personal growth in the story

[denthor]

One of the things I really like about order of the stick is the personal growth of the main characters.

Who will be the main story focus this time around? Bonus points if you tell me how.

[Maximum Zersk]

Durkon, since he's basically the only character who didn't.

Well, in OtOoPC he got some, but...

[tassaron]

Belkar and Durkon seem like likely candidates, just because they've both been so ignored and Belkar is going to die soon.

Vaarsuvius will continue her development from the last book, too, I would think.

[NerfTW]

One of the things I really like about order of the stick is the personal grow of the main characters.

Who will be the main story focus this time around? Bonus points if you tell me how.

Bonus points for someone to start a thread like this and actually contribute something to start it off.

[denthor]

Bonus points for someone to start a thread like this and actually contribute something to start it off.

If I had any original thoughts I surely would have posted them. Since I did not I wanted the wisdom of the playground. Please note my signature for such matters.

But since you asked so nicely my answers later Nerfed.

[Zorn]

I agree with BranRainey that Durkon and Belkar are the best candidates. I'm really hoping that, as someone suggested in the #715 thread I believe (my apologies for not remembering who) the Empress of Blood turns out to be Hilgya looking to get back at the Linear Guild for abandoning her. As to how she became and empress or why she would be willing to shell out so much gold (well she would be rather wealthy now, I suppose) over a grudge, I don't know.

On the other hand, people've been saying "any minute now" for Durkon's character development for quite some time.


Bonus points for someone to start a thread like this and actually contribute something to start it off.

Not to be rude or anything, but haven't you done something similar?

[NerfTW]

Very likely.

I'm sorry, that was extremely snippy of me to make that comment. I apoligize.

[Procyonpi]

:elan: : Dramatic Convention dictates that a major character who dies gets a lot of face time immediately prior to their death.

So Belkar.

[Vemynal]

Belkar because the order of the stick member to be outlined on the cover of the next book should be him if i'm not mistaken

[whitehelm]

Belkar should be on the next book cover, and a significant amount of face time towards the end of this arc. I hesitate to call it "personal growth" however, because well...it's Belkar.

Durkon will probably get more growth after this gate since the dwarven homelands are up next, along with Durkon's prophecy. I expect Hilgya to return then.

[Draconi Redfir]

im gunna take a long shot and go for the obvius Candidate of Elan. perhaps the whole plot will build up his realizaition of how terrible his brother is, thus leading to a big climatic battle to the death between brothers. with one of them eventually loseing the one part of their charicter that their twin lacks, thus forceing Haley to choose wich one to shoot, not knowing wich one is the real Elan.

[hamishspence]

Belkar because the order of the stick member to be outlined on the cover of the next book should be him if i'm not mistaken


It is true that he's the only OoTS member who hasn't been on a cover (Durkon was on the front of Origin of PCs).

[SmaugTheYounger]

I don't think there is much room for Durkons character to improve. He is already in some sort of peace with himself and the world. He knows that he will buried in dwarven land, so his sense of honour is fulfilled. He was at odds with Vaarsuvius, but acknowleged his acomplishments and even apologized for his personal misgivings. He has a worthy purpose in life fighting an evil lich, and he knows it will not be in in vain. What could he - or we - want more?

Sure, he could reconcile with Hilgya, but I think that is asking for a little bit too much melodrama.

Belkar, on the other hand, sure has much to improve. But his wickedness is exactly what is constantly probing his fellow adventurers alignment. He is the devils advocate, and it makes them evaluate their own position. So the story would loose something withoutout him - and frankly, would also be a lot less funny.

And as the party is split once again, the mor interisting developments could be the dynamics between Haley, V and Elan and Belkar, Roy and Durkan:

On the one side a truly innocent character in love with a not so much innocent one, together with one who has literally made a deal with the devil. On the other side two truly accomplishe charcters with a totally evil one.

Now that's interesting! (But obviously should be discussed in that other thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=149638))

[Ancalagon]

I don't think there is much room for Durkons character to improve. He is already in some sort of peace with himself and the world

You delivered your own solution: rattle around with that peace and see how he reacts. There's lots of potential in adding a little chaos into his life on a very basic level.

[Draconi Redfir]

Elan getting captured literally has nothing to do with Durkon. i highly doubt we will be seeing anything involveing him for awhile.

[Cleverdan22]

Well, no doubt there will be some Elan stuff happening soon due to the whole Nale re-introduction. Also, Haley will probably get some focus what with her father likely becoming an issue soon. However, I don't think we'll see a lot of "individual growth stories" like we did while the party was split, as it is back together and ready to adventure together again, giving less time and space for personal adventures.

[licoot]

Belkar and Durkon have had the least emphasis, and Durkon seems developed in a way which stops him developing further, despite being the caracter with the least depth (even belkar has started being good-ish) it would be hard to do it more at this stage. So I say Belkar

[Kish]

Belkar will likely grow a little more, before he...stops growing.

