Poor level 1 druid needs money

[stenver]

1. Summon animal companion
2. Sell it
3. Summon a new one
4. ?????
5. Profit!

[The Cat Goddess]

1. Summon animal companion
2. Sell it
3. Summon a new one
4. ?????
5. Profit!

I think your DM would rightfully strip you of your powers...

[Divide by Zero]

If a druid releases her companion from service, she may gain a new one by performing a ceremony requiring 24 uninterrupted hours of prayer.

24 hours of normal adventuring will likely make you far more money than selling a single animal.

[Amphetryon]

I think step 4, after the second time you did this would be:

4. Apply Cure spells to self after summoned animal companion mauls you on sight.

:smallwink:

[ka_bna]

So... On day 2 you summon the animal you sold yesterday. Now you're being hunted as a thiefly criminal.
On the plus side, you don't have to make up a name for the animal.

[stenver]

You are not thiefly, if you can talk yourself out. However, of course you cant do the same thing over and over in 1 place.. but in a big city, you could do it a dozen of times..annnddd after that:

Divide by Zero: adventuring will likely make you far more money

Yes, but adventuring is dangerous. But after you have made enough money to buy yourself a few wands of cure L wounds and hire a couple of mercenaries, then you are good to go !:smallsmile: Cheers.

@The Cat Goddess
You need to really make your DM laugh every time, so he wouldnt bother.

[Lycanthromancer]

Be a wizard. Sell your spellbook. Those things are expensive.

[AtwasAwamps]

Yes, but adventuring is dangerous.



If this is a problem for you, you're not an adventurer.

[Divide by Zero]

Yes, but adventuring is dangerous.

You're a druid. If adventuring is dangerous, you're doing it wrong.

[Mushroom Ninja]

Be a wizard. Sell your spellbook.

1. Be a wizard
2. Sell your spellbook
3. Buy 1000 Chickens (http://dndsrd.net/equipment.html) with the profit.
4. ???
5. Profit!

[Lycanthromancer]

1. Be a wizard
2. Sell your spellbook
3. Buy 1000 Chickens (http://dndsrd.net/equipment.html) with the profit.
4. ???
5. Profit!Well, using Spell Mastery, you should be able to survive until later levels. Is there a 2nd level spell (usable with Precocious Apprentice) that you can use to turn those chickens into, say, JellO sculptures, so you can sell them too?

[Mastikator]

I think your DM would rightfully strip you of your powers...

This.

In fact, what is a druid doing with money in the first place? Money has no meaning in the wilds. Animals and trees don't care about currency, why should a druid? It's not like you get to benefit from magic items when in wild shape anyway.
This is why I prefer the Ebberon druids. Go green-anarchy! woo

[Lycanthromancer]

Ooh. Does anyone have the exact wording on the Eidetic Spellcaster ACF? Because if it doesn't explicitly take away your ability to have a spellbook (just your need for one) or the 2 spells per level you get to write in it for free, you just got some extra money, and only lose Scribe Scroll and your familiar.

[edit] Or better yet, more spells known. :smallamused:

[ghost_warlock]

This.

In fact, what is a druid doing with money in the first place? Money has no meaning in the wilds. Animals and trees don't care about currency, why should a druid?

Some of those fey creatures sure like pretty, shiny things, though, and a lot of them have some hefty spellcasting/spell-like abilities. I'd think it wise of a druid to collect some coin and trade it to a fey for various magical boons.

[lord_khaine]

You're a druid. If adventuring is dangerous, you're doing it wrong.

No, adventuring is still dangerous for Anyone, even fully cheesed wizards.

[aivanther]

You're a druid. If adventuring is dangerous, you're doing it wrong.

Because there are no other druids out there, nor archivists or wizards, of higher level who would squash you...

[Mushroom Ninja]

Well, using Spell Mastery, you should be able to survive until later levels. Is there a 2nd level spell (usable with Precocious Apprentice) that you can use to turn those chickens into, say, JellO sculptures, so you can sell them too?

I can't think of any spells that do anything like that, but there may be a good deal of money to be made in egg production alone.

Now, a chicken that has been bred for egg production can produce ~300 eggs/year. That's an average of .83 eggs per day. Now if 500 of the 1000 chickens are female, that's an average of 416 eggs per day. A medium-sized egg is estimated at ~65 calories, meaning that for a 2000 calorie diet could consist of ~30 eggs. This means that every day, our hypothetical spellbook-funded chicken farm can produce ~13.87 days worth of meals. For the following, I will assume that the meals fall under the category of “poor meals” and are thus worth 1 sp each.

