a fight without a lot of forewarning.

And once you get enough BAB for iterative attacks, there's a simple GP cost enhancement that will make the crossbow allow iterative attacks without burning a feat on it.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 12:25 AM
So just sit back and if needed pop out a bolt or two?

I mean in general im playing with 4 other people...a druid/ranger...Fighter/Barbarian...Cleric....Wizard


Im hoping that my power to transfer spells will allow me to make thier items rather wicked and just sit back and not have to waste much but gain exp and loot. Im not building this to run in and slaughter everything...more of a character built for the purpose of finding magical items studying them cloning them..transfering magics..and earning massive income.

For attacks..the crossbow doesnt seem that bad of an idea to make my opponent hurt if its needed.

Im thinking I might just craft wands and do dmg that way if really needed.

Reluctance
2010-03-30, 12:38 AM
Let me strongly suggest at least a couple of combat-ready constructs. It's one thing to say "I don't want to fight" on a message board. It's another to sit twiddling your thumbs at the table. Items of invisibility, dimension door, etc. to keep your character from getting beat up too badly, then your character can focus on buffs while your pets allow you the thrill of rolling and mauling enemies. But that's a very different build from the guy who makes things go boom.

Also, it's not cheesy when you want to offload the crafting time to someone else. Dedicated wrights are not the problem. The problem with taking Leadership to get crafters is that you're asking them to burn their own XP and WBL to make stuff for you. When you try to pawn off all the costs in the pursuit of free swag, that's when any decent DM puts his foot down.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 12:42 AM
ahhh understood...can you explain the i make constructs go rawr build? that sounds better fitting to what I plan..I still want the same idea just dont want to be in the fray myself...ya know?

Lycanthromancer
2010-03-30, 01:13 AM
Make him a frivolous, overweight CN Middle-Aged dwarven artificer, who dresses in blood-dyed leathers, has Leadership for a bunch of dwarven crafter followers (mostly for mundane alchemical and mechanical items), who rides around in a flying sled led by nine small fiendish deer.

Make all sorts of deadly items, and gladly give them to strangers with creepy overtones of purported 'cheer', while constantly partaking of whiskey-spiked eggnog. Have your followers work on toys of all sorts, and have them work for your "nonprofit organization" (ie, a front for your criminal activities), giving most of your less useful (but quite dangerous) items to the poor and needy children, while getting your funds from your adventures and from wealthy financial backers amongst the nobility.

Then, one night a year, go on a Persisted time stopped rampage, breaking into houses, stealing food, and leaving cheap plastic wooden trinkets from your Type IV bag of holding in exchange. Adults will cringe as the dreaded night draws near, and children will lie awake, their heartbeats fluttering as your Rosebud sled damages the rooftops.

The dreaded Satan Claws is coming to town.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 01:16 AM
very intriguing...but yes...something along that line..of course without losing profit...because that is generally bad.

Lycanthromancer
2010-03-30, 01:18 AM
very intriguing...but yes...something along that line..of course without losing profit...because that is generally bad.The nonprofit organization you run is just a front for your illegal racketeering activities.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 01:20 AM
Oh...what might I be traffiking?

Optimator
2010-03-30, 01:57 AM
Get a jar of Quintessence so you can store a bunch of wands with the Metamagic Item infusion pre-cast on them!

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 01:58 AM
Where might said item be found at?

Also any other ideas on making this character fun/powerful?

shadow_archmagi
2010-03-30, 06:08 AM
You take the metamagic feat, then you use the Artificer's metamagic spell trigger ability to apply the metamagic feat to the wand. It uses up X+1 number of charges thought, where X is equal to the spell levels that the metamagic feat would add.

Artificers can do that, yes.

But what I was referring to was the infusion "Metamagic Item." It's a third level infusion.

http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.5Index-Infusions-Artificer.pdf

It allows you to apply metamagic WITHOUT spending extra charges.

Lycanthromancer
2010-03-30, 09:10 AM
Where might said item be found at?

