View Full Version : [3.5] Wizard fighting help needed

2010-04-17, 12:33 PM
Currently I am involved in an epic level campaign and need some advise. I have the opportunity to create a couple epic level spells and don't have any specific thing in mind. I need some examples of epic spells that the knowledgeable have created and used effectively.

On a side note I would also like advise on fighting against an initiate of the seven fold veil. Since they are an NPC they always have all of their veils available to use so it really has become a stalemate in fighting them. Any help would be appreciated.

Keld Denar
2010-04-17, 01:04 PM
To beat an Iot7V, you need a spell that basically casts all of the spells needed to bring down the veil in sucession. Is there any way to create an epic spell that casts: Cone of cold > Gust of wind > Disintegrate > Passwall > Magic missile > Daylight > Dispel magic in succession as a single action? If so, you only need to pop it a couple of times while your allies/summons/dominatedfoes/etc ready attacks for when the wall comes down.

That, or just spam Mordy's Disjunction while doing the above actions. The trick is to use superior action advantage to both counter the wall and kill the mage within it. EZPK.

2010-04-17, 01:12 PM
Epic Magic's a big one - it's generally pretty useless in combat. Using ritual casting (just summon monsters with caster levels) and a 10 minute casting time you can get high, long-lasting bonuses to AC and various resistances. Personally, I'd rather use those epic slots for casting maximised and quickened versions of high-level spells (maximised energy drain followed by quickened energy drain, anyone?). <that'll cause most enemy casters serious trouble.

Keld Denar
2010-04-17, 01:20 PM
Energy Drain is crap. Enervation is much more effecient. Empower + Split Ray + Twin Spell + Fell Draining + Occular Spell means 8 Enervation Rays that do (1d4+1)x1.5 negative levels each. Thats a 16th level spell, but if you take Arcane Thesis (Enervation), its only an 11th level spell, and if you have the epic MM reducer one time, its only a 6th level spell.

Yea, Energy Drain is crap.

2010-04-17, 01:23 PM
'nother thought. Depending on how many epic spells you can cast, build one that'll give you a massive boost to INT, that'll last long enough for you to rest and then go fight this initiate. Then another that'll give your allies SR or some other defence if they don't have it, to keep the magic off them. And one that'll tear down all the veils together, as suggested above. Cast the buffs, rest, then go to the fight with my energy drain combo prepared. Knock in his veils in one round, and energy drain him (with your extra-high save DC from the INT fortification). Then, next round, hit him with maximised energy drain if he's still open. If your allies have readied attacks against him as well, that's seriously gonna smart.

Ed: And what's so wrong with energy drain? It's just souped up enervation? Good against casters, if nothing else.

Another ed: and I only really know core and epic, so I can't judge half the feats you just suggested sticking on enervation. Though I suppose maximise then empower it alone would be effective. Still 10th level though. Doesn't compare to Maximised energy drain.

Keld Denar
2010-04-17, 01:33 PM
Energy Drain just doesn't compare to Enervation. Its 5 whole levels higher than Enervation, does a little more damage, and has the potential to be permanent. The last aspect doesn't matter, because you are probably gonna kill the target outright before 24 hours pass.

Compare with Split Ray Enervation. Without any MM reducers, its a 6th level spell, and does the same negative levels (2d4).

Energy Drain is decent, but it shouldn't be a 9th level spell. Maybe a 7th level spell TOPS. Most wizards have better things to do with their 9th level spell slots than Energy Drain something...

2010-04-17, 01:37 PM
I agree, your combo's better. Just as I've said, only really got access to core myself. Don't know split ray. Though if you could give me details, I'll be sure to remember them for my next feat...
Without all those feats, I was still managing between 11 and 20 negative levels. Assuming your target has maybe 25-30 HD (just guessing the PCs' level) that's still gonna hurt, not to mention take away a lot of spell slots. As it stands though, with what you did to enervation - you'd tear them apart.

Keld Denar
2010-04-17, 01:50 PM
Split Ray is in Complete Arcane. It does just what it sounds like it does. +2 level adjustment, add an extra ray to any ray spell it affects. So, a max level Scorching Ray would have 4 rays, and an Enervation would have 2 rays.

Twin Spell, also in Complete Arcane, IIRC, doubles ALL effects of the spell. So, if you put it on a Split Ray Enervation, you'd have 2 Split Ray Enervations, or 4 rays total. Its a +4 adjustment.

Empower is core, its in the SRD.

Occular Spell is in Lords of Madness. It stores a spell in your eyes, allowing you to release it as a full round action that shoots the spell once from each eye (max 2) as a 40' ranged ray. If you store a Twined Split Ray Enervation in your eyes, each eye would shoot one Twinned Split Ray Enervation EACH for a total of 8 rays. Its a +2 adjustment.

Fell Draining is in Libris Mortis. If a target takes damage from a Fell Draining spell, they gain 1 negative level. A Fell Draining Enervation would deal 1d4+1 negative levels. Its a +2 spell level adjustment.

2010-04-17, 01:55 PM
Thank you very much. You've also demonstrated how to turn enervation into a practically fatal spell at epic levels. I mean, that's minimum 16 negative levels, right? If your DM agrees negative levels count as dealing damage for Fell Draining's purposes.

2010-04-17, 02:14 PM
You may want to read through this for some ideas. Epic Spell Compendium 1 (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/18832902/Epic_spell_compendium_1:_Discount_Epic_Emporium)

2010-04-17, 02:48 PM
I like:
Artimus’ Epic Tactical Defence
Aura of Glory/Keen Intellect/
Bladeturn: a melee version of spell turning
Epic Damage Reduction
Epic Magic Weapon (area)
Lesser Crimson Wall
Sorcerous Superiority

Needs work:
Aloon's Irresistable blow: if it didn't have blacklash or material cost, it might be okay.
Black Burst: again blacklash, otherwise decent.

2010-04-17, 04:06 PM
Energy drain is for spiting your captured enemies by permanently draining most of their levels i guess...

2010-04-17, 08:58 PM
Energy drain is for spiting your captured enemies by permanently draining most of their levels i guess...

Can you choose which HD you lose? I sure wouldn't mind using it to get rid of some of my racial HD...:smallbiggrin: