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taltamir
2010-05-01, 06:41 AM
A wand is priced at SL x CL (typically min) x 750gp
For a wizard crafting a wand of charm monster (wizard SL4) he would price it at 4 x 7 x 750gp = 21000

A bard's CL is equal to its bard level according to SRD, does that mean that a bard crafting a wand of the same spell (which is SL3 for the bard, but still CL7) will thus be priced at 3 x 7 x 750gp = 15750gp

naturally crafting is 1/2 gp cost and an XP value that is 1/25 the gp market price...

Did I calculate this correctly or have I made a mistake?

Yuki Akuma
2010-05-01, 06:52 AM
Yes, this is entirely correct.

If a Cleric gets a spell a level earlier than normal thanks to his domains, for instance, he can craft a scroll, wand or staff with the lower-level version and thereby save money.

This also means that it's possible to get wands of several spells that shouldn't 'normally' be available, such as those that appear as 4th level Paladin and Ranger spells, but are higher level on the Cleric and Druid spell lists.

taltamir
2010-05-01, 06:57 AM
thank you for the clarification.

Riffington
2010-05-01, 07:00 AM
Text could plausibly argue differently (since the bard only has 0 spells at level 7); fortunately table clarifies:

Spell Level Clr, Drd, Wiz Sor Brd Pal, Rgr1
1.Caster level is half class level.
Prices assume that the wand was made at the minimum caster level.

0 375 gp 375 gp 375 gp —
1st 750 gp 750 gp 1,500 gp 1,500 gp
2nd 4,500 gp 6,000 gp 6,000 gp 6,000 gp
3rd 11,250 gp 13,500 gp 15,750 gp 11,250 gp
4th 21,000 gp 24,000 gp 30,000 gp 21,000 gp

taltamir
2010-05-01, 07:23 AM
Text could plausibly argue differently (since the bard only has 0 spells at level 7)

0 spells is a standard notion used by any caster. it means you are high enough CL to cast it but do not get spell lots of it from your class, you only get slots for that level from bonus due to high ability score.

that is, a bard with charisma 17 or less has 0 slots, 18 trough 25 gets 1 level 4 spell slot a day, 26 through 33 gets him 2 slots, and so on and so forth.

- added to 1 = none
0 added to 1 = 1

but as you said, the table clarifies that already. Thanks for the list.

Spell Level Clr, Drd, Wiz Sor Brd Pal, Rgr1
1.Caster level is half class level.
Prices assume that the wand was made at the minimum caster level.

0 375 gp 375 gp 375 gp —
1st 750 gp 750 gp 1,500 gp 1,500 gp
2nd 4,500 gp 6,000 gp 6,000 gp 6,000 gp
3rd 11,250 gp 13,500 gp 15,750 gp 11,250 gp
4th 21,000 gp 24,000 gp 30,000 gp 21,000 gp

That isn't right at all; are you sure you got the seperators in the correct place?... clerics druids and wizards have the same pricing because their CL is always max SL*2-1. Sorcerers have a different pricing because their CL is SL*2.
Bard, paladins and rangers I am not sure about, but they certainly differ from wizards and sorcerers.

You know there is a table notation in this forum... here, let me write it in a spoiler so you could quote me and see the code for it.

this is how you make a table:

{table]column 1|column 2|column 3
blah 1|blah 2|stuff 3
lala 1|meh 2|oomf 3[/table]

And this is how a table is made, if you quote this message you will see the code for it. the | symbol is the above your enter key, it is the same key as \ but you need to hold shift for it

I made a table of what the prices should be. For SL3 ranger and paladin spells I used the rule that you always round down, so their CL is 5, as they must be level 11 to cast those spells.
0|375|375|375|N/A
1|750|750|3000|1500
2|4500|6000|6000|6000
3|11250|13500|15750|11250
4|21000|24000|30000|21000[/table]
Amusingly, I got the same prices for many spell levels via completely different equations.

BTW: Just to make sure I am getting ranger pricing right...
A ranger can cast level 1 spells begining at ranger level 4. At which point his CL is 4/2 = 2...
So a 4th level ranger can craft a wand of delay poison (ranger 1 spell) whose market price is SL1*CL2*750gp = 1500gp?

Yuki Akuma
2010-05-01, 07:58 AM
Here's what it should be:

Clerics, Druids and Wizards
{table]Spell level|Caster level|Price (gp)|Crafting price
0|1|750 x 0.5 x 1 = 375|187.5
1|1|750 x 1 x 1 = 750|375
2|3|750 x 2 x 3 = 4,500|2250
3|5|750 x 3 x 5 = 11,250|5625
4|7|750 x 4 x 7 = 21,000|10,500[/table]

Sorcerers
{table]Spell level|Caster Level|Price (gp)|Crafting price
0|1|750 x 0.5 x 1 = 375|187.5
1|1|750 x 1 x 1 = 750|375
2|4|750 x 2 x 4 = 6,000|3,000
3|6|750 x 3 x 6 = 13,500|6,750
4|8|750 x 4 x 8 = 24,000|12,000[/table]

Bards
{table]Spell level|Caster level|Price (gp)|Crafting price
0|1|750 x 0.5 x 1 = 375|187.5
1|2|750 x 1 x 2 = 1,500|750
2|4|750 x 2 x 4 = 6,000|3,000
3|7|750 x 3 x 7 = 15,750|7,875
4|10|750 x 4 x 10 = 30,000|15,000[/table]

{table]Spell level|Caster level|Price (gp)|Crafting price
1|2|750 x 1 x 2 = 1,500|750
2|4|750 x 2 x 4 = 6,000|3,000
3|5|750 x 3 x 5 = 11,250|5625
4|7|750 x 4 x 7 = 21,000|10,500[/table]

Surprisingly, Paladins and Rangers use the Cleric, Druid and Wizard prices for third and fourth-level wands, the Sorcerer price for second, and the Bard price for first.