Also any other ideas on making this character fun/powerful?Quintessence (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/quintessence.htm) is in the SRD. It costs the same per ounce as the casting of a 4th level spell (manifester level [7 or greater] * 40 gp). This should be about enough needed to coat a single wand.

You can't make it yourself unless you're a psionic artificer (from Magic of Eberron, and is more or less the same as the normal artificer, except it can make items of powers AND spells...via the spell-to-power erudite alternate class feature (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070629a), but that'll probably get you bushwhacked by your DM).

Warforged are likely your absolute best bet (see Races of Eberron for alternate class features, though they're still better by default), power-wise, but that may not be the droid flavor you're looking for.

There are easy ways to get infinite gp and xp for crafting, but those would result in head trauma for sure.

But generally, narrow your focus on how you want to play, which should increase your fun quotient by allowing you to focus...well...on how you'll play.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 01:59 PM
Ill look into the whole metamagic thing...now how does one make the group of constructs to fight for oneself? does it require special feats? or just the same character idea but pop out some constructs to kill things for me?

The Shadowmind
2010-03-30, 02:36 PM
Craft Construct feat, while can be taken as one of the artificer's bonus feats.

Improve Homunculus, to improve the Homunculuses you craft as well, they then to be poor on the cost:benefit ratio.

:Link to the artificer's handbook: (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=5929.0)

There was a list on good and bad contructs on Gleemax, but I can't find the link, maybe someone has it if it is still around.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 02:58 PM
Ok thanks..ill waste my last feat choice on craft construct...unless I already got it.

But improved might have to wait till another level unless I can find a feat to give up.

Lycanthromancer
2010-03-30, 11:41 PM
See, your artificer could inspire love and fear and loathing.

Kinda like this, actually. (http://www.housepetscomic.com/2008/12/01/a-reverent-respect/)

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-30, 11:45 PM
See, your artificer could inspire love and fear and loathing.

Kinda like this, actually. (http://www.housepetscomic.com/2008/12/01/a-reverent-respect/)


So what your saying is that im Santa Claws?

Moved the character more towards the homunculus thing and still keeping the craft feats...so now I have minions to do my dirty work..missing the improved one though for now.

Endarire
2010-03-31, 01:00 AM
As an Artificer, your primary job is to outfit your party. Sometimes sad, often true.

In combat, you can mimic a Wizard who blasts or makes black tentacles appear from nowhere. You can summon, buff, and rearrange the battlefield with benign transposition, dimension step, et al.

You can mimic a Cleric with cure light wounds or lesser vigor wands, but healing is mostly a non-combat activity.

Craft or buy an item (like a whistle) to cast summon monster at a viable level. This way you can always have some offense or utility handy.

TripperdeCleric
2010-03-31, 01:03 AM
Have two constructs right now....Im planning to use wands as an offense...and the outfitting is not an issue heh.

Aharon
2010-03-31, 11:17 AM
You will mainly use spells from wands.
But there is one amazing infusion: Spell Storing Item. It's a first level infusion that costs CL*Spell Level XP and creates a wand with 1 charge that lasts for 1 hour/level.

The great thing? There is an even more amazing infusion, Concurrent infusions (from Magic of Eberron). It's a fourth level infusion that lets you apply the effects of three different first level infusions to an item. Effects exclude components... even XP components. This means amazing flexibility - there are many utility spells you don't want to spend 10500 gp + 840 XP on, but which are needed from time to time. It's especially useful if there are no other casters in the group/the other casters have limited spell lists.

My favorite combination is Personal Weapon Augmentation (Eager) / Skill enhancement (Use Magic Device) / Spell Storing Item (Spell Fangs)
afterwards using Metamatic Item (Persistent Spell) on it.
Spell Fangs is an upgraded version of Toothed Tentacle (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20050202a&page=3) that creates 1d6+2 tentacles; you gain the damage they deal as temporary HP.

But I also used it to get a persistent Glibness (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/glibness.htm) and a Dominate Person (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/dominatePerson.htm).
Depending on how powerful you want to be/your DM allows for, you might want to use spells from the Trapsmith (Dungeonscape) or Ur-Priest (Complete Divine) Spell list for reduced costs for your wands.