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HiggsBison
2010-04-23, 11:07 PM
Myself and a few of my friends are getting together to start up a 3.5e game at school, and I can't decide on what class to play.

Our party so far is as follows:

Archery-based Ranger

Rogue

Sorcerer planning on going into Dragon Disciple

Druid

We're starting at level 4, and I don't expect my friends to really be optimized.

I rolled a 17, 16, 15, 14, 11, 7. So, what should I be? Thanks in advance.

Mushroom Ninja
2010-04-23, 11:08 PM
What books are available?

MCerberus
2010-04-23, 11:13 PM
Sorcerer/Dragon Disciple is Gish, so you're in the need of a full-power spell flinger or a heavy duty front-liner. I suggest a Barbarian.

Lycanthromancer
2010-04-23, 11:19 PM
Actually, it does seem like a nice fighter-heavy group.

Bard/crusader focusing on white raven.

HiggsBison
2010-04-24, 12:05 AM
What books are available?

We can use any non-setting specific 3.5/3.0 books.

gallagher
2010-04-24, 12:14 AM
if all 3.x books are available, might i suggest going psion? not as powerful as other full-casters, but they are loads of fun, and it is a nice change of pace.

also, i learned just today that the Erudite has an ACF called Spells-for-Power or something like that. effectively, as i learned, one has the ability to cast arcane, divine, and psionics. while you will be limited in the selection, it is still very versatile.

i am currently playing a psionic warrior, and it is literally awesome. being a non-TOB fighting class that is powerful, flexible, and useful? i must say it was a pleasant surprise to see how strong a fighting character can be that doesnt get full BAB

Optimator
2010-04-24, 02:06 AM
With a party like that you could do almost anything you wanted. My first thought was Warblade but the Rogue probably has a perfectly fine flanking buddy with the Druid and his AC. I still think going for some sort of melee character will be worthwhile.

Artificers are fun. Bards are fun, as are caster-bards and battle-bards. Warlocks and Dragonfire Adepts are fun. I say pick a prestige class or class you've always wanted to play and go for it.

IonDragon
2010-04-24, 02:18 AM
Would it be rude to ask what your level of experience is (what have you played, what do you enjoy, number of years playing...)? Your friends? To what extent do you expect them to optimize? Also, what is the starting level?

If I might suggest for your friend taking Dragon Disciple (as long as it's not PF), Jade Phoenix Mage from ToB. Something for them to look at. Dragon Disciple is criplingly weak. A couple spells known over 10 levels, and eventually granting a template costing +3 LA, and only worth about 2?

TheMadLinguist
2010-04-24, 02:31 AM
Would it be rude to ask what your level of experience is (what have you played, what do you enjoy, number of years playing...)? Your friends? To what extent do you expect them to optimize? Also, what is the starting level?

If I might suggest for your friend taking Dragon Disciple (as long as it's not PF), Jade Phoenix Mage from ToB. Something for them to look at. Dragon Disciple is criplingly weak. A couple spells known over 10 levels, and eventually granting a template costing +3 LA, and only worth about 2?

Dragon disciple is less lame if the class benefits stack with the final template application.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2010-04-24, 03:30 AM
Cleric of Zarus (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20041203a), Strength and War domains, Str 17, Dex 11, Con 14, Int 7, Wis 16, Cha 15. Plan on going Cleric 6/ Divine Oracle 4/ Contemplative 10, grabbing the Oracle, Law, and Destiny domains. Keep in mind you add your Human +1 skill point/level after your -2 Int minimum 1, so you'll still get two skill points/level for Concentration and Kn: Religion.

Start out with Extend and Persistent Spell to get DMM: Persist at 3 if you can get a Night Stick by then and can have multiples of them. Try to visit the Frog God's Fane detailed in Complete Scoundrel to gain Skill Focus: Kn: Religion for free for Divine Oracle, otherwise you're stuck spending your 3rd or 6th level feat on it. Craft Wondrous Item is good to have, and Craft Rod with Extra Turning so you can make your own Night Sticks. Be sure to get Power Attack somewhere in there.

Doc Roc
2010-04-24, 04:25 AM
Dragon disciple is less lame if the class benefits stack with the final template application.

In the same sense that a kick to the head is better than two kicks to the head, yes. I would just go ahead and make a full caster of some flavor, since DragD there won't be doing any serious casting. I second the earlier recommendation of a psion(Shaper, probably), though they suffer a little more than a wizard does without eberron.

One good reason to go with a psion is so that if the dragon disciple guy changes his mind, you'll still have a thoroughly unique party role.

TheMadLinguist
2010-04-24, 05:09 AM
I said "less lame". I never said it wasn't still lame.

Amphetryon
2010-04-24, 05:09 AM
Stolen from CantripN on another forum, I present, a Dwarcadin:

Paladin2/Sorcerer4/Spellsword1/Abjurant Champion4/Sacred Exorcist 1/Abjurant Champion +1/Runesmith 5/Sacred Exorcist +2
1 Law Devotion
3 Practiced Spellcaster (Sorcerer)
6 Combat Casting
9 Arcane Strike
12 Scribe Scroll
15 Elder Giant Magic
18 Supernatural Transformation (Limited Wish)
Heroics - Combat Panache

And this as a spell list:
1
• Shield
• Ray of Enfeeblement
• Nerveskitter [SC]
• Burning Rage
• Blade of Blood

2
• Whirling Blade [SC]
• Luminous Armor [BoED]
• Wraithstrike [SC]
• Bladeweave [SC]
• Heroics [SC]

3
• Greater Mighty Wallop [RotD]
• Dragonskin
• Giant's Wrath
• Phantom Steed

4
• Thunderlance
• Heart of Earth
• Ruin Delver's Fortune [SC]
• Greater Mirror Image [PHB2]

5
• Dismissal
• Draconic Might [SC]
• Arcane Fusion

6
• Freezing Fog
• Contingency

7
• Arcane Spellsurge
• Elemental Body - get this on a Runestaff. You can afford it.
Stats before racial mods: STR 16 DEX 7 CON 15 INT 11 WIS 14 CHA 17

EDIT: Typo

PhoenixRivers
2010-04-24, 05:15 AM
In the same sense that a kick to the head is better than two kicks to the head, yes. I would just go ahead and make a full caster of some flavor, since DragD there won't be doing any serious casting. I second the earlier recommendation of a psion(Shaper, probably), though they suffer a little more than a wizard does without eberron.

