Dashing Swordsman quips vs The Big Blue Dragonblood

[fishguy]

How will Elan manage to be effective in combat against this big baddy? A steady stream of clever quips of course, but about what? Playing on his blue hide? Lightning breath weapon? Ridiculously oversized mace which is obviously compensating for some anatomical shortcoming?

[Ferrous]

What I hope for (though unlikely to happen):

V casts "heroism" on Elan and he bursts into song again. Lord knows there are quite a few songs dealing with being blue that could be punned up.

(reference: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0684.html)

[SaintRidley]

blue puns, dragon puns.

combining them.

"Why so blue, dragon? Is it because I'm stabbing you?"

[Optimystik]

V casts "heroism" on Elan

Gonna go with a no on that one.

(Not that I understood the value of casting Heroism with a Bard around to begin with...)

[Ferrous]

Gonna go with a no on that one.

(Not that I understood the value of casting Heroism with a Bard around to begin with...)

I was merely pointing out that it was done before to great effect (as far as Elan's abilities are worth, at any rate).

[fishguy]

What I hope for (though unlikely to happen):

V casts "heroism" on Elan and he bursts into song again. Lord knows there are quite a few songs dealing with being blue that could be punned up.

(reference: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0684.html)

V likely can't cast heroism at this point as it requires a somatic component.

[RiOrius]

I was merely pointing out that it was done before to great effect (as far as Elan's abilities are worth, at any rate).

He wasn't singing due to the Heroism. He was singing because he was fighting giant beetle-like humanoids (and the songs he was singing were all based on Beatles songs).

[Ferrous]

He wasn't singing due to the Heroism. He was singing because he was fighting giant beetle-like humanoids (and the songs he was singing were all based on Beatles songs).

And the lyrics were all puns. It was my (perhaps mistaken) notion that his ability to tie in his puns to his singing (songs by a group which in itself was a pun on the situation) was an effect of the heroism buff.

[Draconi Redfir]

puns/quotes regarding the "Blue Dragon" TV/vidio game serise?


"hey dragon! if your the shadow, were's the rest of you!?"

[Optimystik]

V likely can't cast heroism at this point as it requires a somatic component.

This is what I was referring to when I said "no." You can't use somatic components if you can't move.

And the reason I said Heroism is a bad choice with a bard around, is because it gives a morale bonus - just like bardsong does. They don't stack.

[derfenrirwolv]

i hope this fight doesn't drag on
Are they paying you scale?
This puts you on the horns of a dilemma
This battle is electrifying
Don't be blue i'm stabbing you
Fighting on a wing and a prayer
Glad there's only one of you and not a hoard
let me tell you the tale of the dragon stabbed in the tail.
Did you have to claw your way to this position?



Mace is illegal in this city!

[derfenrirwolv]

And the lyrics were all puns. It was my (perhaps mistaken) notion that his ability to tie in his puns to his singing (songs by a group which in itself was a pun on the situation) was an effect of the heroism buff.

The dashing swordsman's ability to substitute charisma for str on attack rolls requires that the swordsman make a pun when he does so (as explained just before the montauge training sequence.. not in any book, because the dashing swordsman is somethingoots specific)

[Conuly]

And the lyrics were all puns. It was my (perhaps mistaken) notion that his ability to tie in his puns to his singing (songs by a group which in itself was a pun on the situation) was an effect of the heroism buff.

I think that Elan just stumbled upon one of the few ways in which he's awesome.

[B.I.T.T.]

Any guess as to whatever puns Elan might make towards the flying blue things would undoubtedly be left out of the final version of the strip in question. And since my suggestions would be so funny that Redcloak in one of his worse moods would still find himself giggling quiet a bit, I think it behooves all of us that I not voice them in this forum.

...and if you believe that over a more reasonable answer such at "B.I.T.T. has no clue." then I have a bridge in New York to sell you. :smallbiggrin:

[Darakonis]

To the tune of I'm Blue-Eiffel 65 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWmF_2u-9nk#t=1m24s):

You shot my friend V with a blue arrow.
Blue is the color of the vest that I wear.
In Azure city all the homes are blue.
I have a girlfriend, and she saved me from you.

You're blue, you shot V now you'll die, you shot V now you'll die, you shot V now you'll die, you shot V now you'll die...

Peace,
-Darakonis

[Maximum Zersk]

I'll tell you what:

Dragonforce.

[wrybread]

To the tune of I'm Blue-Eiffel 65 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWmF_2u-9nk#t=1m24s):

You shot my friend V with a blue arrow.
Blue is the color of the vest that I wear.
In Azure city all the homes are blue.
I have a girlfriend, and she saved me from you.

