Half Life 2? Worth the prepackaged virus?

[Forbiddenwar]

I'm not interested in multiplayer FPS, as I die far too quickly in them, but I enjoyed the story and overall game play of the single player game in Half-Life. But I've never gotten Half Life 2 or anything after the first, because it is through Steam and I've heard SO MANY bad things about Steam (And Many Many Lawsuits)

So, is Half Life Two worth the virus(A.K.A. Steam) that comes with it. I don't want a contract or spam or spyware or the inability to uninstall it that Steam (I hear from legal cases) forces on people .

[Dust]

There's going to be lots of replies to follow, so to just sum up everything that's after this post....

"Yes."

[BRC]

I have personally never encountered any problems with Steam. I've had it on multiple computers, all virus free, I don't get spam from it, and I have never heard of anybody having trouble uninstalling it.

The biggest complaint is that, unlike a physical CD, you cannot share games you've beaten with your friends or sell them back.

Also, Half Life 2 is simply incredible.

[Mewtarthio]

I've never received a single unwanted message from Steam. The closest it gets is opening a window advertising its current deals when you start it up.

[chiasaur11]

I've never received a single unwanted message from Steam. The closest it gets is opening a window advertising its current deals when you start it up.

Same. And I want those ads for deals normally. I mean, when X-Com was just five bucks for the whole set?

I needed to know asap. I am a consumer sheep.

Back on topic? Worth it. Even if you hate steam for some reason.

[Kyouhen]

:smallconfused:

I think you may be confusing Steam with another form of DRM, possibly SecuROM. I've been using Steam for years and love it, and as far as I can tell most people are quite pleased with it.

And yes, Half-Life 2 and it's episodes are totally worth it. :smallbiggrin:

[pffh]

I think you're confusing steam with SecuROM.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Um...are we talking about the same program? I've never had any trouble of any kind with Steam, except for the occasional short-term crash that can be expected from any network, up to and including the best maintained servers on the web. Steam doesn't have a contract, and doesn't contain any spyware...a virus scan on my computer (running Steam for more than a year now) reveals nothing problematic at all. I haven't TRIED to uninstall it, but a quick Google search of Steam reveals few problems with uninstalling the program, and all of those are fixed by uninstalling it via the Add/Remove Programs function (apparently a very small percent of people have a glitch where it might corrupt the uninstall file, which is fixed completely by using this alternate method).

That hardly seems like a problem serious enough to make it a poor choice.

If fact, Google shows that the only serious lawsuits Valve and Steam have been involved in are lawsuits against other company's suing Valve over Steam, and losing, as their cases have no real ground.

[Forbiddenwar]

Ah, everyone is right. I was thinking Steam and Securom was the same.:smallredface:

So maybe I should ask, is Spore worth the Securom virus.

[chiasaur11]

Ah, everyone is right. I was thinking Steam and Securom was the same.:smallredface:

So maybe I should ask, is Spore worth the Securom virus.

No. Get it on Steam if you're going to get it.

[Erloas]

A virus would imply that it is doing things it isn't telling you about, won't let you remove it easily, and generally presented as a false front to the unknown task the makers don't want you to know about.

Steam is very straight forward, and it does exactly what it says it does. It provides a marketplace, it keeps track of the games you have purchased through it, it contains a community system, and it provides publishers with a form of copy protection.

Its not like securerom or other some other DRM schemes which install in the background and never tell you that they are there, and can't be removed.

As far as pop-ups, the only pop-up I've ever seen is when you are quiting a steam game it pops up a window that generally shows whatever the newest game they have available or their weekday/weekend sales. Only one, easily closed, nothing fishy about it.

Steam is less of a virus then most drivers you install for things like printers where they automatically install and start up various things without telling you. iTunes is more of a virus with all the other things Apple wants you to run with it and its more restrictive in its use.