[doodthedud]

I agree with BranRainey that Durkon and Belkar are the best candidates. I'm really hoping that, as someone suggested in the #715 thread I believe (my apologies for not remembering who) the Empress of Blood turns out to be Hilgya looking to get back at the Linear Guild for abandoning her. As to how she became and empress or why she would be willing to shell out so much gold (well she would be rather wealthy now, I suppose) over a grudge, I don't know.

On the other hand, people've been saying "any minute now" for Durkon's character development for quite some time.


Dwarves are typically traditionalists. I think he's where he needs to be. It would feel kinda wrong if he developed much.

[DSCrankshaw]

I agree with BranRainey that Durkon and Belkar are the best candidates. I'm really hoping that, as someone suggested in the #715 thread I believe (my apologies for not remembering who) the Empress of Blood turns out to be Hilgya looking to get back at the Linear Guild for abandoning her. As to how she became and empress or why she would be willing to shell out so much gold (well she would be rather wealthy now, I suppose) over a grudge, I don't know.

On the other hand, people've been saying "any minute now" for Durkon's character development for quite some time.

While I'm all for some Durkon development, wouldn't Hilgya have known that both Yikyik and Zz'dtri were gone? I guess she didn't actually witness the battle, but I'm pretty sure there would have been a kobold body there (though I guess the monsters could have ate it).

[Procyonpi]

Dwarves are typically traditionalists. I think he's where he needs to be. It would feel kinda wrong if he developed much.

Agreed. I LOVE Dorkon's character as it is, even though he's a total stereotype in a lot of ways.

[doodthedud]

Agreed. I LOVE Dorkon's character as it is, even though he's a total stereotype in a lot of ways.

He's the firm anchor of common sense and personal integrity. Very fatherly and comforting, really.

[Herald Alberich]

While I'm all for some Durkon development, wouldn't Hilgya have known that both Yikyik and Zz'dtri were gone? I guess she didn't actually witness the battle, but I'm pretty sure there would have been a kobold body there (though I guess the monsters could have ate it).

Even if she thought Yikyik and Zz'dtri were still with Nale, the problem is that she knows what Z's name and gender are and that he's a drow. If she made the poster, those details wouldn't have been "unknown".

[waterpenguin43]

A short dab at Elan, Haley and V, then we proceed to Belkar. He sort of NEEDS to be the main focus in this book, as his only other focus was at the Thieve's Guild and that was really short. Also, he is going to die soon and has not had a cover yet.

[Thanatosia]

Elan, Haley, and Belkar. Elan and Halley because they will eventualy confront their parental issues and backstories (quite possibly already in progress depending on who the Empress of Blood is and her reasons for seeking Nale), and Belkar because he's probably gonna die this book. I think Durkons big shot at character development will likely be on hold till next book when they venture to kragors gate up near the Dwarven Lands.

[ThePhantasm]

Durkon is fine how he is. Its nice to have just one character that for the most part stays the same throughout the story.

[Darcy]

I was actually thinking about this idea this morning. Belkar got plenty of attention fairly recently, he's still learning to "play the game" as it were. It wasn't too long ago we saw him learn that it's OK to kill people when the group generally agrees they ought to be dead.

I really like Durkon and would like to see him get a little more attention, but I think I agree- he's like a rock, he doesn't have to change. Unlike the rest of the group, his hangups don't put anyone at risk or make life difficult, and he seems capable of dealing with them on his own.

I keep thinking we're going to learn more about Haley's dad soon, for some reason. It seems like it's Elan's dad who's got him strung up- I guess that's a pretty old theory at this point? I'm interested in seeing how that plays out, if at all.

[Pictogram]

I know everyone's been saying Durkon is fine as is, but what happens when his foundation is tested a bit. Perhaps he catches whiff of the destruction of his homelands, or witnesses it, i think that could lead to some interesting development on the predictable dwarf.

[doodthedud]

I know everyone's been saying Durkon is fine as is, but what happens when his foundation is tested a bit. Perhaps he catches whiff of the destruction of his homelands, or witnesses it, i think that could lead to some interesting development on the predictable dwarf.

I would hate that. A lot. I like the homely dwarf, and I like the unshakable dwarven personality.

[Ancalagon]

I would hate that. A lot. I like the homely dwarf, and I like the unshakable dwarven personality.

I bet you won't say that again once you have read the awesome Durkon-story that is to come...

[the humanity]

I'm imagining Durkon development could be possible if Hilgya came back, or he got a chance to talk to Thor, who surprised him completely in some way, or both.
Belkar should probably develop first though.

[doodthedud]

I bet you won't say that again once you have read the awesome Durkon-story that is to come...

I dunno, man, I'm pretty good at hatefulness and rejection.

[Water-Smurf]

The next arc is probably going to be centered around Elan and his relationship with his family (probably his father in particular) if the recent comics have any relevance. V's had hir arc too recently, so it's best to let that simmer for a bit, and we've barely seen any other characters except Haley and Elan. I see no indication that Haley's going to get more focus right now, so Elan's the prime candidate.