You're blue, you shot V now you'll die, you shot V now you'll die, you shot V now you'll die, you shot V now you'll die...

Peace,
-Darakonis

That. Was. Brilliant. Unfortunately I don't think there's any way Rich'll be able to top that so I'm guessing Elan won't say anything to the half-dragon dude. Although it would be kind of amusing if he dropped a reference to having only seen a blue dragon before on the OOTS Adventure Game Box.

[Dr.Epic]

For some reason I'm thinking Trogdor because the dragon is kind of a dragon-man (half-dragon, he's using weapons designed by people and is humanoid)

Maybe something from How to Train Your Dragon as well

[Forever Curious]

For some reason I'm thinking Trogdor because the dragon is kind of a dragon-man (half-dragon, he's using weapons designed by people and is humanoid)

Maybe something from How to Train Your Dragon as well

Well...he was just a dragon...

But he was still TROGDOR!

...yeah, that.

[Dr.Epic]

Well...he was just a dragon...

But he was still TROGDOR!

...yeah, that.

Burninating the countryside!

[Draconi Redfir]

Burninating the countryside!


urge... to post... next verse... overwhelming!!!


Burninaiting all the pepoles!!

[TVTMaster]

Burninating the peasants!

...Um. Anyway, yeah, Elan really doesn't stand a chance, but we're more likely to see Roy, Durkon or Belkar come in sometime soon, likely after someone is kidnapped/knocked out/about to be killed. Big dramatic entrance with perfect timing- heck, Elan will probably be expecting something like that.

[Vinyadan]

Lord Banjo will save the day.

Otherwise, they're screwed.

[Souhiro]

Man, I don't worry about the blue dragonBlood with the mace. I worry about the Green dragonBlood with a bow and poisoned arrows, that hide under blue's wing

[Draconi Redfir]

maby this is how belkar dies? unlikely though.


i think that as this point, eavry fight we see, wether big or small, pepole will be wondering if its the one that kills Belkar XD

[Dr.Epic]

Burninating the peasants!.

BURNINATING ALL THE PEOPLE!
IN THEIR THATCHED-ROOF COTTAGES!
THATCHED-ROOF COTTAGES!

[Lycan 01]

AND THE TROGDOR COMES IN THE NIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT!!! :cool:

[Mr. Scaly]

They'll be dragon you home in a box when I'm done with you!

I'll finish this quick. Wouldn't want it to dragon!

Yeesh, the encounters here just keep scaling up!

Um...what else?

[fishguy]

Elan turns out to be completly non-effective against the big blue... except perhaps as a handy dandy dam-wow...

[SoC175]

Elan turns out to be completly non-effective against the big blue... except perhaps as a handy dandy dam-wow... He scored a couple of hits, so he wasn't ineffective. He was just completely outmatched.

[krossbow]

have to admit, the blue dragon's utter ownage of Elan's puns was completely and utterly awesome. I like Elan, and i root for him, but dang. Dropping him flat and basically saying "you fight like a girl" was the best comeback ever.

[fishguy]

OUCH!! oddly defective Elan gets crunched like a cracker.

[Alvrick]

See? This is why I love half-dragons

[Da'Shain]

The guy's a giant high-AC high-AB high-STR tank. There's not much that Elan by himself can do against him at the best of times, let alone caught relatively off-guard by an ambush.

Seriously, he does what, a max of 15 damage per attack, 30 on a crit? If this guy is anywhere near their level, he's going to barely feel that as a fighter or barbarian or w/e close-combat class he is. On the other hand, the Half-Dragon's going to have a massive STR modifier and almost certainly Power Attack, and Elan's AC has to be massively suboptimal without armor (although he might get a CHA bonus to armor to or something, we don't know).

[Alvrick]

The guy's a giant high-AC high-AB high-STR tank. There's not much that Elan by himself can do against him at the best of times, let alone caught relatively off-guard by an ambush.

Seriously, he does what, a max of 15 damage per attack, 30 on a crit? If this guy is anywhere near their level, he's going to barely feel that as a fighter or barbarian or w/e close-combat class he is. On the other hand, the Half-Dragon's going to have a massive STR modifier and almost certainly Power Attack, and Elan's AC has to be massively suboptimal without armor (although he might get a CHA bonus to armor to or something, we don't know).

definitely. d6 HD, moderate constitution and a +4 bonus to armor doesn't quite compare to d10 or d12 HD, likely magically amped up full-plate a ton of constitution from race as well as stats in general, plus high high strength. we know who is going to win if they are even around the same level

[fishguy]

I hope Elan gets a chance to show big blue how powerful his puns can be during the inevitable rescue/revenge scene

[Scarlet Knight]

As Elan found out against the skags, the Dashing Swordsman's pun ability is directly proportional to the intellengence of the opponent. Big Blue is simply immune due to ...stupidity...:smallsmile:

[fishguy]

As Elan found out against the skags, the Dashing Swordsman's pun ability is directly proportional to the intellengence of the opponent. Big Blue is simply immune due to ...stupidity...:smallsmile:

This made me think of an interesting question, would stupidity (as opposed to non-intelligence... like a 6 Int. rather than a 0 or 1) imbue the moron with absolute immunity or rather just a form of resistance? If Elan could come up with quips that were low-brow enough to register even (or especially) to a moron would he then regain his "strangely effective" status against that low intelligence opponent?

[derfenrirwolv]

against a foe with an int of 4 elan would simply have to dumb down his puns.

Quote Hinjo: The gods save us all.

[Darakonis]

I find it funny how Elan needs to dumb down his puns. Elan actually needs to simplify something so others can understand. Elan.

I'm not convinced that he understands his own puns :smalltongue:

Peace,
Darakonis

[Level20Commoner]

Fret not, Elan fans! I have it on good authority that the next level of the Dashing Swordsman prestige class grants the "Unearthly Grace" and "Unholy Toughness" special qualities. That would, I mean will make Elan much more formidable in future melees.

In this particular encounter, Elan's attempt at being competent in a fight was foiled. That half-dragon blue right up to the Oots team without even offering them an ultimacetum for their immediate surrender. That half-dragon was pound-for-pound the better fighter. Elan did not make a good impression to the others regarding his increased competence. He tried to punish the half-dragon with his new fighting style, but his humor fell flat.

What a fun topic. :smallsmile:

[Tara]

The big guy looks like the type who prefers coarse humor to me. That's right, if he's to defeat his foe, Elan must work blue.

[Scarlet Knight]

against a foe with an int of 4 elan would simply have to dumb down his puns.

Quote Hinjo: The gods save us all.

Elan : "You know, you're my turd opponent where I've had to lower my puns..."
Big Blue: "Heh, heh. He said turd !"

:smallyuk:

[Snake-Aes]

One of the finer hypothesis is that, akin to Tasha's Hideous Laughter, differences in creature type/race/culture gives the victim bonuses to resist. Since the quips stem from a similar idea, it makes sense it applies like that. See that the ones that were immune to his quips so far were from different races.

[SoC175]

As Elan found out against the skags, the Dashing Swordsman's pun ability is directly proportional to the intellengence of the opponent. Big Blue is simply immune due to ...stupidity...:smallsmile: I don't think so. The fact that Elan scored two good hits against such an high-AC-monster says that his puns were as effective as they can be. His opponent just had to much hp that it would have mattered and a too high attack-/damage-bonus that Elan could cherry tap him to death.

[fishguy]

I don't think so. The fact that Elan scored two good hits against such an high-AC-monster says that his puns were as effective as they can be. His opponent just had to much hp that it would have mattered and a too high attack-/damage-bonus that Elan could cherry tap him to death.

But do we know that he the hits he got were "good" ones? We see two scratches, but it is hard to tell if the ~+6 charisma bonus to damage from the dashing swordsman class applied.

[Anitar]

I'll tell you what:

Dragonforce.

I can't even come close to expressing sufficient support for this.

[SoC175]

But do we know that he the hits he got were "good" ones? We see two scratches, but it is hard to tell if the ~+6 charisma bonus to damage from the dashing swordsman class applied. The fact that he managed to hit at all is a clear indicator that they worked.

[vrellum]

Too bad Elan isn't a good bard. Suggestion could have worked nicely, same with hold monster. Though I like suggestion better. Tell him to go to some location that is far away, he'll be busy for a long time...

If he hadn't messed up (imo) and taken the not-so-great dashing swordsman prc he might have song of discord or mass suggestion. That could have worked out very nicely for Elan and gang.

Fear could've worked too.

Major image might have been used creatively to do some good.

But as a dashing swordsman? Going unbuffed into melee? Well things turned out about right.

[fishguy]

The fact that he managed to hit at all is a clear indicator that they worked.

I think the dashing swordsman bonus is just for damage, not to hit?

[Charmy]

I really enjoyed the artwork for this one, especially the 2nd last panel from Haley's perspective, and the wanted poster .