Our hypothetical chicken farm produces 13.87 sp on its first day. Assuming we have no chicken casualties and gain no chickens, the farm will continue to make 13.87 sp/day. However, what if we were to take our 13.87 sp in the form of more chickens? That would be 69.35 more chickens on the first day. Assuming 50% female population, we now have an egg-laying population of 534 (rounding down). Assuming we keep this up, we will have an exponential growth of chicken population.

So what does this mean?

C=number of egg-laying chickens
T=time in days

The growth rate of egg-laying population with respect to time is: dC/dT
dC/dT=(E)C(1/M)(P/2)
where:
E=eggs/day
C=# of female chickens
M=Number of eggs/meal
P=# chickens bought with the profit from each meal

dC/dT = .069C

dC/C = .069dT
ln(C) = .069T + K

C=Ke^(.069T)
Where K is our egg-laying chicken population

So, our function for number of egg laying chickens is:

C = 500e^(.069T)

Total GP value of chickens owned is C/50


Also, my 1000 chicken starting figure was incorrect, 1 chicken is 2cp, so 1 gp=50 chickens. We should have started with 2500 chickens.

This would make our chicken growth rate:
C=1250e^(.069T)

TL;DR: Chicken money can be made fast.

MAJOR EDIT: I just realized that spellbooks cost 15gp, not 100 gp. This means we only start with 375 chickens, making our egg-laying chicken population function:
C=187e^(.069T)

[Superglucose]

Your calculation is waaaay off. A Wizard's spellbook is worth, at minimum, the 50gp of the blank book plus the value of the spells in it, which by the SRD are copied for "In most cases, wizards charge a fee for the privilege of copying spells from their spellbooks. This fee is usually equal to the spell’s level x 50 gp."

Assuming an int mod of 3, a wizard starts with 6 first level spells and 19 0th level spells, for a total price of 825 gp.

That's 41,250 chickens, and you're not getting them half male and half female. You're getting them like 41,000 female, 250 male because roosters are useless.

[jiriku]

Now, take the experience you earn farming chickens and multi-class into commoner at level 3 to qualify for the chicken-infested feat. You can now take all those chickens with you while adventuring.

[Thajocoth]

Any avenue of infinite money is something to pursue only in instances of dire need. This is because DMs tend to seal such wells as they're found. Is that meta-gaming? Or is it meta-meta-gaming?

[Vorpalbob]

Am I reading this right? Did someone seriously calculate the amount of money you can make farming chickens? In Dungeons and Dragons? SERIOUSLY?

I've always argued the "all D&D players are nerds" stereotype, but this?

Wow.

No offence meant, but you have to admit that is possibly the nerdiest thing you could have done there.

[Sliver]

I would see it in line with Evil or Chaotic druids, using nature to profit, and it won't cause them being stripped of their powers...

jiriku - Chicken infested is a flaw...

[stenver]

You could also start this chicken business with selling your animal companion! After all, Heavy horse costs 200 GB, selling it will net you 100GB. After that, you already have a chicken farm! Using our Mushroom ninja calculations, we could really start a business. Now druids DO have something to do with gold, trust me. And besides, he could always use this money to protect the forests from loggers and such. Bravo Mushroom Ninja!

@Divide by Zero: You're a druid. If adventuring is dangerous, you're doing it wrong.

I second that: Because there are no other druids out there, nor archivists or wizards, of higher level who would squash you...

[Superglucose]

Any avenue of infinite money is something to pursue only in instances of dire need.
This is in theory an avenue of infinite money, but then again so is working at a job. I think you misunderstand the point: the point is that there's literally no good reason for a Wizard to use his spellbook and go adventuring; he can make an easy living off selling his spellbook to become a chicken farmer.

[Irreverent Fool]

Why not just sit around and charge for spellcasting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/goodsAndServices.htm#spellcastingAndServices) services?

obnoxious
sig

[Ormagoden]

This is in theory an avenue of infinite money, but then again so is working at a job. I think you misunderstand the point: the point is that there's literally no good reason for a Wizard to use his spellbook and go adventuring; he can make an easy living off selling his spellbook to become a chicken farmer.

Yeah that sounds like a game I'd like to DM!!