And just for fun, Ur-Priests!

{table]Spell level|Caster level|Price (gp)|Crafting price
0|1|750 x 0.5 x 1 = 375|187.5
1|1|750 x 1 x 1 = 750|375
2|2|750 x 2 x 2 = 3,000|1,500
3|3|750 x 3 x 3 = 6,750|3,375
4|4|750 x 4 x 4 = 12,000|6,000[/table]

taltamir
2010-05-01, 08:05 AM
Hey, we match perfectly... I edited in the chart into my post within seconds of you posting yours... not sure who did first but the timestamp on both is 8.03am

anyways, pricing is identical across the board between our charts.

EDIT: as if ur priests weren't good enough already; they also get extremely cheap crafting. :)

Riffington
2010-05-01, 08:17 AM
are you sure you got the seperators in the correct place?

Yeah I should have used the table function. It looks much better like that.
I don't think the 0 is obvious without the table. If you don't have the high attribute, must you craft at a higher CL? (and conversely, can you do shenanigans with apprentice or wild mage etc)? The table clarifies that the cost is constant despite those variables.

Yuki Akuma
2010-05-01, 08:26 AM
You craft at the minimum caster level to cast the spell. Not at the first level you gained the ability to cast it.

You can craft at a higher caster level, of course. And I'm pretty sure you can cast spells at lower caster levels, although I don't see any point in doing this.

Riffington
2010-05-01, 08:31 AM
And I'm pretty sure you can cast spells at lower caster levels, although I don't see any point in doing this.

I'm not convinced you can do this.
As for the point: Well, if you want to create an effect that's easier to dispel. Or are doing an area-effect spell when one of your allies in the area has Spell Resistance.
Is there a source that allows it?

Tyrmatt
2010-05-01, 09:14 AM
I'm not convinced you can do this.
As for the point: Well, if you want to create an effect that's easier to dispel. Or are doing an area-effect spell when one of your allies in the area has Spell Resistance.
Is there a source that allows it?

I'm fairly sure that if a spell incorporates caster level into it's DCs or damage, you can craft it anywhere from the lowest possible up to your maximum CL in order to alter the costs of making the scroll/wands.

Riffington
2010-05-01, 09:27 AM
I'm fairly sure that if a spell incorporates caster level into it's DCs or damage, you can craft it anywhere from the lowest possible up to your maximum CL in order to alter the costs of making the scroll/wands.

Agreed.
I think Yuki was saying that I could cast (by rote not by wand) a CL1 fireball. I'm not convinced you can do that.

Dhavaer
2010-05-01, 09:34 AM
I'm not convinced you can do this.
As for the point: Well, if you want to create an effect that's easier to dispel. Or are doing an area-effect spell when one of your allies in the area has Spell Resistance.
Is there a source that allows it?

Yes, there is.

Caster Level

A spell’s power often depends on its caster level, which for most spellcasting characters is equal to your class level in the class you’re using to cast the spell.

You can cast a spell at a lower caster level than normal, but the caster level you choose must be high enough for you to cast the spell in question, and all level-dependent features must be based on the same caster level.

Yuki Akuma
2010-05-01, 10:53 AM
Agreed.
I think Yuki was saying that I could cast (by rote not by wand) a CL1 fireball. I'm not convinced you can do that.

No, not a CL1 Fireball. That makes no sense. Why would you think that?

I meant a level 10 Wizard casting a CL 5 Fireball.

Riffington
2010-05-01, 11:05 AM
No, not a CL1 Fireball. That makes no sense. Why would you think that?

I meant a level 10 Wizard casting a CL 5 Fireball.

Because you said:

You craft at the minimum caster level to cast the spell... And I'm pretty sure you can cast spells at lower caster levels, although I don't see any point in doing this.

You can see where I read something different from what you meant to say.

Yuki Akuma
2010-05-01, 12:09 PM
Because you said:

You can see where I read something different from what you meant to say.

Nope, can't see it. :smallwink:

taltamir
2010-05-01, 03:51 PM
i also thought you were saying that you could cast a CL1 fireball. Must have been something about the phrasing...

Anyways, a CL10 wizard can craft a fireball wand between CL5 and CL10 at his discretion...
Where is the source that says that he can cast it as a CL5 fireball though?

Yuki Akuma
2010-05-01, 04:01 PM
Here's what Dhavaer was quoting. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/castingSpells.htm#casterLevel)