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The Rabbler
2010-04-22, 12:58 AM
I wanted to get the playground's opinion on the Kensai. Personally, I like the class and I like being able to whack stuff really hard with my super-overpowered weapon. I also found that Power Surge synergized nicely with a warblade's diamond mind maneuvers.

the only time i've ever used it, however, was on a gestalt idea I had.
warblade 20//kensai fighter 10/kensai 10 (I found the kensai fighter variant on crystalkeep and by RAW it lets you take kensai as well :smalltongue:)

baisically a +13 weapon for free. I had a lot of extra gold.

anyway, thoughts?

Divide by Zero
2010-04-22, 01:00 AM
I only like to use it for unarmed/natural attack builds, because otherwise it feels like basically spending class levels on a magic item.

Doc Roc
2010-04-22, 01:19 AM
I like it, but get little use from it outside of sploits.

Pluto
2010-04-22, 01:26 AM
It's not a bad class: it has a solid framework, some neat abilities and some unique tricks.

It's just not a class that's ever made me stop and think "I want to play one of those."

...Which is weird. I mean the Aristocrat was able to make me stop and think that.

arguskos
2010-04-22, 01:29 AM
It's not a bad class: it has a solid framework, some neat abilities and some unique tricks.

It's just not a class that's ever made me stop and think "I want to play one of those."

...Which is weird. I mean the Aristocrat was able to make me stop and think that.
Cashy money makes many people stop and say "I want one of those". :smalltongue:

Swiftest
2010-04-22, 06:32 AM
I had a pleasant experience with a spiked chain tripper build in a core + completes campaign that went fighter/paladin/exotic weaponmaster (purely for flurry)/kensai. His chain was absolutely lethal and the ability to spend a day and change its enhancements was something I found extremely useful -- the xp cost was minimal at the levels we were at and I was able to use it to enhance my weapon to counter whatever we expected to fight. In an undead heavy area I went holy/undead-bane, etc. I only wished there were a way to throw a level of lion totem barbarian with whirling frenzy rage in there ... alas for alignment restrictions.

Power surge was amazingly useful 2-3 times per day and Withstand compensated for my one somewhat bad save -- reflex. He was a blast to roleplay as well in a wierd way -- I usually hate playing lawful stupid but this guy was working for a very tough minded master and his paladin code + his oath to his master often came close to conflicting. I sometimes had to resort to clever use of semantics or letter-of-the-law arguments to get by and not fall/go against my oath -- it was tough but a fun challenge.

edit: I should add that I managed to have a custom item of enlarge person crafted at a relatively early date, and from there onwards I was the black ship of death for any humanoid melee opponents who came within my radius of horror.

Demons_eye
2010-04-22, 07:04 AM
Step one: Play a warforged
Step two: Get throwing and returning enchantment's on fist
Step three: Attack some one
Step four: ???
Step five: Profit

Emmerask
2010-04-22, 07:31 AM
I only like to use it for unarmed/natural attack builds, because otherwise it feels like basically spending class levels on a magic item.


Yep had a pretty nice build with monk/swordsage/kensai/master of nine :smallbiggrin:
it is a solid class not as powerfull as other options you may have psionic call weaponry for example is more powerful in my opinion but for unarmed strike if mic is not allowed (for whatever reason) it becomes more or less a must have.

SolkaTruesilver
2010-04-22, 07:37 AM
I like the mechanic of "doing power surge as often as you'd like, but grows harder each additional time you do it". It feels... natural. It's not a hard limit. You have to spend skill point to develop it to "many times".

Otherwise, I think it's a damn shame that the Kensai gets better Bluff/Diplomacy/Intimidate bonuses than the FREAKING MINDBENDER

Thrawn183
2010-04-22, 07:44 AM
Every once in a while melee does get nice things.

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 07:46 AM
Step one: Play a warforged
Step two: Get throwing and returning enchantment's on fist
Step three: Attack some one
Step four: ???
Step five: Profit

I'm actually going to play this on a campaign, also, my DM allowed me to have alter self for a +1 LA:smalltongue:

Yeah, I agree, the coolest you can get with this is if you use it on your natural attacks. Transforming your fists into a spike chain is priceless

SolkaTruesilver
2010-04-22, 07:54 AM
I'm actually going to play this on a campaign, also, my DM allowed me to have alter self for a +1 LA:smalltongue:

Yeah, I agree, the coolest you can get with this is if you use it on your natural attacks. Transforming your fists into a spike chain is priceless

What I like the most about the Kensai, it's the fluff element. It's hard ennough to be interesting and with good guidance, but it's vague ennough to be creative and allow for custom-made Kensai.

I played a Warforged. Artificier. It was nice.

But I took the Leadership feat, and my Cohort was a Kensai. We made it, in the fluff, that I designed him to be a weapon. He was 100% loyal to me. The time when he had to meditate over his weapon to have its power increased was actually me working on him, and improving his base design.

It was a very, very appropriate and well made integration of game mechanic and gameplay story. And it also fitted into the GM's overall storyline.

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 08:00 AM
What I like the most about the Kensai, it's the fluff element. It's hard ennough to be interesting and with good guidance, but it's vague ennough to be creative and allow for custom-made Kensai.

I played a Warforged. Artificier. It was nice.

But I took the Leadership feat, and my Cohort was a Kensai. We made it, in the fluff, that I designed him to be a weapon. He was 100% loyal to me. The time when he had to meditate over his weapon to have its power increased was actually me working on him, and improving his base design.

It was a very, very appropriate and well made integration of game mechanic and gameplay story. And it also fitted into the GM's overall storyline.

I was planing on taking leadership to get another warforged since the long term goal of my character is to form a city of rejects (pretty much everything that is not human), you just gaved me an AWESOME idea :smallbiggrin:

2xMachina
2010-04-22, 08:06 AM
If not for the PrC on both side restriction (which I hate)...

Soulbow. Another +3 thrown in. Add a magic bow for more fun.

Kris Strife
2010-04-22, 08:08 AM
More awesome than an entire party of Warforged that can combine into a single, gigantic Warforged?

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 08:10 AM
More awesome than an entire party of Warforged that can combine into a single, gigantic Warforged?

I need to know how

Kris Strife
2010-04-22, 08:10 AM
I need to know how

I'm not sure, but there must be a way.

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 08:12 AM
Wasn't there some sort of psionic power wich allowed characters to fuse?

2xMachina
2010-04-22, 08:13 AM
Fusion.

And nice. Though it seems fusion doesn't go Voltron on you. More like 2 people sharing the same body for a while.

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 08:18 AM
Fusion.

And nice. Though it seems fusion doesn't go Voltron on you. More like 2 people sharing the same body for a while.

OK, so, you play gestalt, at least one character is a wu jen, everyone is a psionic warforged. The five fuse, the wu jen use giant size and turn into a colossal machine made of awesome!

Critical
2010-04-22, 08:33 AM
OK, so, you play gestalt, at least one character is a wu jen, everyone is a psionic warforged. The five fuse, the wu jen use giant size and turn into a colossal machine made of awesome!

Go go power rangers! :smallbiggrin:

SolkaTruesilver
2010-04-22, 08:38 AM
...

how this thread about Kensai got wrecked into a Power Rangers-recreation?

I wanna be the Black Ranger

So, doesn anyone agree with me that the power-surge mechanic is probably one that feels the most natural in the whole 3.5 edition? I wonder why this rule mechanic never got recreated elsewhere.

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 08:42 AM
...

how this thread about Kensai got wrecked into a Power Rangers-recreation?

I wanna be the Black Ranger

So, doesn anyone agree with me that the power-surge mechanic is probably one that feels the most natural in the whole 3.5 edition? I wonder why this rule mechanic never got recreated elsewhere.

Well, one of said warforgeds could be a kensai, so the newley created Megazord can also use ROCKET PUNCHES!
Heck! Let's have a druid throw into the mix and play an oversized transformer!

Tytalus
2010-04-22, 12:06 PM
Back on topic:

It's a very nice class, but I can't understand why they didn't give it full BAB. It's a weapon master class, for crying out loud!