DM: Ok you've just started your adventuring career! You're character "Darren the wizard" is in the town of dale. What do you do?
Player: Is there a shop?
DM: Sure! Warren's general shop is on a small side street he deals in adventuring gear, common items, and the rare oddity or spell component.
Player: Ok Darren goes in and sells his spellbook.
DM: Really?..I uh...well you need that to cast spells but...
Player: Oh I don't need spells I just need some money.
DM: I uh....ok so you get some gold for your spell book. What do you do with it? He has daggers and rope you could probably afford a sword and armor if you didn't want to cast spells.
Player: I buy chickens, all the chickens he has. I'm going to farm chickens for money.
DM: I uhh...ok so your a wizard chicken farmer?
Player: Yeah, and assuming average value for eggs and price of chickens I wait 30 days make a profit of 2576 GP I use half to buy more chickens and I save the rest. I wait another 30 days and do the same this time i make 10324 GP I save half and buy more chickens and...
DM: Ok cool, 4 orcs come to the big giant open field where you keep your chickens, they kill you and cook all your chickens and eat all your eggs. Draw up a new character.
Player: I uhhh...
DM: And if the words chicken, spell book price, or average eggs produced per day come up in character creation you can go home.

[Closak]

No, adventuring is still dangerous for Anyone, even fully cheesed wizards.

True, i know of one setting that is known for being so utterly nasty that Epic Level Wizards drop like flies.

Really, the top tier of monsters there are so strong it's ridiculous.

Wizard: I cast my epic spell of cheesy doom!
Monster: *Shrugs of spell and proceeds to wipe out the whole plane by blinking*
Wizard: Uh-oh *Takes infinite damage from the universe exploding in his face*
Monster: *Planeshifts to the next plane and wipes that out as well*
Wizard: CONTINGENCY SUCKER!
Monster: *Comes back, unmakes the wizards defenses, eats all his equipment and kills him off for real this time*
Wizard: X_X

Elder Evils run rampant in that setting, and they are freaking unstoppable, as demonstrated above.

Not even the epic wizards are completely safe, especially not when Elder Evils are involved.

[Mastikator]

Some of those fey creatures sure like pretty, shiny things, though, and a lot of them have some hefty spellcasting/spell-like abilities. I'd think it wise of a druid to collect some coin and trade it to a fey for various magical boons.

Very true.
But then we're not talking about the standard 10 x Spell Level x Caster Level gp for the service of casting a spell.
Instead it's a favor for a shiny pebble, it takes "market values" and "currency" out of the picture. This is basically trading favors and mutual trust, pure roleplay based. It could be fake gold for a high level spell, or a big uncut (ugly) diamond for some weak low level spell.

[aivanther]

Now if 500 of the 1000 chickens are female, that's an average of 416 eggs per day.

You fail at Chicken farming if you bought half males and half females...you should about 100 roosters and 900 hens, and that's if you want to hatch chickens. If you don't want to hatch chickens, you can do only 1000 hens and just get sterile (buy yummy) eggs.

[urbanpirate]

ya know the chicken farm might not be such a bad idea for that genesis plane after all the platinum has been mined out.

of course you could raise giant bees and rare flowers instead and sell off the hyper productive flowers and honey for more coin than eggs.

[QuantumSteve]

While chicken farming works in theory, in reality it has several major flaws.

First, investing your profits in more chickens starts to diminish quickly as there become less chickens in the region that you don't own/the local chicken farmers won't sell to the competition; unless you import chickens from the next province which cost more in transport expenses.

Second the number chickens you can own is also limited by the amount of feed available in the area unless you are a chicken/corn farmer with a grain mill.

Third, 1000 chickens take up a lot of space, so you need to keep buying land, or raise you chickens on the frontier, in which case you'll need to pay for some form of protection from monsters/bandits.

Fourth, chickens get sick and die, eaten by foxes, not to mention the hired hands you'll need to pay for all of which cuts into your profits

Now, while these factors are all highly variable, their implications are rather evident by the lack of millionaire Lv. 1 chicken farmers.

[Johel]

Very true.
But then we're not talking about the standard 10 x Spell Level x Caster Level gp for the service of casting a spell.
Instead it's a favor for a shiny pebble, it takes "market values" and "currency" out of the picture. This is basically trading favors and mutual trust, pure roleplay based. It could be fake gold for a high level spell, or a big uncut (ugly) diamond for some weak low level spell.

Or a "I-do-not-cut-your-trees" tax on the dryads.
What do you mean "-it's not the druidic way" ? :smallamused:

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

I like the wizard spellbook idea, with one addition: Trap it so the next user is hit by a spell and/or trap that does/does not kill him, but does destroy the spellbook

[lord_khaine]

Or a "I-do-not-cut-your-trees" tax on the dryads.
What do you mean "-it's not the druidic way" ?