[pffh]

Ah, everyone is right. I was thinking Steam and Securom was the same.:smallredface:

So maybe I should ask, is Spore worth the Securom virus.

No. I regret ever buying or installing it. The only fun thing about it is the creature creator and you can get that for free. Hell you can recreate most of it (only better) by fiddling with the creature creator and then play populous, civilization and galactic civilization.

[Forbiddenwar]

I understand Imy confusion now. I heard of several lawsuits regarding the game "Spore" and I heard the Steam was the system that provided Spore. Now I understand that Steam was not the system that led to the lawsuits, and generally, it is a good system. So, knowing that, I think I will try SPore, I'll difintely buy Half Life 2, and maybe I'll check out Penny Arcade's game series as well.
Thank-you for all your help

(End Thread)

[xp194]

In Terms of DRM, I would point Steam as being one of the best on the market. I mean, it also functions as a shop, a menu to launch all your games from, a community... need I go on?

And the deals, man, the DEALS. Every Midweek and Weekend prices on a product get cut. For example, right now Classic AvP is half price, from $4 to $2.

And Also Half Life 2 is one of the Greatest Games ever. THERE IS NOTHING BAD ABOUT THIS PACKAGE. :smallbiggrin:

[chiasaur11]

In Terms of DRM, I would point Steam as being one of the best on the market. I mean, it also functions as a shop, a menu to launch all your games from, a community... need I go on?

And the deals, man, the DEALS. Every Midweek and Weekend prices on a product get cut. For example, right now Classic AvP is half price, from $4 to $2.

And Also Half Life 2 is one of the Greatest Games ever. THERE IS NOTHING BAD ABOUT THIS PACKAGE. :smallbiggrin:

Yes there is.

It doesn't have Portal, TF2, or the episodes.

Wait. What's that? "Orange.... Box"?

Get that. Don't repeat my mistakes.

[Kyouhen]

Actually I think Steam's version of Spore also has SecuROM. Make sure you check the system requirements to be safe.

[pffh]

Actually I think Steam's version of Spore also has SecuROM. Make sure you check the system requirements to be safe.

Yeah I'm pretty sure ALL versions of games that have secuROM also have secuROM on steam even if steam makes it redundant.

[Dogmantra]

Get that. Don't repeat my mistakes.

Or mine where I bought Portal & TF2 twice.

That was great.

[Kyouhen]

Yeah I'm pretty sure ALL versions of games that have secuROM also have secuROM on steam even if steam makes it redundant.

The good news is Steam is good for making a note about it in large bold letters.

[ObadiahtheSlim]

There are only 2 downsides to steam. The previously mentioned inability to resell/return your games is one.

If you have limited internet connectivity, you can have issues playing your games. While you can store your login credentials and load the game in offline mode, it has been known to cause problems. I've heard of some people who were unable to use off line mode. Plus if your credentials expire and you have no connectivity, you will be unable to play your game unless you can log back into the steam servers. Also if you have limited bandwidth and start patching while logged in, your game can be stuck in an unplayable state until that patch finishes downloading.

As for is HL2 worth it? It's a bit dated now, paticularly the graphics. However it is still very fun. It has a fairly solid AI. Your enemy will try to flank you and lay down suppressing fire. I very rarely found myself cursing them NPCs for being "pants-on-head retarded." Unlike other games out there.

[chiasaur11]

There are only 2 downsides to steam. The previously mentioned inability to resell/return your games is one.

If you have limited internet connectivity, you can have issues playing your games. While you can store your login credentials and load the game in offline mode, it has been known to cause problems. I've heard of some people who were unable to use off line mode. Plus if your credentials expire and you have no connectivity, you will be unable to play your game unless you can log back into the steam servers. Also if you have limited bandwidth and start patching while logged in, your game can be stuck in an unplayable state until that patch finishes downloading.

As for is HL2 worth it? It's a bit dated now, paticularly the graphics. However it is still very fun. It has a fairly solid AI. Your enemy will try to flank you and lay down suppressing fire. I very rarely found myself cursing them NPCs for being "pants-on-head retarded." Unlike other games out there.

Yup. Give them the right opportunities, the AI feels danged smart. Flanking, distracting, swapping weapons for one they saw earlier, timing to hammer the player when he's reloading. All the tricks.

[xp194]

Yup. Give them the right opportunities, the AI feels danged smart. Flanking, distracting, swapping weapons for one they saw earlier, timing to hammer the player when he's reloading. All the tricks.

Throwing grenades while the player is taking cover... sadly for them, the Gravity Gun turns that idea from 'Smart' into 'Really Really Bad Idea'

[DaedalusMkV]

Yeah, even though I hate Steam with a passion for not letting me play games on occasion and generally being a slow, unreliable piece of crap <Got slightly better a few patches back, but it still sometimes takes me hours of fiddling and anger to be able to run one of my games. Better than days of "we're aware of certain issues and working to correct them", though.>, I'd say it's worth it. 90% of the gaming community don't seem to have the same staggering issues with Steam that I do, and the Orange Box is among the best value game packages I've ever bought. I've played through HL2 at least four times, EP1 and EP2 twice each and Portal a further three times. Call it... 55, 60 hours well spent? All on single-player goodness. So yeah, worth it.

[Forbiddenwar]

As for is HL2 worth it? It's a bit dated now, paticularly the graphics.

Dated just means I can afford it now! :smallbiggrin:

[shadow_archmagi]

Never uninstalled Steam


I have. It's really, really easy and produces no ill effects.

Well, besides the catastrophically negative effect of NOT HAVING STEAM INSTALLED

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Well, besides the catastrophically negative effect of NOT HAVING STEAM INSTALLED

I hear the next update fixes this glaring problem. Uninstalling Steam will now immediately link you to a site where you can reinstall Steam, to prevent lawsuits resulting in Steam patrons demanding a faster way to re-install the program after their mistake.

[SolkaTruesilver]

I hear the next update fixes this glaring problem. Uninstalling Steam will now immediately link you to a site where you can reinstall Steam, to prevent lawsuits resulting in Steam patrons demanding a faster way to re-install the program after their mistake.

Wait, what? :smallconfused:

[chiasaur11]

Wait, what? :smallconfused:

It's a joke, son.

[deuxhero]

Half Life 2 wasn't that good IMO. The episodes however are worth playing for the commentary, and Portal is just fun. Buy the orange box.

[shadow_archmagi]

Was it pants-carping good? Maybe for some.

I admit that a lot of fanboys rave about it as a hallmark of gametory experience and a template against which all games ever should be based.

I personally found it to be quite enjoyable and well worth the amount of money I spent on it.

[spectralphoenix]

Was it pants-carping good? Maybe for some.

That wasn't a fish, I was just happy to see the Havok physics engine!

[Vitruviansquid]

... Frankly, I found HL2 to be a mediocre shooter, a bad puzzler, and a downright abominable driver. >_>

[SolkaTruesilver]

... Frankly, I found HL2 to be a mediocre shooter, a bad puzzler, and a downright abominable driver. >_>

:smallconfused:

.........
.......
......


....


BURN HIM!!! :smallfurious:

[ObadiahtheSlim]

Remember when I said dated? Yeah the puzzles were pretty ground breaking when it first came out. Nobody had physics based puzzles.

[RS14]

In Terms of DRM, I would point Steam as being one of the best on the market. I mean, it also functions as a shop, a menu to launch all your games from, a community... need I go on?


It is still DRM. Your games will vanish with the servers in a few years.

No, it's not worth it, as far as I'm concerned. I declined to buy (or pirate--I have principles) Portal for this reason.

[chiasaur11]

It is still DRM. Your games will vanish with the servers in a few years.

No, it's not worth it, as far as I'm concerned. I declined to buy (or pirate--I have principles) Portal for this reason.

