PDA

View Full Version : Factotum/Swashbuckler build [3.5]



Darius Rae
2010-04-18, 11:23 PM
How reasonable does swashbuckler 3/rogue 3/factotum x sound for a pirate campaign? While there would be a total of 6 levels lost from the factotum, but we are planning on playing into epic levels. The levels of swashbuckler were initially there for flavor, but then I noticed a kind of synergy between rogue and factotum. Feats would include daring outlaw and lots of fonts of inspiration.

Is there any chance that the play grounders could help with optimizing such a build? Im not to married the the rogue dip, but the swashbuckler dip makes the build very piratey and I want the build to fill piratey.

additional info:
What about the class mariner from the dragonlace setting?
Firearms will be used, probably just crossbows that look different.

Mushroom Ninja
2010-04-18, 11:30 PM
It seems to me that you shouldn't be combining Factotum with a daring outlaw build. You somewhat dilute the power of both by combining them. If you're going to go Daring outlaw, stick with it for the full 20 levels. Take full advantage of the feat. If you're going to go Factotum, there's nothing much to be gained by dumping 6 levels to Daring Outlaw. It's not worth dumping 6 levels for 3d6 SA and 1 extra point of BAB at 20th level.

Eldariel
2010-04-18, 11:33 PM
It seems to me that you shouldn't be combining Factotum with a daring outlaw build. You somewhat dilute the power of both by combining them. If you're going to go Daring outlaw, stick with it for the full 20 levels. Take full advantage of the feat. If you're going to go Factotum, there's nothing much to be gained by dumping 6 levels to Daring Outlaw. It's not worth dumping 6 levels for 3d6 SA and 1 extra point of BAB at 20th level.

Daring Outlaw actually gets quite a bit from Factotum: Chance to make any saves, potent To Hit/Damage booster, and most importantly, Int to Hide/Move Silently/Tumble/etc. meaning very easy HiPS, epic Tumble-checks and such. Lots of important Rogue-skills are Dex-based and getting your Int on them is absolute gold.

And yeah, having something to shore up your Will-save is pretty key too. Swordsage helps as well, but Factotum is good for high-Int types. You still only lose 1d6 SA compared to Daring Outlaw 20 in the end, so it's not that bad.


But definitely, Daring Outlaw needs to be the primary acter for this to work out. And yeah, it should make for a fine pirate; with Factotum, you'll have all the skills you consider necessary and you can make things fit as desired. Don't bother with "Pirate"-named PrCs though; it's all about the character and ability descriptions, not the class names.

Darius Rae
2010-04-18, 11:33 PM
The purpose was to get the int damage of the swashbuckler and evasion, but I guess evasion is not that important, so I will probably only take the 3 levels of swashbuckler

Eldariel
2010-04-18, 11:35 PM
The purpose was to get the int damage of the swashbuckler and evasion, but I guess evasion is not that important, so I will probably only take the 3 levels of swashbuckler

3 levels of Rogue vastly improves the 3 levels of Swashbuckler; Penetrating Strike and +3d6 (4d6 with one more Rogue/Swash level) SA is very useful. I'd say it's both or neither. Though Swashbuckler-dip in Dex/Int-based Factotum isn't unheard of.

The Int is still precision damage so it's kinda meh, but if you get mileage out of Weapon Finesse too, it can be decent. Still, high-level Factotum abilities are so good that you don't want to postpone/give them up lightly.

Lycanthromancer
2010-04-18, 11:37 PM
I'd just go with a changeling rogue 1 (with the substitution level from Races of Eberron)/factotum X (with maybe a bit of ToB later on for some appropriately swashbuckley maneuvers).

Be a smooth-talking, lady-and/or-otherwise's man that uses Inspiration to perform stunts Errol Flynn could only dream about.

Seriously, that's exactly what you should be aiming for, right there.

Alternately, play a gelatinous cube swashbuckler.

Mushroom Ninja
2010-04-18, 11:56 PM
Daring Outlaw actually gets quite a bit from Factotum: Chance to make any saves, potent To Hit/Damage booster, and most importantly, Int to Hide/Move Silently/Tumble/etc. meaning very easy HiPS, epic Tumble-checks and such. Lots of important Rogue-skills are Dex-based and getting your Int on them is absolute gold.


I guess that makes sense, assuming you don't get too diverted from Daring Outlaw. How big of an investment are you talking about?

Pluto
2010-04-19, 12:00 AM
Alternately, play a gelatinous cube swashbuckler.
Applying the seduce (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cwc/20070227x) ability liberally, of course.

Mushroom Ninja
2010-04-19, 12:03 AM
Applying the seduce (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cwc/20070227x) ability liberally, of course.

:smalleek: The horror... the horror...

Darius Rae
2010-04-19, 12:10 AM
Swashbuckling, seducing, gelatinous cube... Can you say, "Awesome?" But I feel the cube would have issues with piloting a boat, or getting up and down the stairs... what with the whole lack of limbs thing.

I plan on this character having weapon finesse and having high int, which is what brought about the swashbuckler. I like the versatility of the factotum tho, so that will make up the bulk of the levels that I take regardless of the fillers.

Eldariel
2010-04-19, 12:31 AM
I guess that makes sense, assuming you don't get too diverted from Daring Outlaw. How big of an investment are you talking about?

3 levels for Brains over Brawn.

Person_Man
2010-04-19, 09:53 AM
In my opinion, there is not much of a reason to take levels of Swashbuckler if your build is going to get to ECL 8 or higher. Weapon Finesse can obviously be purchased with a feat. And getting your Int bonus to damage on some attacks is not worth delaying Cunning Surge or giving up Cunning Brilliance. Remember, crunch does not equal fluff. You can be "piratey" without any levels of Swashbuckler.

Similarly, Rogue levels become less and less useful in higher level campaigns. Evasion can be purchased with a ring or feats. A couple dice of damage from Sneak Attack isn't that important unless you want it for Craven and Staggering Strike (and even then, the Factotum has access to limited Sneak Attack).

If you're sure that you're going to be playing to Epic-ish levels and you want to play a Skill Monkey, I would just play Facotum 20 (or Beguiler 20, or any full caster 20 really) or Rogue 1/Factotum 19 if you want your Sneak Feats to work without spending inspiration points.