Unfortunately a lowlevel Druid really cant try to tax a dryad unless he actualy plans to end up as her charmed slave.

[Lycanthromancer]

I like the wizard spellbook idea, with one addition: Trap it so the next user is hit by a spell and/or trap that does/does not kill him, but does destroy the spellbookIf you're a higher level wizard, a mindrape or trap the soul trap would suffice.

[Johel]

Unfortunately a lowlevel Druid really cant try to tax a dryad unless he actualy plans to end up as her charmed slave.

And that would be bad ? :smallbiggrin:

[stenver]

Most of the chicken farmers have only INT 10 and they havent heard of capitalism and maximalism. Lucky for us, WE DO! so we know that becoming a millionaire means expanding, expanding, expanding. Soon enough you have enough money to pay your workers, protection, buy land AND remove competition. Once you have removed all competition, you have a monopoly, which in turn, increases income. Soon after that, you can , yes you guessed it, EXPAND!

???
PROFIT!

[Johel]

Most of the chicken farmers have only INT 10 and they havent heard of capitalism and maximalism. Lucky for us, WE DO! so we know that becoming a millionaire means expanding, expanding, expanding. Soon enough you have enough money to pay your workers, protection, buy land AND remove competition. Once you have removed all competition, you have a monopoly, which in turn, increases income. Soon after that, you can , yes you guessed it, EXPAND!

???
PROFIT!

About half through the process, the local lord decides that, since all that farming stuff seems to work well, doesn't look that much complicated to run and you clearly don't have feudal law on your side (unlike him), he can simply take your stuff and let his little brother administrate the thing. If you disagree, Sir McPointy Stick and his friend might want to have a word with you.

If a venture depends on infrastructure rather than skill, you better make sure you have either the law on your side or enough muscle to keep your stuff.

[Irreverent Fool]

About half through the process, the local lord decides that, since all that farming stuff seems to work well, doesn't look that much complicated to run and you clearly don't have feudal law on your side (unlike him), he can simply take your stuff and let his little brother administrate the thing. If you disagree, Sir McPointy Stick and his friend might want to have a word with you.

If a venture depends on infrastructure rather than skill, you better make sure you have either the law on your side or enough muscle to keep your stuff.

Which of course, you don't, since you are a level-1 character.

One questions why such a character is a PC in a game called Dungeons & Dragons.

obnoxious
sig

[krossbow]

couldn't a level 1 druid just destroy an entire peasant village by himself and then pawn everything used to compose the town?

[Johel]

couldn't a level 1 druid just destroy an entire peasant village by himself and then pawn everything used to compose the town?

How big a village ?

Anything bigger than 200 people, short answer is "No".

[Mushroom Ninja]

A few thoughts on the chicken farm:

On male/female ratio: Ideally, we would have many more females than males. Probably something something more like 90% female. I did my calculations with 50% assuming that we would be getting chickens randomly (I suppose there was no real reason to assume this). If we get a higher f/m ratio, our chicken population growth rate sees a major boost.

On starting investment: @superglucose: I might have misread, but I was all but certain the SRD said the blank spellbook costs 15gp. Nice catch on the price boost from written spells -- I had completely forgotten about that! However, assuming that you're right about spellbook costs, we should only be getting 20625 chickens, since you can only sell the spellbook at 1/2 price.

On feeding chickens: 1 pound of wheat costs 1cp. 1gp gets us 100lbs of wheat. Assuming there's enough wheat in the country to feed our chicken farm, I don't think we have to worry too much.

[Ormur]

Yeah the chicken farm fails to take in account presumably medieval conditions. Not only do you need to buy land and feed, the feed must either be grown near by or transported expensively from far away places (her you should have waited for 9th level and teleport before going to chicken farming). Then there are numerous natural events that make farming difficult even in the modern world, which makes an exponentially increasing population of chickens unrealistic. Even if you manage to increase your profits by expanding the operation gradually you'll attract the attention of your local landlord that can easily make you do what he wants because you're a commoner with inactive class features. If he's not a brute and lets you off without killing you or paying protection money he still won't bother protecting you when local brigands or raiding orcs, goblins and monsters attack your farm.

In more civilized areas you might actually make a profit with enough starting capital but land prices, feed and labour are more expensive and at best you could become a large local landowner in a few lucky years.

Compare that to being an adventuring wizard where you can fight a bunch of level appropriate encounters with your pals and become one of the wealthier men in the region in just a few months. WBL is a lot closer to expanding exponentially than medieval (or modern for that matter) farming incomes.