Nice job Giant! Even now you demonstrate you're continuing to refine and improve your art :)

[Kaytara]

have to admit, the blue dragon's utter ownage of Elan's puns was completely and utterly awesome. I like Elan, and i root for him, but dang. Dropping him flat and basically saying "you fight like a girl" was the best comeback ever.

Damn. Who here now finds themselves imagining the bluescale had said "You fight like a cow" instead? :P

[Reshbj]

Or alternatively, Elan saves the day:

Elan: A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush!
(half-dragon realizes he has hands, and V casts Suggestion again)

[Ancalagon]

Damn. Who here now finds themselves imagining the bluescale had said "You fight like a cow" instead? :P

Actually, I'm still waiting for that. ;)

[Spiky]

But do we know that he the hits he got were "good" ones? We see two scratches, but it is hard to tell if the ~+6 charisma bonus to damage from the dashing swordsman class applied.
Only in a game or comic would 6" sword wounds through armor with enough blood to be seen from dozens of feet away be considered "scratches".

[SoC175]

I think the dashing swordsman bonus is just for damage, not to hit? Well, the whole PRC would suck if you were still unable to hit the broad side of a barn.

He says "among other abilities" it substitutes Cha for Str on damage, the other things just have to include substituting Cha for Str on hit chance, otherwise the other bonus will be almost useless. Julio also says the he has only average Str and Dex, so not even Weapon Finesse would help him to hit with his medium BAB

[Mr. Pin]

Well, the whole PRC would suck if you were still unable to hit the broad side of a barn.

He says "among other abilities" it substitutes Cha for Str on damage, the other things just have to include substituting Cha for Str on hit chance, otherwise the other bonus will be almost useless. Julio also says the he has only average Str and Dex, so not even Weapon Finesse would help him to hit with his medium BAB

I'm sorry, but that's really annoyingly untrue. A +6 to weapon damage at 13-14th level is in no way anywhere near useless, and in fact, it's the opposite; it's so useful that it, in and of itself, turns a not-quite-mediocre melee combatant into a moderately useful one. If you've played 3.5 D&D, you should know that. Keep in mind that it gets doubled on a crit, and that Elan has a 15-20 crit range; the high rolls that he'll need to hit against opponents with good AC will give him an additional 12 damage; that'll probably almost double the damage he's doing. Medium BAB and a reasonable weapon enchantment (+3, wasn't it? Julio mentioned it somewhere) are enough to let a bard hit even heavily armored foes with a little luck; and while we know that Mr. Scoundrél had average Strength and Dex, we know nothing of the sort about Elan. I'd say his dex is quite good, from what we've seen; perhaps a +2.

If you had argued that Elan seemed to hit more when the puns were rolling, I would say that you had a point, but that one interpretation of those "doink!" scenes was that he was getting ineffective or low-damage hits. But you didn't. Instead, you decided to infer that "among other abilities", a quote that I think was meant to encompass the less-important class features, had to include a +6 to attack, because bards are completely unable to hit without ridiculous bonuses, and because it would have been such a burden for The Giant to write "and attack" if he had meant that to be included.

[SoC175]

I'm sorry, but that's really annoyingly untrue. A +6 to weapon damage at 13-14th level is in no way anywhere near useless, and in fact, it's the opposite; it's so useful that it, in and of itself, turns a not-quite-mediocre melee combatant into a moderately useful one. If you never hit a +10 bonus is useless.

If you've played 3.5 D&D, you should know that. Keep in mind that it gets doubled on a crit, and that Elan has a 15-20 crit range An increased crit chance does not incease the auto-hit chance. If you threat range is 15-20 and you miss on a rolled 17 you still miss.

Medium BAB and a reasonable weapon enchantment Won't get you far without an ability mod to back them up.

while we know that Mr. Scoundrél had average Strength and Dex Which would make it impossible for him to make it into any list except of worst 10 swordsmen

because bards are completely unable to hit without ridiculous bonuses, That's not a ridiculous bonus, that's a pretty standard bonus at this level. It's actually a little low already

Starting with a +3, a +2 from level ability increases (4,8,12,16) and a +4 from enhancement to your ability score should make it +9 to hit from ability mod.

Well, we could assume that Elan unlike Julio has a decent Dex and thus uses weapon finesse, but that doesn't explain how Julio ever managed to hit someone to apply his damage bonus

[Ancalagon]

but that doesn't explain how Julio ever managed to hit someone to apply his damage bonus

Just assume Dashing Swordsman lets you add your Cha bonus * 2 and you are there. Point is: the class does "something" and that "something" has something to do with charisma and we know it boosts him to become one of the best fighters around. You don't know WHAT the class does but apparently (Julio entering that list) it must be very, very effective.