Valve promised to remove DRM in the (unlikely) event Steam ceases to exist.

And from Valve, I trust it. Most companies, though, I wouldn't.

[Kyouhen]

Valve promised to remove DRM in the (unlikely) event Steam ceases to exist.

And from Valve, I trust it. Most companies, though, I wouldn't.

To be fair though, in the end all we have is their word on the topic. And this is assuming they don't end up bought up or another person takes the lead or any number of other situations.

[Jibar]

It is still DRM. Your games will vanish with the servers in a few years.

Steam? Vanish.

HA!

It's only recently other companies have noticed that Valve now controls PC gaming, and they've all failed with their respective digital distributions. They took too long to make a move and it was too late; Valve is entrenched so deep in their Steam bunker nothing short of a nuclear bomb could set them back. And that's not a metaphor. An honest to God nuclear bomb is the only thing that could stop Valve. And chances are they've just placed all their buildings inside giant lead lined refrigerators.
It helps preserve the snacks.


That wasn't a fish, I was just happy to see the Havok physics engine!

Yeah, gotta love that Haddock physics engine.

[Trixie]

It is still DRM. Your games will vanish with the servers in a few years.

Or, worse, they can simply delete your game overnight, and then, when you ask, simply show you a finger.

And maybe, maybe, return your cash if you ask nicely. Minus processing fee, of course.

What? It already happened once on the digital distribution market.


Valve promised to remove DRM in the (unlikely) event Steam ceases to exist.

Given that (in the event) both will cease to exist at the same time, and indeed, if it was so easy to do, Steam games would be easy target of cracking, I don't see it happening.

It is just trustworthy as US Government promising you to return to you all the money you ever paid in taxes in the event of global thermonuclear war, to use a simple comparison.

[chiasaur11]

Steam? Vanish.

HA!

It's only recently other companies have noticed that Valve now controls PC gaming, and they've all failed with their respective digital distributions. They took too long to make a move and it was too late; Valve is entrenched so deep in their Steam bunker nothing short of a nuclear bomb could set them back. And that's not a metaphor. An honest to God nuclear bomb is the only thing that could stop Valve. And chances are they're just placed all their buildings inside giant lead lined refrigerators.
It helps preserve the snacks.




It's actually rather remarkable.

I mean, ten years back, Valve is just another (remarkably good) game making bunch of guys. Then, when Half-Life 2 comes around a few years later on, they have this idea. Digital game distribution. They decide, heck, this is a good idea. It is. It's one of the best ideas in gaming, as it turns out.

They force it into Half Life 2, and fight lawsuits and the like to make. it. happen.

It pretty much bombs. Glitchy, slow, generally awful. Lot of folks like the concept, but the execution? Not so much. Everyone else said "Whelp. That flopped. Guess we should avoid that idea."

But Valve worked and worked to make steam not suck. And lo and behold, they did it. And suddenly everyone else was caught on the john pants down as Valve dominated an up and coming market. Somehow, Valve resisted the temptation to be jerks about this. And now? We get TF2 updates several times a year for free.

So, that works out nice.

[MCerberus]

Actually, the way most EULAs are set up, both parties can, at any time, end the agreement. If a game company really wanted to, they can send you a letter saying they wish you to stop using their property. Legally, you play ALL your games, hard-copy or no at the pleasure of the publisher/developer.

[chiasaur11]

Actually, the way most EULAs are set up, both parties can, at any time, end the agreement. If a game company really wanted to, they can send you a letter saying they wish you to stop using their property. Legally, you play ALL your games, hard-copy or no at the pleasure of the publisher/developer.

Well, to be fair, that might not stand up in court.

But it does nicely lead to a more central point. Nothing in life is guaranteed. Money? It's trust, nothing more. Almost every system, to a greater or lesser degree, is nothing more than a friendly agreement not to screw over the other party.