[krossbow]

How big a village ?

Anything bigger than 200 people, short answer is "No".

just release the housecats!

[WildPyre]

There's also the hygene issue of having that many chickens in one place. If you're using them for eggs you either have them in a pen with a coop or in a barn in cages... either way takes a lot of cleaning.

If one of my players tried to pull that I'd unlease a bad case of beak-rot on their flock. :smallbiggrin:

[Ravens_cry]

There's also the hygene issue of having that many chickens in one place. If you're using them for eggs you either have them in a pen with a coop or in a barn in cages... either way takes a lot of cleaning.

If one of my players tried to pull that I'd unlease a bad case of beak-rot on their flock. :smallbiggrin:

And lo, with a continues item of Prestidigitation, (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/prestidigitation.htm) acquired at 1000 gold pieces, all was cleansed.:smallamused:

[TheMadLinguist]

Your calculation is waaaay off. A Wizard's spellbook is worth, at minimum, the 50gp of the blank book plus the value of the spells in it, which by the SRD are copied for "In most cases, wizards charge a fee for the privilege of copying spells from their spellbooks. This fee is usually equal to the spell’s level x 50 gp."

Assuming an int mod of 3, a wizard starts with 6 first level spells and 19 0th level spells, for a total price of 825 gp.


You're looking at the wrong rules


Space in the Spellbook

A spell takes up one page of the spellbook per spell level. Even a 0-level spell (cantrip) takes one page. A spellbook has one hundred pages.


Captured spellbooks can be sold for a gp amount equal to one-half the cost of purchasing and inscribing the spells within (that is, one-half of 100 gp per page of spells). A spellbook entirely filled with spells (that is, with one hundred pages of spells inscribed in it) is worth 5,000 gp.

You know all cantrips published (there are 42 of 'em, including dragon), (2100 gp), plus however many you get for first level spells.

[Thajocoth]

Maybe Poor level 1 druid shouldn't've spent all their money on chickens. Then they might have some money for adventuring gear, and not have to resort to selling their best friend out to strangers for the night.

[stenver]

Maybe the druid wanted to try a hand in the business career. Too bad, he failed:(

[Eldariel]

Maybe the druid wanted to try a hand in the business career. Too bad, he failed:(

Rising chickens is much more natural than adventuring anyways. So Druid approves.

[Sophismata]

...they might have some money for adventuring gear, and not have to resort to selling their best friend out to strangers for the night.

Stolen and sigged.

[Golden-Esque]

1. Summon animal companion
2. Sell it
3. Summon a new one
4. ?????
5. Profit!

The thing is, though, that the rules state that you don't just Summon a new Animal Companion. You have to actually go out and find one. So yeah, this isn't practical. You're probably better off just running around casting Goodberry and getting people to pay you for healing them ....

But anyway, why wouldn't you be adventuring again? It's D&d ....

[aivanther]

Wouldn't a create food trap or hiring a cleric to cast a massive amounts of create food and water everyday pretty much eliminate the need for importing grain? Seriously, magic like in DnD would/should bring life in their worlds up to nearly the modern level in sophistication. Problem is, most the powerful spell casters are running through dungeons looking for loot.

And, if you're making a few thousand gp a week, and you haven't hire bash-it-the-barbarian to guard your farm, you deserve to have the local lord bully you.

[Prodan]

I can think of one way introducing limitless amounts of matter into a world could create problems.

[Ubercaledor]

You're forgetting about the major perils of running a free-range chicken operation, namely the diseases and parasites they can pick up (coming from a vet).

Unless you're willing to invest in a hell of a lot of topical/internal parasiticides, or at least hire someone to magic-bomb them, you're going to lose a lot of productivity from decreased growth/production and increased mortality/morbidity rates. The exponential growth function is great when you're looking at it in an isolated case, but where one hen might only lay about 10 fertile eggs a year, with a laying life of maybe 7 years if you're lucky.

You're also forgetting that the amplification isn't exponential since the laying rates are significantly altered by the presence of chicks and roosters.

[stenver]

The thing is, though, that the rules state that you don't just Summon a new Animal Companion. You have to actually go out and find one. So yeah, this isn't practical. You're probably better off just running around casting Goodberry and getting people to pay you for healing them ....

But anyway, why wouldn't you be adventuring again? It's D&d ....



If a druid releases her companion from service, she may gain a new one by performing a ceremony requiring 24 uninterrupted hours of prayer. This ceremony can also replace an animal companion that has perished.


