[3.x] Uses for move actions

[EpicEvokerElf]

I'm building a dwarf warblade, and I noticed a lot of maneuvers are only a standard action. What can I do with my move actions (besides move, obviously)?

[Runestar]

There are some tactical feats such as clarion commander which let you do something with your move action.

[Eldariel]

I'm building a dwarf warblade, and I noticed a lot of maneuvers are only a standard action. What can I do with my move actions (besides move, obviously)?

Generally, you should be moving; that's the whole point of Standard Action Strikes, you aren't anchored at one point on the battlefield all the time, you can reposition yourself to best protect the squishies, take AoOs and so on every turn.

That said, there's some maneuvers that are move actions (Order Forged from Chaos, for example) and e.g. some items that can be used as move actions (Fearsome armor from Drow of the Underdark makes Intimidate a Move Action, for example).

[Rin_Hunter]

Drink a potion :smallbiggrin:

Sorry.

[Sinfire Titan]

That said, there's some maneuvers that are move actions (Order Forged from Chaos, for example) and e.g. some items that can be used as move actions (Fearsome armor from Drow of the Underdark makes Intimidate a Move Action, for example).


Actually, that's the only maneuver in the entire book that can be used as a Move action.

[PhoenixRivers]

Actually, that's the only maneuver in the entire book that can be used as a Move action.

I do believe one of the Shadow hand teleports is a move action.

[Sinfire Titan]

I do believe one of the Shadow hand teleports is a move action.

Oh, right. Forgot about that one. So two, three tops.

[Runestar]

I do believe one of the Shadow hand teleports is a move action.

Yeah, but that's pretty much the same as moving...:smallbiggrin:


Generally, you should be moving; that's the whole point of Standard Action Strikes, you aren't anchored at one point on the battlefield all the time, you can reposition yourself to best protect the squishies, take AoOs and so on every turn.

Sometimes, you just don't wish to move because you think you can withstand a full attack (and in the case of creatures with only 1 attack, it is no different). :smallsmile:

Warblade in particular, staying adjacent means you are in a position to make a full-attack in the following round (which is part of its refresh mechanic anyways).

[PhoenixRivers]

Yeah, but that's pretty much the same as moving...:smallbiggrin:



Sometimes, you just don't wish to move because you think you can withstand a full attack (and in the case of creatures with only 1 attack, it is no different). :smallsmile:

Warblade in particular, staying adjacent means you are in a position to make a full-attack in the following round (which is part of its refresh mechanic anyways).

That's if you're already in position. In such cases, have a Boost+full attack ready.

Also, if you're a warblade, you won't likely be doing much with shadow hand.

[Runestar]

So is there really so little I can do with a move action besides moving?

I am thinking that it would be a useful compilation to have, to let players make more efficient use of the action economy. :smallsmile:

Oh yes, regaining psionic focus is also a move action with a feat (else, it is normally a full-round action).

[PhoenixRivers]

So is there really so little I can do with a move action besides moving?

I am thinking that it would be a useful compilation to have, to let players make more efficient use of the action economy. :smallsmile:

Oh yes, regaining psionic focus is also a move action with a feat (else, it is normally a full-round action).

That's a useful one. With psionics, there's psionic dimension door, as well, which bypasses threatened squares, and gets past walls.

Alternately, there are several items in the MIC which activate on move actions, and there's drawing weapons/items.

[Thurbane]

Some items in the MIC can be used as a move action:

Bag of Endless Caltrops
Belt of Hidden Pouches
Bolt Shirt
Boots of Swift Passage
Bracers of Dawn
Corsair's Eyepatch
Lesser Weapon Crystal of Return
Silkslick Belt

...also, attaching or removing an augment crystal is a move action.

[Adumbration]

On a tangent, there's also at least one ability in Tome of Magic for a binder that is a move action. Not sure if you can get it with a feat, or actually need the levels.

[Thurbane]

Most of those require at least 5 levels of Binder (most a lot more), and I don't believe any are available through feats alone.

Not so great for this build, but as a general note on what you can do with a move action, good call. :smallsmile:

[Tinydwarfman]

Drink a potion :smallbiggrin:

Sorry.

:smallconfused: This is houserule that I use too, but why sorry?

[Escheton]

maybe because actually getting and drinking a potion without a potionbelt takes longer and leaves you with a potion in hand when you want to use that hand for blocking or hitting stuff

[EpicEvokerElf]

To clarify, I'm heading for Dwarven Defender - rebuilt not to suck as much, hopefully; found in my sig [PEACH?]. I'm not going to be moving a whole lot, likely, especially in Mechanus Gear and with Stone Dragon stances (actually, I don't think I have any of those, because they're not that great - Giant's Stance is worse than a first-level spell, and it's the only one I'd've considered). Anyway. Is there really that little to do with move actions?