And, generally, it works. Works better when the other guy is trustworthy. And from what I've seen, Valve is made up of straight shooters who, better still, have a lot of benefits from a reputation as same. I figure I can trust them with my money.

[Rutskarn]

Steam? Vanish.

HA!


Well, obviously, steam *will* vanish. Probably not anytime soon, though, and you can play any non-multiplayer game in offline mode. Moot point.

[shadow_archmagi]

Or, worse, they can simply delete your game overnight, and then, when you ask, simply show you a finger.

And maybe, maybe, return your cash if you ask nicely. Minus processing fee, of course.

What? It already happened once on the digital distribution market.

1. Could happen, yes. But then again, Bill Gates "could" send hit men to kill you. The question is one of probability, and frankly, Steam backstabbing its customers is preposterously unlikely.

2. Which incident are you referring to? Care to elaborate, maybe cite a source?




All your games will be unplayable when Steam dies!


3. Steam is fabulously profitable. Steam has promised that if it *does* die, it'll make sure everyone keeps their games.

[ObadiahtheSlim]

Considering Valve did a good job of continuing to support HL1 after WON disappeared, I doubt they will drop the ball with Steam when it's life cycle ends.

[potatocubed]

2. Which incident are you referring to? Care to elaborate, maybe cite a source?

It's not gaming, but in the UK, when both Virgin music and HMV closed their music download operations they didn't bother to remove the DRM from the tracks. Anyone still with either operation when they went down simply lost the ability to play all their music. HMV doesn't care and Virgin music doesn't exist any more.

[tarbrush]

In this situation, piracy seems perfectly justified.

[chiasaur11]

In this situation, piracy seems perfectly justified.

The Virgin one, or the Steam one?

[Domochevsky]

Was it pants-carping good? Maybe for some.

I admit that a lot of fanboys rave about it as a hallmark of gametory experience and a template against which all games ever should be based.

I personally found it to be quite enjoyable and well worth the amount of money I spent on it.

Saw a LP of it. Found it pretty mediocre. (Especially the "hold off waves of enemies from off-area" parts) :smallcool:

[Jibar]

Saw a LP of it. Found it pretty mediocre. (Especially the "hold off waves of enemies from off-area" parts) :smallcool:

It wasn't this LP (http://lparchive.org/LetsPlay/Half-Life/) was it? Because I wouldn't trust Cybershell on it.
He's not very good.

[Domochevsky]

It wasn't this LP (http://lparchive.org/LetsPlay/Half-Life/) was it? Because I wouldn't trust Cybershell on it.
He's not very good.

Heh, no. It was a video LP. (And no, he really isn't very good.)

[Eldan]

Or mine where I bought Portal & TF2 twice.

That was great.

Or mine: I bought Portal and TF2 for 25 each, when the Orange Box was 55, because I wasn't interested in any shooters except TF2.

[Drascin]

Well, it's not the holy grail of shooters, but it's not bad. Relatively boring, but has some pretty good moments (what can I say, I like killing my enemies by throwing giant mutant ants at them. I'm a simple man with simple tastes).

As for Steam DRM, I will admit I'm on the fence about them. On one hand, I loathe having to connect to the net just to play a singleplayer game, and keep many of them in offline mode. On the other, fact of the matter is, I've never bought a game full-priced through Steam because they make some really great sales. I generally recommend keeping an eye on Steam just for the games you can get for two to five bucks.

[SolkaTruesilver]

If you want a good LP of Half-Life, go see Freeman's Mind. It's both hilarious and you get to see many things in the game without actually showing you every freaking things. So you might still wanna explore a little in your first playthrough.

[Domochevsky]

If you want a good LP of Half-Life, go see Freeman's Mind. It's both hilarious and you get to see many things in the game without actually showing you every freaking things. So you might still wanna explore a little in your first playthrough.