Where exactly does it say that i have to FIND it? No! It indeed does not. I just need to pray and after 24 hours, it pops right in front of me, a gift from god, as explained in most of the D&D i have been.

[Set]

I just need to pray and after 24 hours, it pops right in front of me, a gift from god, as explained in most of the D&D i have been.

Ruling it as a 'gift from god' puts the availability into the capricious hands of the GM, who might rightly decide that your goddess of fluffy bunnies is a bit pissy that you've been selling your furry friends into human bondage (or to be eaten!) and send a pack of celestial badgers to chew your face off.

Depending on what you need cash for, consider using Craft skills. Longbows sell nicely. Or you could raise a nice crop of helmock and brew it into poison, just be warned that the sorts of people who buy poison are more likely to shiv you in the kidney and take it than pay your 1st level butt a single shiny groat.

Craft - Alchemy can also be fun, although it requires a laboratory, which is much, much costlier than the 'artificer's tools' cost to make longbows. On the other hand, you could argue that before play started, you brewed up some alchemicals in the laboratory of whomever taught you Craft - Alchemy in the first place, perhaps as part of your 'graduation exam' to leave your apprenticeship.

Handle Animal can also make some decent coin. Check out the price difference between a horse and a warhorse, for intance. (Although your best rate-of-return will be in training Ponies to become Warponies, or Guard Dogs into Riding Dogs. Gouging Halflings with inflated prices *never* isn't fun.)

[Glimbur]

I can think of one way introducing limitless amounts of matter into a world could create problems.

Nonsense! Why do you think Spheres of Annihilation exist? They balance out, roughly, the mass created via magic.

[Superglucose]

You're looking at the wrong rules

100gp/page would sell for 50gp/spell level since typically PCs sell for half price. Also I was doing core only. The only thing I missed was that cantrips took a whole page, which is the weirdest nerf to a wizard ever.

[Sliver]

But anyway, why wouldn't you be adventuring again? It's D&d ....

Because if you actually find a group with a DM willing to listen to your calculations of selling chicken and lets you do this long enough, what this DM planned can't possibly be more interesting then more chicken math.

[Johel]

Nonsense! Why do you think Spheres of Annihilation exist? They balance out, roughly, the mass created via magic.

And the conjurer said :
"-Wall of Stone !!"


***Meanwhile, in a peaceful farming village***

"-Good lord, help us !! It has destroyed Timmy's house !! And Timmy's mother too !! Noooo !! It's ripping apart the crops !! What will become of us ?! How will we survive the winter ?"
"-Shhhh... It's coming this way..."

[~LuckyBoneDice~]

And the conjurer said :
"-Wall of Stone !!"


***Meanwhile, in a peaceful farming village***

"-Good lord, help us !! It has destroyed Timmy's house !! And Timmy's mother too !! Noooo !! It's ripping apart the crops !! What will become of us ?! How will we survive the winter ?"
"-Shhhh... It's coming this way..."

-Glares at you for suggesting that-

Summon: Klubba

[Deme]

Maybe the druid should do the selling technique with a chicken animal companion: after all, the price of chickens will go through the roof what with all these people looking to start chicken farms.

[stenver]

You know. I just might start a game, centered around chickens. I find that adventuring is becoming gliché and old, chicken farms.. jeah, thats something new.

[Lycanthromancer]

You know. I just might start a game, centered around chickens. I find that adventuring is becoming gliché and old, chicken farms.. jeah, thats something new.Take your first level in commoner, then follow up with levels in fowl necromancer.

[Sliver]

Or... Play as chickens. In the plane of chickens. Where you are constantly being summoned by necromancer-commoners.

[Keshay]

100gp/page would sell for 50gp/spell level since typically PCs sell for half price. Also I was doing core only. The only thing I missed was that cantrips took a whole page, which is the weirdest nerf to a wizard ever.

Well, you don't have to have all the cantrips inscribed in your spellbook. I've always taken the "knows all cantrips" to mean that they are so common and readily available that no one charges for thier copy (beyond materials). "Public domain" spells as it were.

[MCerberus]

Because if you actually find a group with a DM willing to listen to your calculations of selling chicken and lets you do this long enough, what this DM planned can't possibly be more interesting then more chicken math.

Either that or the DM saw it coming and something really weird is about to happen. My guess is that the destruction of the natural order that comes with create food traps and abusing natural magic to create warhorses brings about the house cat plague that kills off the majority of the population.