Also, I don't particularly appreciate the eastern flavor of some of the abilities, but that is changed easily enough.

The abilities are solid, and it can be very useful in a low-magic setting or with a stingy DM.

Jeff240sx
2010-04-22, 12:35 PM
Back on topic:

It's a very nice class, but I can't understand why they didn't give it full BAB. It's a weapon master class, for crying out loud!

Also, I don't particularly appreciate the eastern flavor of some of the abilities, but that is changed easily enough.

The abilities are solid, and it can be very useful in a low-magic setting or with a stingy DM.

Because it gets +ton enhancement bonuses to it's weapons?
I vote that it's sort of like War Hulk, not +1BAB, but +2STR = +1 AB per level.
I think Kensai is similarly planned *shrug*

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 12:37 PM
Yeah, but the guy with +2 str can get a +X weapon

SolkaTruesilver
2010-04-22, 12:43 PM
Because it gets +ton enhancement bonuses to it's weapons?
I vote that it's sort of like War Hulk, not +1BAB, but +2STR = +1 AB per level.
I think Kensai is similarly planned *shrug*

Don't forget that the Power Surge stacks with itself, since it's an unnamed bonus.

So, you can do it multiple rounds in a row, and have pretty nice strenght.

Claudius Maximus
2010-04-22, 12:46 PM
It does not stack with itself, since unnamed bonuses from the same source do not stack.

jiriku
2010-04-22, 12:46 PM
...

how this thread about Kensai got wrecked into a Power Rangers-recreation?

I wanna be the Black Ranger

So, doesn anyone agree with me that the power-surge mechanic is probably one that feels the most natural in the whole 3.5 edition? I wonder why this rule mechanic never got recreated elsewhere.

It's hardly wreckage!

Suppose the voltron party includes a kensai, a druid, and a wu-jen. Does wu-jen get PAO? He could PAO the Kensai into a gigantic sword which the combined party-bot could wield!

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 12:47 PM
PAO? Gotta explain that to me

Starbuck_II
2010-04-22, 12:49 PM
PAO? Gotta explain that to me

Polymorph any object. It is a broken by RAI (rules as intended) and RAW (rules as written) since it gives rocks HD (when turned into creatures).

It gives mental stats of new form though (so a sword would be a bad thing to turned into).

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 12:51 PM
Then we turn him into an animated sword!

SolkaTruesilver
2010-04-22, 12:53 PM
Regarding Shapeshifting and polymorphing, my players/GM and I came up with a very simple rule:

You don't get automatically the stats of the creature you turn into, but you get the racial modifiers. If you had a base Str of 6, before mod, then you will have, on average, 4 less strenght score points than the average creature your turned into.

This effectively removed the tendency of druids to get wimpy stat scores and simply assume a bear form when needed.

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 12:55 PM
I dont really know how the PbP works here, but it would be AWESOME to play this campaign

jiriku
2010-04-22, 12:56 PM
Polymorph any object. It is a broken by RAI (rules as intended) and RAW (rules as written) since it gives rocks HD (when turned into creatures).

It gives mental stats of new form though (so a sword would be a bad thing to turned into).


Then we turn him into an animated sword!

Yeah, an animated object in the shape of, say, a colossal fullblade would be fine. The important part is, the kensai can enchant himself as +Win sword of awesomeness, which the gestalt form can wield.

Coplantor
2010-04-22, 01:05 PM
Yeah, an animated object in the shape of, say, a colossal fullblade would be fine. The important part is, the kensai can enchant himself as +Win sword of awesomeness, which the gestalt form can wield.

I want to play this gaaaaaaaame!

Deth Muncher
2010-04-22, 03:34 PM
Obligatory "make a dwarven kensai who attacks with his beard" post.

Divide by Zero
2010-04-22, 03:37 PM
Obligatory "make a dwarven kensai who attacks with his beard" post.

http://goblins.keenspot.com/images/Tempts_Page8c.jpg

Both dwarves, possibly.

Yukitsu
2010-04-22, 03:41 PM
One of these days, I need to play a kensai named Charley with an item familiar, an ancestral relic and his kensai weapon named after Charley's angels.