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View Full Version : Touch spells over-ride special abilities?



Ixahinon
2010-04-23, 04:07 PM
So let's say you have a Magmin (Or any creature with a touch effect i.e. Ghoul, White, etc) that has taken a number of levels in Wizard. In a fight, the Magmin casts Shocking Grasp, and manages to land a touch attack upon the enemy, shocking him for #d6 points of damage...does this over-ride his Combustion Touch?

LibraryOgre
2010-04-23, 04:18 PM
In most cases, yes.

Curmudgeon
2010-04-23, 04:20 PM
There's no "override" involved; it's a choice the creature has to make.

Combustion (Ex)

Anyone a magmin touches must succeed on a DC 12 Reflex save or take an extra 1d8 points of fire damage as clothes ignite or armor becomes searing hot.

Using an extraordinary ability is usually not an action because most extraordinary abilities automatically happen in a reactive fashion. Those extraordinary abilities that are actions are standard actions unless otherwise noted. You can choose to make a touch attack with the spell, or you can choose to use the Combustion standard action attack. You can't do both in the same round.

Boci
2010-04-23, 04:34 PM
There's no "override" involved; it's a choice the creature has to make.

You can choose to make a touch attack with the spell, or you can choose to use the Combustion standard action attack. You can't do both in the same round.

What about those spells that allow 1 touch / caster level? Wouldn't that work once cast?

Runestar
2010-04-23, 04:48 PM
When you touch someone with your shocking grasp, wouldn't this trigger the magmin's combustion ability? It seems more like an ability which automatically triggers whenever you hit someone, and less an activated ability.

Myou
2010-04-23, 04:54 PM
But you could hold the charge then use both with another action, no?

lsfreak
2010-04-23, 05:01 PM
But you could hold the charge then use both with another action, no?

Yes - by holding the charge but using the touch effect, the spell is automatically discharged, as per the description of charged spells.

Wording like "Anyone a magmin touches" might override the standard action with RAW; it's not entirely clear whether the it implies 'anyone the magmin happens to brushes up against' or 'anyone the magmin takes the standard action to touch.' By strict RAW, still needs a standard action. RAI, it probably happens on every touch. Others, though, are specifically called out (such as ghouls and wights).

sofawall
2010-04-23, 05:13 PM
By strict RAW, still needs a standard action.

By strict RAW, we don't know. That's kinda what the Rules In The Book tell us, after all. It says usually it doesn't take an action, and usually happens automatically. If something is really hot, I don't think it needs to make any special effort to burn something when it touches it.

Boci
2010-04-23, 05:24 PM
Isn't there a similar debate about the soul eater's energy drain ability?