[WildPyre]

And lo, with a continues item of Prestidigitation, (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/prestidigitation.htm) acquired at 1000 gold pieces, all was cleansed.:smallamused:

That'll clean 1 square foot. If you're using one item to clean everything once a day, sure you'll probably get done faster but things will still get dirty. If you're enchanting the cages with it, that's 1k gold spent per chicken.

Then theres the issue of defending your chicken farm... goblins love chickens. bands of rogues and warlords really enjoy attacking farms and if yours is that wealthy it makes you one heck of a target. As a level 1 anything you're going to have a hard time defending it.

[Lycanthromancer]

That'll clean 1 square foot. If you're using one item to clean everything once a day, sure you'll probably get done faster but things will still get dirty. If you're enchanting the cages with it, that's 1k gold spent per chicken. 1 cu ft per round. I'm sure there's more than 1 round available in two hours.


Then theres the issue of defending your chicken farm... goblins love chickens. bands of rogues and warlords really enjoy attacking farms and if yours is that wealthy it makes you one heck of a target. As a level 1 anything you're going to have a hard time defending it.With the right feats, you can easily level up. I mean, you do have access to Spell Mastery at 1st level, which is enough to be getting on with at 1st level, and you can always buy another spellbook at 2nd.

[WildPyre]

1 cu ft per round. I'm sure there's more than 1 round available in two hours.

With the right feats, you can easily level up. I mean, you do have access to Spell Mastery at 1st level, which is enough to be getting on with at 1st level, and you can always buy another spellbook at 2nd.

How exactly are you going to be gaining xp while raising chickens?

And you are correct a round is like 6 seconds, but that's still 1 casting per chicken cage, or 1000 gp per cage.

[Lycanthromancer]

How exactly are you going to be gaining xp while raising chickens?

And you are correct a round is like 6 seconds, but that's still 1 casting per chicken cage, or 1000 gp per cage.You can hire some grunts to take care of the chicken farm while you're out hunting down those goblins and monsters that keep eating your chickens.

Someone's gotta rule the coop, after all.

As for the prestidigitation, you would only have to clean the cages maybe twice a week, and it may only take a half-minute or so to clean one of them. A cubic foot is a lot of space when you spread it out over a larger area (say, 2 inches by 24 inches by 36 inches). Hire a 1st level sorcerer to stop by a different section of chicken houses each day; easy work, and good money.

[lord_khaine]

You can hire some grunts to take care of the chicken farm while you're out hunting down those goblins and monsters that keep eating your chickens.

Except thats very risky, all it takes is a failed spot check and a lucky gobling with a bow to block your unholy powertrip (you did say you were a wizard).

[Ravens_cry]

That'll clean 1 square foot. If you're using one item to clean everything once a day, sure you'll probably get done faster but things will still get dirty. If you're enchanting the cages with it, that's 1k gold spent per chicken.
No, it cleans 1 cubic foot PER ROUND. And you don't need to enchant the cages, just get an item of it, like an amulet. A round is six seconds, That means you can clean 10 cubic feet a minute.


Then theres the issue of defending your chicken farm... goblins love chickens. bands of rogues and warlords really enjoy attacking farms and if yours is that wealthy it makes you one heck of a target. As a level 1 anything you're going to have a hard time defending it.
Hire some warriors with your wealth.
Done.

[Oslecamo]

And the conjurer said :
"-Wall of Stone !!"


***Meanwhile, in a peaceful farming village***

"-Good lord, help us !! It has destroyed Timmy's house !! And Timmy's mother too !! Noooo !! It's ripping apart the crops !! What will become of us ?! How will we survive the winter ?"
"-Shhhh... It's coming this way..."

Don't forget the Central Caster Bank, wich goes around the world casting disintregate into valuable stuff as needed to keep the market price of stuff fixed. Since wizards have better things to do than worry with economy changes.:smallbiggrin:

[Lycanthromancer]

Hire some warriors with your wealth.
Done.Or invest in Handle Animal and take some trained wolves with you.

[Poil]

I can't believe you would forget to account for a fiendish chicken from the deepest layers of the hells who raids your farm at nights freeing his captured brethren.

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/867/elpollodiablo.jpg (http://img28.imageshack.us/i/elpollodiablo.jpg/)

[elonin]

This thread sounds more like you don't want to play Dnd but rather some sort of farming game.


For the druid who needs to make some quick money make your animal companion a weasel or ferret and train it to pilfer for you. Also, imho all druids care about nature but the evil ones represent the violent side of it and may be willing to wipe out civilization.