Way ahead of you. :smallwink:
(Incidentally, Shepard's Mind and Barney's Mind are also pretty damn good.)

[RS14]

Valve promised to remove DRM in the (unlikely) event Steam ceases to exist.

And from Valve, I trust it. Most companies, though, I wouldn't.

Their promise is meaningless to me. I don't trust them.

In this case, they've not even made any legally binding commitment to do so, as far as I can tell, which would be an entirely reasonable thing to do, if that is really their plan.


Steam? Vanish.

HA!


Or they could move on to some Steam 2.0, running on different servers, and be unwilling to keep paying hard cash for the servers used only by the few people still playing their old games.

[Demented]

Well, obviously, steam *will* vanish. Probably not anytime soon, though, and you can play any non-multiplayer game in offline mode. Moot point.

Steam will vanish when games are delivered via quantum entanglement.
At which point, you'll need to buy all your games over again from some other service, but not to worry, it's only your retirement fund.

[Jahkaivah]

Steam will vanish when games are delivered via quantum entanglement.
At which point, you'll need to buy all your games over again from some other service, but not to worry, it's only your retirement fund.

Due to transhumanism it'll be possible to live forever, retirement no longer exists.


Or they could move on to some Steam 2.0, running on different servers, and be unwilling to keep paying hard cash for the servers used only by the few people still playing their old games.

You mean this? (http://store.steampowered.com/uiupdate)

[junglesteve]

I'm not interested in multiplayer FPS, as I die far too quickly in them, but I enjoyed the story and overall game play of the single player game in Half-Life. But I've never gotten Half Life 2 or anything after the first, because it is through Steam and I've heard SO MANY bad things about Steam (And Many Many Lawsuits)

So, is Half Life Two worth the virus(A.K.A. Steam) that comes with it. I don't want a contract or spam or spyware or the inability to uninstall it that Steam (I hear from legal cases) forces on people .

First off, did you hallucinate some 'legal cases'. And secondly did you just step out of a time portal from the year 2004?

[Jahkaivah]

First off, did you hallucinate some 'legal cases'. And secondly did you just step out of a time portal from the year 2004?

Like Theseus, I recommend you follow the thread.

[Klose_the_Sith]

As I've said before, I don't like Steam. That's just me though, I understand that loads of people will take convenience over Braveheart-esque FREEDOM AND VICTORY AT ANY COST!


... Frankly, I found HL2 to be a mediocre shooter, a bad puzzler, and a downright abominable driver. >_>

+1 >.>

*Dives behind cover*

[Erloas]

Or they could move on to some Steam 2.0, running on different servers, and be unwilling to keep paying hard cash for the servers used only by the few people still playing their old games.

Services don't really work like that though. A service interface, like Steam, is always being upgraded and changed, in fact Steam has a new interface in Beta now, to the point where there isn't hard total change over. They already made it so you have to have the latest version of the client, so its not like something like IE or Firefox where you could choose to keep using a old version and them no longer supporting it.
Its also not like Steam really cares how old games are, for instance they just put up for sale the original Aliens vs Predators from 2000, and games like Fallout 1&2 from 1997, games from when DOS was still being used (to some extent, and still the back-end of Windows), so to assume this Steam 2.0 wouldn't support games from 10 years earlier has no backing.

Its also pretty clear that there is no way they could make a transition like that and be able to keep games from a few months to a year before the new service comes out and have them still work while at the same time invalidating games from before that. If there is a solution to transition games from the old system to the new it should work for all games. And if they did start a new service that was completely incompatible with their old service and told people everything on their old service wouldn't work with the new one that would basically be corporate suicide. There is no way they could afford to do something that stupid because it would completely destroy their relationship with both consumers and other publishers using their service. Probably with a lot of law suites to follow.

And even if it did get to the point where it stopped working you could be sure that hacks would find a quick and easy fix to bypassing the problem.

