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View Full Version : What school would this spell be? (3.5)



Calintares
2010-05-05, 04:50 AM
This is a concept I've been wanting to flesh out: A spell that makes written information read itself aloud.

lasts 1 hour/CL or dismissed, might activate spells (e.g. if cast on explosive runes or a spellbook) reads in the language it is written

I'm thinking of it as a cantrip, but I have no idea what school it would be

Eldariel
2010-05-05, 04:58 AM
Whether it makes much sense or not, that's the kind of effect generally crammed into Divination. Overall, when something involves reading or understanding something, it tends to be Div. Though Illusion produces sounds. Probably Illusion, really.

Kurald Galain
2010-05-05, 05:00 AM
I'm thinking of it as a cantrip, but I have no idea what school it would be

Illusion, for the same reason that Magic Mouth is.

Calintares
2010-05-05, 05:09 AM
Thanks.

I think of it as a cantrip for wizards/sorcerers and bards, do you think it ought to be higher level?

Farlion
2010-05-05, 05:11 AM
Thanks.

I think of it as a cantrip for wizards/sorcerers and bards, do you think it ought to be higher level?

If it doesn't translate the text into an understandable language, a cantrip ist fine. As soon as it copies an other higher spell, just adjust it to that level.

Cheers,
Farlion

Calintares
2010-05-05, 05:18 AM
no translation, though I guess it ought to be a point to make it impossible to read mind-flayer writings using it.

In my campaign setting, this spell is used to further education.

WildPyre
2010-05-05, 05:22 AM
Illusion, for the same reason that Magic Mouth is.

+1 to this

Calintares
2010-05-05, 05:28 AM
Also, what would it take to research a spell like this? how much time would it take, how much would it cost, what would be the minimum level.

Also, what are the mechanics for researching new spells in general?

Kobold-Bard
2010-05-05, 05:39 AM
Also, what would it take to research a spell like this? how much time would it take, how much would it cost, what would be the minimum level.

Also, what are the mechanics for researching new spells in general?

1. Talk to your DM.
2. There is no 2, that's it.

They never gave any real mechanics behind this, what there is is on p.35 of the DMG. Basically for a Cantrip you're not exactly going to have to go on an Epic quest. Maybe have it cost the amount needed to scribe it onto a scroll x1.5 (and say that covers it being in your book). That's just off the top of my head, frankly I'd give Cantrips for free.

HunterOfJello
2010-05-05, 05:42 AM
There are guidelines for creating new spells in the 3.5e Dungeon Master's Guide on page 198.

Research costs 1000 gp per week and takes one week per level. At the end of the research the researcher must make a Spellcraft check with a DC of 10 + the spell level.


~

The info in the DMG is just guidelines and rules for creating new spells are up to your DM. Creating a cantrip should cost less than 1000gp in my opinion, and the spell you've created is a valid level 0 spell.

~

As for which school, I'd say either Illusion, Divination or have it as a dual-school spell of Illusion and Divination.

Kobold-Bard
2010-05-05, 05:49 AM
There are guidelines for creating new spells in the 3.5e Dungeon Master's Guide on page 198.

Research costs 1000 gp per week and takes one week per level. At the end of the research the researcher must make a Spellcraft check with a DC of 10 + the spell level.

...

I completely blanked on that, my bad.

HunterOfJello
2010-05-05, 05:52 AM
I completely blanked on that, my bad.

Nah, it's the DMG author's fault. They created 2 separate sections over 100 pages away from one another that both cover the same topic and the only difference is that one is "Creating New Spells" and the other is "Researching Original Spells".

Riffington
2010-05-05, 05:55 AM
I think the duration is a bit long for a cantrip.
Consider:
*The ability to sound like a human conversation. With an hour/level duration, that lets you set a nice trap.
*The ability to put a timer on your Explosive Runes.

To keep it a cantrip, make the duration shorter, or make it sound artificial and unable to blow up Runes.

HunterOfJello
2010-05-05, 06:01 AM
Good point on the time length.

The longest length on a core wizard/sorcerer spell in 10 minutes per level, so I'd make that the duration.

I'd also put limitations on the noise it can make (loudness) and what makes it occur (a trigger or a amount of time passed?).

Cyclocone
2010-05-05, 06:12 AM
RoD has Scholar's Touch, a 1st level Divination spell that lets you read a book instantly. By comparison this is a reasonable cantrip.

The school question is harder. But seeing as it actually parses a written text and conveys the info contained therein, it would most likely get lumped into Divination.