[doodthedud]

The next arc is probably going to be centered around Elan and his relationship with his family (probably his father in particular) if the recent comics have any relevance. V's had his arc too recently, so it's best to let that simmer for a bit, and we've barely seen any other characters except Haley and Elan. I see no indication that Haley's going to get more focus right now, so Elan's the prime candidate.

Yeah, gonna be interesting to see if his father stays on their side rather than just sparing them?

[sihnfahl]

Yeah, gonna be interesting to see if his father stays on their side rather than just sparing them?
Two words. Affably Evil.

Just because he's evil doesn't mean he's going to kill his son. Heck, Elan's the GOOD one...

[Water-Smurf]

Actually, he seems pretty fond of Elan already. I doubt he'd try to kill his son or something. But it is interesting that T put a bounty out on his own son's head, even if he was as nasty as Nale. Maybe it hints at evil that we haven't seen yet?

[doodthedud]

When did I say "kill his son"? I meant, will he help them with what they are doing or will he simply free them? He has quite a lot of resources under his command. His aid could be useful, but it may not happen.

[sihnfahl]

But it is interesting that T put a bounty out on his own son's head, even if he was as nasty as Nale. Maybe it hints at evil that we haven't seen yet?
Well, Nale may have tried to kill his own Dad in an attempt to control the Empire...

[Water-Smurf]

The love for a parent is very different than a love for a child. Just because a child tries to kill a parent doesn't mean the sentiment will be returned.

And I doubt that this plot thread would be introduced if it didn't relate at all to the main plot, which we just got back on track of. So the empire is either going to have something to do with the gates, help get to the gates, or put a new obstacle against finding the gates.

[Ron Miel]

I think that the Linear Guild will reappear shortly, this storyline will reveal what motivates Nale. He shall have the most character exposition. But Thog will experience the most personal growth, as he comes to question his evil alignment, and his loyalty to Nale. Maybe he will become loyal to Not-Nale instead.

[nac]

One of the things I really like about order of the stick is the personal growth of the main characters.
Oh yes, growth, stunting, ... it's all there just like in real life. (minus the occasional organ damage, of course)

I'm not sure what you mean by "growth", (does Belkar's decision to act nice for his own benefit count? yes, imo) but I'd like the psychotic halfling to get some additional screen time before he kicks the bucket.

[Water-Smurf]

Oh yes, growth, stunting, ... it's all there just like in real life. (minus the occasional organ damage, of course)

I'm not sure what you mean by "growth", (does Belkar's decision to act nice for his own benefit count? yes, imo) but I'd like the psychotic halfling to get some additional screen time before he kicks the bucket.

What I would find most interesting would be to see Belkar actually gain a third dimension and get audience sympathy and love for reasons beyond the fact that he's funny. Then he dies. From a literary point of view, that would be an amazing feat of storytelling.

[nac]

From a literary point of view, that would be an amazing feat of storytelling.
A Belkar with depth? Oh the horror! I'm not sure if it's even possible to make that work without derailing the narrative into an epic Dethroning Moment Of Suck (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/DarthWiki/DethroningMomentOfSuck?from=Main.DethroningMomentO fSuck).

[recluso]

Let me be the one to go for the simplest answer: Elan.

Obviously he will have unreconcilable alignment differences with his Dad and will have to make some choices. Lets trust Burlew to give this a funny twist and bingo development for Elan. Maybe Elan has to betray theatrics as well?

Haley might also be a candidate. Suppose Elan's father is keeping Haley's father in prison and starts using that to bargain with Elan/Haley.

[sihnfahl]

The love for a parent is very different than a love for a child. Just because a child tries to kill a parent doesn't mean the sentiment will be returned.
Which is why Nale was running around in a land far removed from the Empire. Across a sea.


And I doubt that this plot thread would be introduced if it didn't relate at all to the main plot, which we just got back on track of. So the empire is either going to have something to do with the gates, help get to the gates, or put a new obstacle against finding the gates.
Looking back at the map (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0698.html), EoB is pretty much the Big Dog on the continent, save for the Elven Lands.
High probability of: 'hey, we've been around long enough to have information you need. Oh, and here's Nale's old gear, since you seem to be in need of resupply...'


I think that the Linear Guild will reappear shortly, this storyline will reveal what motivates Nale.
Probably not. I don't think Nale would want to get anywhere near that continent. Serini's gate would be a better place for Nale to pop up.

[mockingbyrd7]

Well, the background image of "On The Origin of PCs" was Durkon, "Dungeon Crawlin' Fools" was Elan, "No Cure for the Paladin Blues" was Roy, "War and XPs" was Haley, and "Don't Split the Party" was V. So, since Belkar isn't long for this world and he's the only one who hasn't been on the cover of a book, I'd say there's a very good chance that he's the main focus of this one.