[Oslecamo]

Or invest in Handle Animal and take some trained wolves with you.

Wolves? Pfttt. Arms and equipment guide allows you to use handle animal to tame much nastier monsters, including purple worms!:smallcool:

[Ravens_cry]

Or invest in Handle Animal and take some trained wolves with you.
That may also work.

[WildPyre]

You're still spending your time cleaning cages (1 cubic foot is one cubic foot, 1foot by 1 foot by 1 foot)

You could hire people to clean and feed and defend for you while you build your chicken empire. This is all going to cut into your profits, along with taxes. (There's always taxes.)

Quite honestly if you're going to do nothing but raise chickens, in my game you'd become an NPC. If you're going to go out adventuring, you'd be better off spending your feats on something else, keep your spell book, and spend your profits from your first adventure on the silly chicken farm.


Handle animal to keep wolves and other nasty creatures to keep from eating your chickens... at first level? I hope you roll high.

[Ravens_cry]

You're still spending your time cleaning cages (1 cubic foot is one cubic foot, 1foot by 1 foot by 1 foot)

You could hire people to clean and feed and defend for you while you build your chicken empire. This is all going to cut into your profits, along with taxes. (There's always taxes.)
Get the traiend wolves to do it. That way , there isn't a risk of them running off to sell a 1000 gold item. Taxes are still a bother, so go into some unclaimed land, not under any liege lord, and start up there.


Quite honestly if you're going to do nothing but raise chickens, in my game you'd become an NPC. If you're going to go out adventuring, you'd be better off spending your feats on something else, keep your spell book, and spend your profits from your first adventure on the silly chicken farm.
Irrelevant. This is a theoretical exercise.

[deuxhero]

Sell you spell slots, buy a ladder, make 2 10 foot poles, sell 2 poles...

[Lycanthromancer]

You're still spending your time cleaning cages (1 cubic foot is one cubic foot, 1foot by 1 foot by 1 foot)2 inches by 24 inches by 36 inches is also a cubic foot.


You could hire people to clean and feed and defend for you while you build your chicken empire. This is all going to cut into your profits, along with taxes. (There's always taxes.)Hire an animal trainer; have the chickens defend themselves.


Quite honestly if you're going to do nothing but raise chickens, in my game you'd become an NPC. If you're going to go out adventuring, you'd be better off spending your feats on something else, keep your spell book, and spend your profits from your first adventure on the silly chicken farm.Oh ye of little imagination. What if this was the basis for the entire campaign? You spend the early levels breeding up your chickens and defending them from the depredations of the surrounding countryside, including the monks from a nearby monastery that find the smell less than conducive to contemplation. At higher levels, you quest for the Holy Hen Grenade, then for rare reagents that allow you to breed the Ultimate Chicken. You start with cockatrices, then start adding templates.

Pretty soon, you have to defend your country, then the entire Material Plane, using your fowl army.

What's not to love?


Handle animal to keep wolves and other nasty creatures to keep from eating your chickens... at first level? I hope you roll high.Catch them when young, then train them to guard your flock.

[snikrept]

Maybe the druid should do the selling technique with a chicken animal companion: after all, the price of chickens will go through the roof what with all these people looking to start chicken farms.

!! Best druid idea ever. Animal companion as a badass combat chicken.

[WildPyre]

2 inches by 24 inches by 36 inches is also a cubic foot.



By this logic you could use the spell to turn the entire world an odd shade of pink. After all if you narrow it down to a single molicule thick... better effect for an entire town I suppose...

[Ravens_cry]

By this logic you could use the spell to turn the entire world an odd shade of pink. After all if you narrow it down to a single molicule thick... better effect for an entire town I suppose...
Maybe you could. But would a layer only a molecule thick be even visible?

[WildPyre]

Maybe you could. But would a layer only a molecule thick be even visible?

Short answer? Yes... yes it would.

[Ravens_cry]

Short answer? Yes... yes it would.
I like long answers. Try me. If you have time that is.

[WildPyre]

We see color by the way light refracts off of surfaces. If you're changing the very surface layer on a molecular level, lets say, to reflect everything but "pink" then you'll get a lot of "pink" shown back. Will everything be completely pink? No you'll still get some of the underlaying colors from light passing through the first layer or so, but everything will have a pink tint.

[Coidzor]

If it's only a molecule thick, then it'll very quickly be eroded off in any kind of wind. Hmm. Maybe even bacterial action would eliminate it in places fairly readily.

As it stands, if you wanna spend your time making your pretty pink funranch, whatever.