[Darklord Bright]

Not to mention Valve has made plenty of promises and I've not seen them back out on one so long as it was in their power to do what they promised.

[Inhuman Bot]

+1 >.>

*Dives behind cover*

Good idea, because simply stating your opinion in a manner you expect to get flamed for isn't a good idea. :smalltongue:

[Erloas]

And if you want to go down the infinite path of possibilities that could make it so Steam no longer works in the future and they didn't remove its protection from the game there are plenty of other ones as well. May as well assume we'll finally move past the x86 architecture, possibly to something like quantum computing, and so you shouldn't buy any piece of software now because they won't work when that happens in the future. Or MS completely abandons DX and there is no way to run any DX games without extensive hacks and emulation. Or that video cards completely move away from rasterisation in favor of ray tracing and they won't handle them any more.

If you want to go down the "what ifs" that could lead to a game you purchase now not being able to be used in 10 years (assuming you even still want to play most of them) there are plenty of other options then Steam going away, many of which are actually not too unlikely (though probably more then 10 years out).

[RS14]

And if you want to go down the infinite path of possibilities that could make it so Steam no longer works in the future and they didn't remove its protection from the game there are plenty of other ones as well. May as well assume we'll finally move past the x86 architecture, possibly to something like quantum computing, and so you shouldn't buy any piece of software now because they won't work when that happens in the future. Or MS completely abandons DX and there is no way to run any DX games without extensive hacks and emulation. Or that video cards completely move away from rasterisation in favor of ray tracing and they won't handle them any more.

If you want to go down the "what ifs" that could lead to a game you purchase now not being able to be used in 10 years (assuming you even still want to play most of them) there are plenty of other options then Steam going away, many of which are actually not too unlikely (though probably more then 10 years out).

I can keep my old hardware around. I can't keep Valve's old hardware around.

[shadow_archmagi]

Not if space witches turn it into quantum frogs

[AgentPaper]

Not if space witches turn it into quantum frogs

100% Scientifically possible.

No seriously. Quantum mechanics works like that. :smalltongue:(Yes I know how small the chances are)

[Erloas]

I can keep my old hardware around. I can't keep Valve's old hardware around.

Only so long as it doesn't break down and can't be replaced. As it is its really hard to find AGP video cards any more, and PC133 RAM is hard to find and prohibitively expensive. You would have a hard time finding a non-SATA drive too. And those technologies are not that old. And in that case you would likely be spending significantly more to keep your legacy hardware running then the games cost in the first place.

The point is though, that if you avoid buying something on the chance that at some undetermined time in the future you might want to go back and use it and it will no longer work then you will never be buying anything.

edit: that would also pretty much guarantee that you would never buy a console or any games for them because they have a much more obvious lifecycle. Or are you still bitter at Nintendo for stopping support for the NES so when it died a few years ago you couldn't get it fixed and can no longer play that game of Battletoads you bought 2 decades ago?
If in 5+ years time you still want to come back and play HL2 then chances are you've already got a really good value for your money even if you can't play it then.

[Jibar]

Like Theseus, I recommend you follow the thread.

Have I mentioned I love you?
Because I totally love you, man.

[potatocubed]

Their promise is meaningless to me. I don't trust them.

Which is basically the crux of the whole thing. I trust Valve not to whip the rug out from under my feet. You don't. Maybe I'm being naive. Maybe you're being paranoid. In 10-20 years we'll probably have an answer, but until then it's just a matter of opinion.

[Zen Master]

I'm not interested in multiplayer FPS, as I die far too quickly in them, but I enjoyed the story and overall game play of the single player game in Half-Life. But I've never gotten Half Life 2 or anything after the first, because it is through Steam and I've heard SO MANY bad things about Steam (And Many Many Lawsuits)

So, is Half Life Two worth the virus(A.K.A. Steam) that comes with it. I don't want a contract or spam or spyware or the inability to uninstall it that Steam (I hear from legal cases) forces on people .

