PDA

View Full Version : Fists of Hextor



Achernar
2010-03-30, 11:24 AM
Hello, Ladies and Gents. I'm Achernar, new to this board and kinda new to DM'ing. I have been running a campaign for about 6 months now (with frequent interruption :smallsigh:) which involves several evil factions and the heroes eventually meeting up with a good faction to oppose them. Among the evil (or at least neutral-self-serving)factions is the Church of Hextor, which is integral to the local government. As a flavor issue, the Church fields martially-oriented clerics and mages as part of its inquistorial squads, as well as Fists of Hextor (Sword and Fist, 3rd edition) for its beefy-not-brainy half.

The probelm:This PrC kinda failed its test drive. My party (a generalist wizard, a binder and an illusonist (the druid, cleric and warmage were preoccupied), was able to maul a level 7 Fist at level 5 each, leading me to ask: is there something better (read: more interesting for a group of loony mages to harass) that the Church could use as its muscle while staying in a martial or divine character?

The Fist class has a times/day cause fear effect and a times/day bull's strength feature, and not much else of note. Is there a way I could make them a little more fun or flavorful. I swear, single-class fighters could be more interesting.

Thanks for the input, guys.

arguskos
2010-03-30, 11:31 AM
My suggestion: use Ordained Champion, from Complete Champion. It's a martially oriented prestige class for clerics, and is rather good to boot.

cupkeyk
2010-03-30, 11:32 AM
A fist of Hextor is a melee guy, he's fighting three spellcasters. LOLz. He doesn't stand a chance. A clericzilla might stand a chance. Your players are fairly well optimized. Pitting them against standard baddies will mean a very one sided and predictable outcome.

marjan
2010-03-30, 11:34 AM
Would help greatly if you tell us what tactics your party is usually using. Without more info I can suggest Ordained Champion from (CC), or some of Martial Adepts from ToB.

senrath
2010-03-30, 11:40 AM
You can try and give them more powers that are in line with Hextor. Also, 3 level 5 fighters probably could've taken on a single level 7 Fist. Try throwing a small squad of Fists at them (around 5 or 6. Maybe more.), and see if that makes a difference.

Telonius
2010-03-30, 11:45 AM
Even something as relatively simple as an evil Knight (that's the Knight class) who happens to worship Hextor could work. One Knight with caster support can do really nasty things to opponents with a lot of casters, if the opponents fail their save against Test of Mettle.

arguskos
2010-03-30, 11:47 AM
I could see a Knight 6, a Cleric 4/Ordained Champion 3, a couple of Cleric 5s, and some Fighter 3s or so being a pretty scary encounter, actually. Use lots of disabling spells and let the Knight and Ordained Champion just dominate.

Achernar
2010-03-30, 12:11 PM
Would help greatly if you tell us what tactics your party is usually using. Without more info I can suggest Ordained Champion from (CC), or some of Martial Adepts from ToB.

The Generalist prefers summons and esoteric spells, while the binder is completely unpredictable (it so happened that that day he could summon 2d6 lightning bolts from the sky) and the illusionist typically distracts people with false summoned monsters and people.

This particular ham-fisted hextorite took mostly electric damage that day, but almost KO'd the binder. He was an adequate challenge, but mostly boring and "oh-crud-we-have-no-melee" kind of scary. His built-in character flaw was a rigid following SOP for people who attack his men, and a short temper.

Ordained champion looks interesting. I will be retiring the fighter classed for clerics in the future. Thanks, guys!

arguskos
2010-03-30, 12:19 PM
The Generalist prefers summons and esoteric spells, while the binder is completely unpredictable (it so happened that that day he could summon 2d6 lightning bolts from the sky) and the illusionist typically distracts people with false summoned monsters and people.

This particular ham-fisted hextorite took mostly electric damage that day, but almost KO'd the binder. He was an adequate challenge, but mostly boring and "oh-crud-we-have-no-melee" kind of scary. His built-in character flaw was a rigid following SOP for people who attack his men, and a short temper.

Ordained champion looks interesting. I will be retiring the fighter classed for clerics in the future. Thanks, guys!
Yeah, Focalor can really ruin your day, he's a damn nice vestige. Ordained Champion is probably your best bet, with Knights (PHB 2) and Fighters as the front liners.

Evard
2010-03-30, 01:07 PM
Put in a few casters that all they do is counter-spell which there are a few feats for on crystalkeep.com that will help them be absolutely evil about it XD

Knight + a few counter-spell casters + a few mooks and there you go :D

Achernar
2010-04-02, 10:07 PM
OK, so having looked over the Ordained Champion (excellent fit for the world, BTW!), I have been tinkering with a few formulas for building them. I am thinking perhaps using Crusader (Stone Dragon Discipline) as the base class for the build. Maybe Cleric 2 Crusader 3 Ordained Champion X, and then continue with half Cru, half Clr? Would it be better to focus as one or the other?

The characters will be level 8 before their next encounter with the Hextorians, if that helps.

Thanks for the advice, guys! :smallbiggrin:

Eldariel
2010-04-02, 10:10 PM
OK, so having looked over the Ordained Champion (excellent fit for the world, BTW!), I have been tinkering with a few formulas for building them. I am thinking perhaps using Crusader (Stone Dragon Discipline) as the base class for the build. Maybe Cleric 2 Crusader 3 Ordained Champion X, and then continue with half Cru, half Clr? Would it be better to focus as one or the other?

The characters will be level 8 before their next encounter with the Hextorians, if that helps.

Thanks for the advice, guys! :smallbiggrin:

Ordained Champion is designed for a straight Cleric. Check the entry prerequisites - Cleric 4 can enter! So...yeah. Crusader 1/Cleric 3 or plain Cleric 4. Besides, many of their abilities draw upon spellcasting to empower the melee combat. Though of course, Cleric 1/Crusader 3 is just fine too, I do think Cleric 4 will suit you the best.

Runestar
2010-04-02, 10:38 PM
One problem could be that he lacks spellcaster support and loses out on action economy. Since your party consists primarily of spellcasters, his tactics should reflect that.

I am thinking of crusader8/warblade1 as a base. Stance active is thicket of blades, so they provoke AoOs even when making 5-ft moves. You may want a reach weapon such as a spinning sword (essentially a 1-handed spiked chain; secrets of sarlona), plus mage slayer so they cannot cast defensively. Warblade lets you nab those diamond mind save boosters, crucial when you need to make a will or fort save. There is also that tactical feat which lets you make a free attack right before you die.

Then maybe give him 1-2 lower lv spellcasters for buff/counterspelling/debuffing.

Achernar
2010-04-03, 09:05 AM
A one-handed reach weapon?! Could it be? (I've been looking for one for a while, for Phalanx fighting styles.)

I really don't want a TPK, I just want to force them to cast defensively or deal with spell resistance, and basically have checks that they can blow or succeed at. It is a little more interesting when not every wave of the fingers (ie warmage) results in 30 fire damage.

I will post back with some builds soon, if you would like to critique them.

archon_huskie
2010-04-03, 10:28 AM
Couldn't you just give the Fists of Hextor some spell resistance items?

Eldariel
2010-04-03, 10:57 AM
A one-handed reach weapon?! Could it be? (I've been looking for one for a while, for Phalanx fighting styles.)

There's one in DMG too; Kusari-Gama in the Asian weapons. Both are Exotic, mind you, but they're there.