[Apollo1776]

To clarify, I'm heading for Dwarven Defender - rebuilt not to suck as much, hopefully; found in my sig [PEACH?]. I'm not going to be moving a whole lot, likely, especially in Mechanus Gear and with Stone Dragon stances (actually, I don't think I have any of those, because they're not that great - Giant's Stance is worse than a first-level spell, and it's the only one I'd've considered). Anyway. Is there really that little to do with move actions?

You can move... Or take a couple more free actions.

[EpicEvokerElf]

You can move... Or take a couple more free actions.
Not particularly helpful, as the OP specifically excludes moving. I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that move actions can be exchanged for free actions (and there's no explicit limit in the SRD for free actions per round unless you're a god). Please back this up.

[Tinydwarfman]

Not particularly helpful, as the OP specifically excludes moving. I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that move actions can be exchanged for free actions (and there's no explicit limit in the SRD for free actions per round unless you're a god). Please back this up.

Wait, gods have a limit on the free actions they can take?

[Apollo1776]

Free actions take up small amounts of time. Doing a large number of free actions will eventually end up with a significant amount of time. So you don't technically have an unlimited amount. The amount is DM-regulated though.

[EpicEvokerElf]

Free actions take up small amounts of time. Doing a large number of free actions will eventually end up with a significant amount of time. So you don't technically have an unlimited amount. The amount is DM-regulated though.
Well, if by 'technically' you mean by RAW, then technically the only beings with limited numbers of free actions per round are deities. Common sense dictates that there ought to be a limit, and suggests that you could take more if you forewent your move action, but neither of these is technically the case.

Wait, gods have a limit on the free actions they can take?
Yep. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineRanksAndPowers.htm#automaticActions)

[Curmudgeon]

You can always check for things you've missed seeing or hearing.
Trying to spot something you failed to see previously is a move action.
Trying to hear something you failed to hear previously is a move action. The first time you have line of sight to something is when you get your one and only reactive (no action) Spot check. After that, you'll never see what you missed* without that move action recheck. Same thing for ongoing sounds: one try only before it's a move action for each Listen recheck.

* - like spell component pouches, sheathed weapons, holy symbols, Bags of Holding, and all sorts of good stuff that you might want to know about/steal/break.

[Lycanthromancer]

Pulling an item from a Heward's handy haversack is a move action.

[NEO|Phyte]

Wait, gods have a limit on the free actions they can take?

It should be noted that said limit is only on a specific set of actions deities get.

[Sophismata]

It should be noted that said limit is only on a specific set of actions deities get.

It is worded in such a way that it is a general limitation to all free actions.

[Angel in Black]

It should be noted that said limit is only on a specific set of actions deities get.

technically not true:


Automatic Actions
When performing an action within its portfolio, a deity can perform any action as a free action, as long as the check DC is equal to or less than the number on the table below. The number of free actions a deity can perform each round is also determined by the deity’s divine rank.

edit: d'oh, ninja'd!

[Boci]

There's a feat that grants concealment with a move action, but it requires perform. The kensai's power surge feature (and I'm guessing the feat equivilant of it) is also a move action.

[EpicEvokerElf]

Which feats would those be?

[Boci]

Crystalkeep has a feat that goes by the same name as the kensai's class feature power surge, but it doesn't contain the details so I do not know exactly what the feat version does.

[Lycanthromancer]

Child of Shadows (a swordsage stance) grants you 20% concealment when you move.

A ring of entropic deflection (MIC) casts entropic shield on you for 1 round when you move (or are moved) 10' or more, resulting in a 20% miss chance for ranged attacks; this increases to 50% if you have a magic item that improves your move speed.

The phase cloak (a soulmeld) makes you go ethereal when you move more than 5' for as long as you actually are, indeed, moving (allowing you to 'fly', as well as pass through walls and creatures).

The Cloak Dance psionic feat (see the SRD or the XPH) grants you 20% concealment with a move action.

A soulknife can charge up his mind blade for a psychic strike.

If you're a spellcaster you can redirect a spell as a move action.

[NEO|Phyte]

The Cloak Dance psionic feat (see the SRD or the XPH) grants you 20% concealment with a move action.

It is NOT a psionic feat, it simply resides in the XPH.