One good reason to go with a psion is so that if the dragon disciple guy changes his mind, you'll still have a thoroughly unique party role.

I further endorse psion, though I'm a fan of kineticist and telepath.


also, i learned just today that the Erudite has an ACF called Spells-for-Power or something like that. effectively, as i learned, one has the ability to cast arcane, divine, and psionics. while you will be limited in the selection, it is still very versatile.
This is actually incredibly broken. StP Erudite is one of the few base classes more powerful than Wizard or Druid in power. It's top of the Tier 1 heap.

warmachine
2010-04-24, 05:53 AM
This question cannot be answered without knowing what you want out of the game. Let us use Robin Law's player types.

Tactician - Wizard, Cleric, Ranger
Butt-Kicker - Barbarian, Sorcerer
Powergamer - Druid, Wizard
Specialist - please state specialisation, though Rogue or Monk is typical
Method Actor - Cleric, Paladin, Druid, Bard
Storyteller - doesn't matter
Casual Gamer - Fighter

Gnaeus
2010-04-24, 09:04 AM
I will suggest Cleric, Archivist, or Dread Necromancer.

Cleric or archivist can do support casting in a way the druid probably won't, and the dragon disciple probably can't. Dread necro is a more balanced class that does well with debuffs and attack spells, and can help to cover a melee role as well (with touch attacks at low level, later with summoned/created/rebuked undead)

The Dark Fiddler
2010-04-24, 09:39 AM
Sorcerer/Dragon Disciple is Gish, so you're in the need of a full-power spell flinger or a heavy duty front-liner. I suggest a Barbarian.

Objection! (http://objection.mrdictionary.net/go.php?n=3866226) Dragon Disciple is a melee PrC with Caster flavor and prereqs. Best for a melee person who dips into a class to meet the prereqs.

Or give it caster progression.

Also, I never knew the half-dragon granted by DD still had the LA applied. That sucks.

On topic, though, whatevering Psions. Great fun.

Escheton
2010-04-24, 10:17 AM
it doesnt, the suckyness of the class already has the LA

Albonor
2010-04-24, 10:30 AM
Maybe go for another Dragon Disciple for a common theme? Human barbarian 4/Sorcerer 1/ DD 10/Barb5 or barb PrC 5?

EDIT: Make these last 5 levels Dervish (Complete warrior) and fight with a greatsword or falchion. A fast dragon jumping and flying and slashing while still an interresting character. Definitely switch dex and intel to trip and use combat expertise when you feel like gaining some AC.

If you have the Pathfinder DD then you get a few gizmos for your Sorcerer level and if not then...it sucks a little more. But you can use a buff or two nonetheless.

You still get a decent (on a non-optimised level of course) melee fighter with a few other tricks:
AFTER EDIT
Str 17 (to raise to 18)
Dex 11 (to raise to 13 to get dodge at level 12 then mobility at level 15)
Con 16
Int 15
Wis 7
Cha 14

You end up with a BAB of +16 (four attacks) compensated with the +8 in Str so you still hit stuff as often as another fighter (in the srd version, +4 otherwise in the Pf one). Good hps, good saves (not will of course).

You can trip if you want (switch intel and dex), power attack like hell if you want, etc. And you can augment your size if you want for a long while with your own spells.

If the druid does not go crazy then you are good to go. You'll be usefull and have fun.

Food for thought.

Hawk7915
2010-04-24, 11:01 AM
Starting at level 1, your party is hurting for a good "bruiser", so I'd probably be a Barbarian (or a Knight, or a Warblade or a Crusader if Tome of Battle is available).

Of course, the problem is that around level 6 or 7, the Druid can be shaped into a bear or other lethal combat form all day and the Sorcerer will be "gishing" it up with his boosted strength, armor, and attack bonus, so a bruiser will feel a little weak. A good arcanist would thus also be a great idea; probably a wizard who specializes in conjuration.

So here's two sample builds:

Bob the Half-orc Barbarian:
STR: 19
CON: 16
DEX: 14
INT: 13
WIS: 11
CHA: 5

Feats: Extra Rage
Skills: Balance 2, Survival 4, Jump 4, Intimidate 4, Listen 4


Clark the Dwarf Conjurer (banned Evocation and Enchantment):
STR: 11
DEX: 14
CON: 18
INT: 17
WIS: 15
CHA: 5

Feats: Improved Initiative
Skills: Concentration 4, Knowledge: Arcana 4, Spellcraft 4, +8 more points to spend. I'd spread some across all knowledges so you can at least make the checks.
Spells Known: Grease, Mage Armor, Ray of Enfeeblement, Identify, Protection from Evil, Color Spray (or Lesser Orb of Sound, if PH2 is available).

Eldariel
2010-04-24, 11:16 AM
What the party is missing is an arcanist. Plenty of martial types, but the Dragon Disciple is a warrior, not a caster. Druid + AC is the brawler. I suggest you fill in the blank and make a Psion/Wizard/Archivist (arcane focus)/other arcanish caster focused on BC and such. Go Malconvoker if you feel the need to provide the party with more meat, but Druid should have that covered.