I think the duration is a bit long for a cantrip.

Well, assuming the spell is supposed to be able to read an entire book aloud, anything below 1 hour/level would be insulting.

HunterOfJello
2010-05-05, 06:27 AM
no one mentioned reading an entire book O.o

If a spell's duration is supposed to be longer than 10 minutes per level, then it should be lvl 1 instead of lvl 0. And if you make the spell level 1 than you can add tons more stuff to it also.

Escheton
2010-05-05, 06:41 AM
It already exists.
Though it might be an item, some sort of paperweight or bookshelf.

I'll try to find it later

Parra
2010-05-05, 06:44 AM
If a spell's duration is supposed to be longer than 10 minutes per level, then it should be lvl 1 instead of lvl 0. And if you make the spell level 1 than you can add tons more stuff to it also.

both Predistigation and Arcane Mark have durations greater than 10min per level and are both level 0. I dont think its unreasonable for this spell to have a suitable long duration and still be level 0.

Cyclocone
2010-05-05, 06:47 AM
no one mentioned reading an entire book O.o

Hence the "assuming".

Calintares
2010-05-05, 07:00 AM
no one mentioned reading an entire book O.o

If a spell's duration is supposed to be longer than 10 minutes per level, then it should be lvl 1 instead of lvl 0. And if you make the spell level 1 than you can add tons more stuff to it also.

Reading an entire book is the primary function, though I guess I ought to put in some more restrictions (I want it as a lvl 0.)

so how about this:

-Reads a text provided the caster is familiar with the alphabet used.
-Cannot activate spells
-Speaks in a completely neutral voice at medium speed, so it's easy to follow
-Can be heard without problems for everyone in an area of 20' in a quiet enviroment.

Riffington
2010-05-05, 11:56 AM
Reading an entire book is the primary function, though I guess I ought to put in some more restrictions (I want it as a lvl 0.)

so how about this:

-Reads a text provided the caster is familiar with the alphabet used.
-Cannot activate spells
-Speaks in a completely neutral voice at medium speed, so it's easy to follow
-Can be heard without problems for everyone in an area of 20' in a quiet enviroment.

Now I like it.

Irreverent Fool
2010-05-05, 12:37 PM
Bonus points if it says, "Cast spell B" when the duration expires.

obnoxious
sig

Kosjsjach
2010-05-05, 12:51 PM
Reading an entire book is the primary function, though I guess I ought to put in some more restrictions (I want it as a lvl 0.)

so how about this:

-Reads a text provided the caster is familiar with the alphabet used.
-Cannot activate spells
-Speaks in a completely neutral voice at medium speed, so it's easy to follow
-Can be heard without problems for everyone in an area of 20' in a quiet enviroment.

^That is a potentially troublesome clause. It basically lets a cantrip completely negate the threat of any text-based trap that must be read to trigger.

If it does trigger text-based traps, then it easily allows one to always avoid the damage from an Explosive Runes. If it doesn't trigger traps, the spell will always be used in place of actual reading, to avoid spells like Sepia Snake Sigil.

I think you should have a glance at the scholar's touch spell from Races of Destiny. Heck, a command-use item of scholar's touch would only cost 1'800gp. Read one book in 1 round, but magic traps are triggered as normal.

Last Laugh
2010-05-05, 12:53 PM
http://yasa.nycmongol.com/spellcost.html
for the research cost question I think.
It's pretty nifty!

unre9istered
2010-05-05, 12:56 PM
Make it so it does set off traps, but stops reading if the caster moves away from the book, or out of hearing range if you're feeling generous.

Kosjsjach
2010-05-05, 01:00 PM
Make it so it does set off traps, but stops reading if the caster moves away from the book, or out of hearing range if you're feeling generous.

That's a nice easy fix. You can just say the voice is quiet, so the caster has to remain nearby.

Riffington
2010-05-05, 01:03 PM
^That is a potentially troublesome clause. It basically lets a cantrip completely negate the threat of any text-based trap that must be read to trigger.

Not really. The spell only reads the words printed on the page. It gets to "Illustration page 3", and you have to either skip the illustration or look at it. If you skip it you lose out on the information; if you look at it you have danger.
Now, I would hope that anyone planning to trap a book would include some illustrations, secret pages, etc (which this spell does not handle).

In short:
If it does trigger text traps, it lets you set powerful timebombs.
If it doesn't trigger text traps, it allows you to avoid traps within simple text-only books that have no [illegible] words, no secret pages, no illustrations.