[Curmudgeon]

Always a good idea to check the official WotC online feat index (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/lists/feats) rather than just trust 3rd-party sources. There's no "Power Surge" on the list.

[Thurbane]

Well, if by 'technically' you mean by RAW, then technically the only beings with limited numbers of free actions per round are deities. Common sense dictates that there ought to be a limit, and suggests that you could take more if you forewent your move action, but neither of these is technically the case.

Yep. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineRanksAndPowers.htm#automaticActions)
The rules compendium has this to say:

Free actions consume a very small amount of time and effort. Their impact is so minor that they’re considered free. You can perform one or more free actions during your turn. However, the DM can put reasonable limits on what you can really do for free.
Not much more defined than in the PHB/SRD, but it does call out that a DM can impose a limit. The qualifier "reasonable", however, is ripe for debate.

For instance, you can talk as a free action, but I don't think it would be reasonable to deliver the Gettysburg address mid-combat without impacting on your actions. :smalltongue:

The Cloak Dance psionic feat (see the SRD or the XPH) grants you 20% concealment with a move action.
Now that's a nice one for the OPs build!

[NEO|Phyte]

For instance, you can talk as a free action, but I don't think it would be reasonable to deliver the Gettysburg address mid-combat without impacting on your actions. :smalltongue:


Speak

In general, speaking is a free action that you can perform even when it isn’t your turn. Speaking more than few sentences is generally beyond the limit of a free action.
The rules agree with you.

[Draz74]

Which feats would those be?

The first is Cloak Dance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#cloakDance).

... very much ninja'd. :smallannoyed:

[Thurbane]

The rules agree with you.
:smallbiggrin:

The amount of how much you can say during combat is often a hotly debated topic in my group. To try and speed up our combats, we are trying not to strategize and confer with each other mid-combat as much as we have been. We often get bogged down on someone's turn, particularly a caster, while we theorize about the best action for that turn.

Our new rule is that, barring Telepathic Bond or similar, any tactical advice you give mid-combat is shouted out in front of the enemy. Even then, we try to keep it as quick and simple as possible.

[Boci]

Always a good idea to check the official WotC online feat index (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/lists/feats) rather than just trust 3rd-party sources. There's no "Power Surge" on the list.

According to crystalkeep its from dragon magazine. http://crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.5Index-Feats.pdf page 196, under feats for monsters.

[Lycanthromancer]

It is NOT a psionic feat, it simply resides in the XPH.True. Sorry, I was a bit distracted.

[edit] Take ranks in UMD, get a sparring dummy of the master and use it (adds +5' to 5' steps for monks), a ring of entropic deflection, and the Child of Shadows stance, and get lots of yummy miss chance on your 5' steps.

[Curmudgeon]

According to crystalkeep its from dragon magazine. http://crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.5Index-Feats.pdf page 196, under feats for monsters.
You should have said this previously. # 313 is one of the few Dragon issues I've got.

The feat has nothing in common with the Kensai class ability other than the name. There's no move action involved.

[Saintheart]

Draw a weapon as you move? RAW says you can combine the two. :smallconfused:

[EpicEvokerElf]

Wow, cloak dance would be tasty, but I'm having a hard time figuring out where I'd get 10 ranks in Hide or 5 in Perform (dance) on a dwarf warblade.

[Lycanthromancer]

Wow, cloak dance would be tasty, but I'm having a hard time figuring out where I'd get 10 ranks in Hide or 5 in Perform (dance) on a dwarf warblade.Rename yourself Casanunda, and make it the ever-so-suave Horizontal Polka.

[Thurbane]

http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=6832.0


o Hide

Martial Study (shadow hand) – tome of battle


o Perform

Apprentice (entertainer) - DMG II (also diplomacy)

...pretty feat intensive, though.

Does your DM enforce XP penalties? Maybe a couple level dip into Factotum?

[EpicEvokerElf]

I should probably just give that one up. It would make absolutely no sense for RP.

[Draz74]

I should probably just give that one up. It would make absolutely no sense for RP.

Oh ye who art unwilling to alter your character concept ...

Personally I think a polka-dancing Dwarven Defender sounds pretty epic-awesome. :smallcool:

[Lycanthromancer]

Oh ye who art unwilling to alter your character concept ...

Personally I think a polka-dancing Dwarven Defender sounds pretty epic-awesome. :smallcool:Needs more buckles & swashes.

The ladies dudes* love a guy with a sash (http://rustyandco.com/comic/36/).





*They're dwarves. It's not like you can TELL.