This is interesting.

'Cause see, I've never heard such claims against the iTunes store, which sells you stuff, then makes it unavailable to you if you switch harddisk or computer, and sell it to you again.

On Steam, anything I buy stays bought, and I can download it again anytime I want for free.

I see so many reasons to actually like Steam.

Of course, they really do need to sell me stuff cheaper than in the (RL) stores. I'm saving them all the costs of distribution - I want a bloody discount.

[shadow_archmagi]

Of course, they really do need to sell me stuff cheaper than in the (RL) stores. I'm saving them all the costs of distribution - I want a bloody discount.

And they do love to give you one. Unfortunately, due to the way the free market works, most game publishers do not want to hear "Well it turns out that every single gamer bought your product on Steam. Now there's about a million retail stores that have, ahem, I'll quote "About Warhammer 40,000 unsold copies" and they keep mentioning how much they hate you.

[Zen Master]

It is still DRM. Your games will vanish with the servers in a few years.

Because they cannot possibly just copy the files to new servers. I mean - come on. Personally I'd wager they'd already done that more than once.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Like Theseus, I recommend you follow the thread.

I will nominate this for the Snappiest Comeback Of The Year award ceremony.

[ObadiahtheSlim]

About those older games. You do realize that Steam uses DosBox to run a few older DOS games? As time moves on, I'd expect to see better and better emulation to allow you to continue to play those older games. Also Valve did a pretty good job of continuing to support their own software after the end of the old WON system by updating to their Steam system. I think we can expect to see the same thing when Steam ends.

All I gotta say is, it's a pretty safe bet considering Valve's track record. Paticularly when you realize that CDs are easily damaged. I have 2 games that I can no longer play because the install CDs are damaged.

[Forbiddenwar]

It's not gaming, but in the UK, when both Virgin music and HMV closed their music download operations they didn't bother to remove the DRM from the tracks. Anyone still with either operation when they went down simply lost the ability to play all their music. HMV doesn't care and Virgin music doesn't exist any more.

Huh. I thought for sure you were refering to the Amazon Kindle incident in summer 2009 where they deleted all copies of a book from people's accounts and kindles, forcing people to repurchase them at a higher cost or buy a sony ereader. When people complained, Amazon pointed to the clause in their contract that said they could do just that. I think some people got their money back for the book that was deleted.

As DRM goes, I thought Amazon had the worst case scenerio outside of gaming.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Huh. I thought for sure you were refering to the Amazon Kindle incident in summer 2009 where they deleted all copies of a book from people's accounts and kindles, forcing people to repurchase them at a higher cost or buy a sony ereader. When people complained, Amazon pointed to the clause in their contract that said they could do just that. I think some people got their money back for the book that was deleted.

As DRM goes, I thought Amazon had the worst case scenerio outside of gaming.

Such clause of such contract won't usually hold in court, as it's not made in good faith on Amazon's part, and the other party has no option to opt out.

[Forbiddenwar]

Such clause of such contract won't usually hold in court, as it's not made in good faith on Amazon's part, and the other party has no option to opt out.

They had "just cause" to delete the title, believing it was created using an illegal copy and then sold.

[SolkaTruesilver]

They had "just cause" to delete the title, believing it was created using an illegal copy and then sold.

But it wasn't. If it was proven that it was a software problem, they were in the wrong. They shouldn't have forced their previous customer to rebuy everything at a higher price (what kind of stupid business model is that anyway? because of that, I will never trust Amazon and Kindle)

[warty goblin]

Steam isn't bad, and can be quite handy. That said, it also ranks low on my list of digital distribution services.

Impulse has a better user-side client with fewer restrictions.

Good Old Games has the best possible model, along with the absolute best designed front end website in the business.

The Gamersgate website is really bad, but their catalog is probably overall the largest.

Really, about the only place I am less likely to buy from than Steam, given the choice, is Direct2Drive.