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Cogidubnus
2010-05-10, 01:06 PM
Assassins cast spells "just as a bard does". Does this allow them to cast in light armour with no spell failure or not?

stenver
2010-05-10, 01:16 PM
Yes it does.

TheOOB
2010-05-10, 01:41 PM
It also means all their spells have a verbal component, which kinda sucks for being all sneaky like.

Ravens_cry
2010-05-10, 01:48 PM
It also means all their spells have a verbal component, which kinda sucks for being all sneaky like.
Hmmm, can you use the drow sign language for verbal components?
Maybe they should make a feat for that.

Person_Man
2010-05-10, 02:05 PM
The Listen DC to hear someone whispering (presumably the Assassin isn't shouting INVISIBILITY!) is 15 + 1 per 10 feet of distance + 5 if through a door + 15 through a stone wall + 5 if the listener is distracted (and -10 to their Listen check if they're sleeping). So it's unlikely that someone will hear you casting a spell unless you're in the same room. And if you are in the same room. And if you're in the same room, they deserve a chance to notice someone using magic. If it's really that important to you, you can buy a metamagic rod to make your spells Silent when needed.

Yuki Akuma
2010-05-10, 02:49 PM
Verbal components have to be spoken in a loud voice, though. You can't whisper them...

Metamagic rods of Silent Spell don't work on Bard (or Assassin, apparently) spells, just like rods of Quicken Spell don't work on them. The feat just can't be applied.

Prodan
2010-05-10, 02:52 PM
Metamagic rods of Silent Spell don't work on Bard (or Assassin, apparently) spells, just like rods of Quicken Spell don't work on them. The feat just can't be applied.

This is not directly stated anywhere that I can find.

Kaiyanwang
2010-05-10, 03:24 PM
I guess that "as a bard does" is related to the casting allowed in light armor, not the the mandatory verbal components...

Alex112524
2010-05-10, 05:24 PM
Metamagic rods of Silent Spell don't work on Bard (or Assassin, apparently) spells, just like rods of Quicken Spell don't work on them. The feat just can't be applied.

Not quite, you see the reason Silent Spell cannot be used on Bard spells is because Silent Spell itself states that it cannot (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#silentSpell), however, even though Assassins cast spells "just as a Bard does" Assassin spells are not Bard spells, and don't fall under the special condition of Silent Spell, and thus can be silenced.

Asbestos
2010-05-10, 06:45 PM
This is not directly stated anywhere that I can find.
I think they are referring to this:

Verbal (V)
A verbal component is a spoken incantation. To provide a verbal component, you must be able to speak in a strong voice.
I guess it depends on what you consider 'strong' but I wouldn't consider a whisper to be strong.

Kuma Da
2010-05-10, 06:50 PM
Well, to quibble even more, it only says you have to be able to speak in a strong voice. And strong does not necessarily equal loud. It's possible that text just means your voice has to not be restricted to cast it.

Of course, that is waaaay more rules interpret-y than I ever want to get. If I ran into this in one of my games, I'd simply houserule that assassins can whisper their spells and/or silence them. 'cause, honestly, this kinda undercuts the awesome cap on the class, and every class deserves to be awesome.

Ashram
2010-05-10, 06:51 PM
I guess that "as a bard does" is related to the casting allowed in light armor, not the the mandatory verbal components...

This, a thousand times. Why should an assassin, sneaking around and getting ready to kill someone, have to shout "GREATER INVISIBILITY!" to cast the spell? "Casts as a bard" is only for casting in light armor with no spell failure (Which, if you wanted to take it further, you could take Medium Armor Proficiency and Battle Caster to be able to cast in medium armor with no spell failure.)

Yuki Akuma
2010-05-11, 06:15 AM
This, a thousand times. Why should an assassin, sneaking around and getting ready to kill someone, have to shout "GREATER INVISIBILITY!" to cast the spell? "Casts as a bard" is only for casting in light armor with no spell failure (Which, if you wanted to take it further, you could take Medium Armor Proficiency and Battle Caster to be able to cast in medium armor with no spell failure.)

And then take Heavy Armour Proficiency and another Battle Caster to cast in heavy armour with no spell failure!

...Not sure why you'd do this, but...

Cogidubnus
2010-05-11, 02:45 PM
And then take Heavy Armour Proficiency and another Battle Caster to cast in heavy armour with no spell failure!

...Not sure why you'd do this, but...

Especially if you're trying to be all sneaky-like. -6 to Move Silently? A-hem.

Greenish
2010-05-11, 03:00 PM
Especially if you're trying to be all sneaky-like. -6 to Move Silently? A-hem.Permament item of Iron Silence. Can't be that expensive, it's mere 2nd level spell. Alternatively, UMD a wand with it, it has hour/level duration.