[Draz74]

Needs more buckles & swashes.

I dunno. I've seen guys in lace cravats and swashes dance before. I'm more amused by a gruff guy in oily plate armor doing the polka.

[Lycanthromancer]

I dunno. I've seen guys in lace cravats and swashes dance before. I'm more amused by a gruff guy in oily plate armor doing the polka.More like "greasy," but the armor would only get in the way. And it requires a partner.

[Person_Man]

As Eldariel already mentioned, you can Demoralize an enemy with a Move Action with the right equipment. With a modest investment (Intimidate Skill, Never Outnumbered Skill Trick, and the Imperious Command feat) it can be quite a potent combo (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=911167).

If you get wings somehow (become a Dragonborn - it won't stop you from being a Dwarf), then with the Winged Warrior (RotW) feat you can creates a 20 ft cloud centered on you as a Move Action. Against those within the cloud, you have partial concealment and casters need to make a Concentration check to cast, and against those outside the cloud you have total concealment (and thus no line of site). Very useful if you make a Standard Action Strike and then want to protect yourself from magical and ranged counter attack.

You can use the Goad feat as a Move Action. Useful if you want to protect a friend or set off an AoO combo.

You can use the Combat Panache feat as a Move Action to impose your Cha bonus as a To-Hit penalty against one enemy for attacks against you until the end of the encounter. VERY useful debuff in boss fights if you happen to be a Crusader or other Cha based class.

Some DM's will let you take a second Swift Action as a Move Action, which gives you the option of using another Boost. Similarly, you can use Sleight of Hand as a Free Action (with a -20 penalty) to relieve your opponent of any unattended items (spell component pouch, holy symbol, quiver, magic items, belt, etc). Most DMs will limit this to one or two checks per round - but if you are willing to give yo your Move Action, your DM should give you several more.

Although it's not germane to your build, with the Extraordinary Concentration feat you can maintain Concentration as a Move Action, which keeps some very potent spells going without the need to give up all of your Standard Action every turn.

As a side note, I would say that I generally avoid having more then one or two Standard Action strikes. In most cases, a Full Attack (or a Strike that uses a Full Round Action) deals more damage. And virtually every melee build should make sure that it has sufficient reach (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7081777) and/or Pounce (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103358), so that it can make a full attack almost every round.

[huttj509]

related question:

Can you use multiple maneuvers at once?

For example, in 1 round can you both activate a boost and use a standard action strike?

Can you activate a boost as a swift action, use a move action maneuver, and then use a standard action strike?

[Noodles2375]

If you have any psionic ability, you can take the feat "Psionic Meditation" to become psionically focused. This has a number of relevant uses. For example:

Using Deep Impact or Psionic Strike feats: Expend psi focus to either resolve your next attack as a touch attack or deal +2(4)d6 damage.

Using Psionic Charge: Expend psi focus to make an up to 90 degree turn while charging.

As long as you're psionic focused you can use "Up the Walls" to take any of your movement for the round on walls or ceilings.

Using any metapsionic feat costs your psionic focus.

Not sure if any of these are useful or helpful for a straight warblade though :smalleek:

[Lin Bayaseda]

Improved Feint is pretty good, if you have spare move actions. Enough ranks in Bluff and your enemies are forever devoid of Dex bonus and can be sneak-attacked.

[Person_Man]

related question:

Can you use multiple maneuvers at once?

For example, in 1 round can you both activate a boost and use a standard action strike?

Can you activate a boost as a swift action, use a move action maneuver, and then use a standard action strike?

Yes, as long as you have the each maneuver readied and the relevant action type available, you can use them. For example, you could use Cloak of Deception (Swift Action), Shadow Stride (Move Action), and Hand of Death (Standard Action) in the same round.

Another trick is to use Hustle (which is a Swift Action psionic power that grants you a Move Action) or some similar time bending ability like Celerity, Time Stop, etc.

[Eldariel]

Another trick is to use Hustle (which is a Swift Action psionic power that grants you a Move Action) or some similar time bending ability like Celerity, Time Stop, etc.

It's also available as a martial maneuver in Quicksilver Motion, which converts a Swift Action into a Move Action. Very useful; e.g. my Arena Wildshaper uses that in conjuction with Master of Many Form's Fast Wildshape to Wildshape as a swift action when convenient. Of course, Swift Actions tend to be more precious than Move Actions in high-level arena (even a no-casting/manifesting arena) use due to stuff like Belt of Battle (and Moment of Alacrity & al. even without WRT-self) so it's rarely convenient, but that's neither here nor now.