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Kilmrak
2010-05-11, 02:01 AM
Hi, I need help with two character builds that I am honestly to lazy to look up on these boards, so if the playground could kindly help I would much appreciate it. It starts at 5th lvl and will probably go on till 15-18, im looking for basically whole character progressions feats and all please, if you have better class selections or combination please share I would like to know. Also if there are any awesome PRC out there for this kind of build that would help(preferably progressing casting and full BAB)
Builds(not gestalt)
Paladin/Sorcerer
Wizard/Swashbuckler

Rules
All books except tome of battle, tome of magic and magic of incarnum
not too many magic items in this world so item light please
race is Raptoran
stats to be roled later
we go by Pathfinder feat progression so a feat every odd level

Thank you in advance for your help.

gorfnab
2010-05-11, 04:10 AM
Paladin 2/ Battle Sorcerer 5/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Sacred Exorcist 8

Swashbuckler 3/ Wizard 4/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Sacred Exorcist 8

For feats look into Arcane Strike and whatever gish type feats you want. For the Pali/Sorc look into the Divine based feats like Divine Might. For the Swash/Wiz look into the spell Luminous Armor/Greater for a very nice boost to AC.

I kinda like Bard based gishes:
Bard 7/ Paladin of Freedom 3/ Sublime Chord 2/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Sacred Exorcist 3

Eldariel
2010-05-11, 04:53 AM
Paladin 2/ Battle Sorcerer 5/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Sacred Exorcist 8

What?! It's Paladin 2/Sorcerer 4/Spellsword 1/Abjurant Champion 5/Sacred Exorcist 8! Battle Sorcerer... :smallyuk:

Doc Roc
2010-05-11, 08:23 AM
If I have to use swash:
I'm guessing you want three swash levels. Which is terrible, but okay.

Swash 3/Martial Wizard 6/Spell Dancer 2/Abjurant Champion 5/xxx
Key feats:
1: Combat Casting {For spelldancer and Abj}
3: Dodge {For spelldancer}
4, Martial Wizard: Endurance {For spelldancer}
5: Mobility {For spelldancer}
7: Arcane Disciple (Competition)
8, wizard: Extend
9 Persist

Key Items:
Sandals of the Vagabond

I'd much rather do:
Martial Wizard 6/Spell Dancer 2/Swiftblade 9 (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070327)/Abjurant Champion 3
Key feats:
1: Combat Casting {For spelldancer and Abj}
1, Martial Wizard: Endurance {For spelldancer}
3: Extend
5: Mobility {For spelldancer}
5, wizard: Dodge {For spelldancer}
7: Arcane Disciple (Competition)
9 Persist
11 Ocular Spell, if you hate all that is good and holy.

Key Items:
Sandals of the Vagabond

Persisting Divine Power. I'm a gish build, I promise!

Kilmrak
2010-05-11, 10:20 AM
Thanks for the replies but where can I find Martial Wizard and Spell Dancer and arcane disciple.

dextercorvia
2010-05-11, 10:28 AM
I'm guessing Martial Wizard is the one that trades scribe scroll and wiz bonus feats for fighter bonus feats at the usual level here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizard).

Arcane Disciple (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Arcane_Disciple) is in Complete Divine.

Also Dodge and Mobility are prereq's for Swiftblade, I don't know about Spell Dancer.

Doc Roc
2010-05-11, 10:40 AM
Spell Dancer is in magic of faerun. It's used to abuse Persistent Spell, which is in complete arcane.

dextercorvia
2010-05-11, 11:17 AM
If you are using the variant, doesn't that preclude taking extend for the wizard bonus at 5?

Doc Roc
2010-05-11, 11:19 AM
It would, you are correct, but you could just shuffle one of the other pre-req feats in.
Fixed.

dextercorvia
2010-05-11, 11:27 AM
I assumed so. How does Spell Dancer allow you to use DMM? Doesn't Divine Power count as an arcane spell even if it comes from Arcane Disciple?


Edit: I was mixing this thread up with the advice you gave on the Fav. Soul thread. Still curious about the Spell Dancer though.

Doc Roc
2010-05-11, 12:11 PM
Spell dancer lets you dance in exchange for ignoring the adjustment from MM. This is exactly as stupid as it sounds. It is supposed to fatigue and then exhaust you, with the exhaustion cutting off your ability to dance, but the sandals prevent exhaustion as well as providing a small initiative bonus. You can use ocular spell to make things fixed range, and thus persistable, but I don't recommend it. The build is strong enough already without always-on haste.

Kilmrak
2010-05-11, 01:08 PM
thanks for all the info its really helped I think I can handle it now

WoodenSword
2010-05-11, 01:22 PM
I actually looking into Champions of Valor from FR, since you said no ToB or MotI, which has the following:

Mystic Fire Knight (paladin) sub levels
High One Warrior-Wizard (wizard) sub levels
Sword of the Arcane Order feat, which stacks Paly and Wiz levels for casting and animals. Also makes each other's spells interchangable.

here's my combo:

Focus only on INT and CHA, with minors in WIS and CON. Dump STR and DEX (rare, but nice in the end)

Race: Something with INT and/or CHA bonuses. I suggest highly Human for this or Strongheart Halfling
Class: Mystic Fire Knight 5/High One Warrior-Wizard 5/Abjurant Champ 5/Knight Phantom 5
Full Casting, Fullplate, and Buttloads of both Casting and Combat.

Enjoy

-WoodenSword-

Kilmrak
2010-05-11, 02:01 PM
I actually looking into Champions of Valor from FR, since you said no ToB or MotI, which has the following:

Mystic Fire Knight (paladin) sub levels
High One Warrior-Wizard (wizard) sub levels
Sword of the Arcane Order feat, which stacks Paly and Wiz levels for casting and animals. Also makes each other's spells interchangable.

here's my combo:

Focus only on INT and CHA, with minors in WIS and CON. Dump STR and DEX (rare, but nice in the end)

Race: Something with INT and/or CHA bonuses. I suggest highly Human for this or Strongheart Halfling
Class: Mystic Fire Knight 5/High One Warrior-Wizard 5/Abjurant Champ 5/Knight Phantom 5
Full Casting, Fullplate, and Buttloads of both Casting and Combat.

Enjoy

-WoodenSword-

That is a pretty awesome build right there I have to run that past my DM

Greenish
2010-05-11, 02:10 PM
Sword of the Arcane Order feat, which stacks Paly and Wiz levels for casting and animals.That's not what SotAO (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Sword_of_the_Arcane_Order) does, though I can't recall the name of the feat that does what you describe.

[Edit]: And does Mystic Fire Knight really have full casting? :smallconfused:
[2.Edit]: Okay, so you'd have casting as 14th level wizard at level 20. Woo.

WoodenSword
2010-05-11, 02:12 PM
That's not what SotAO (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Sword_of_the_Arcane_Order) does, though I can't recall the name of the feat that does what you describe.

[Edit]: And does Mystic Fire Knight really have full casting? :smallconfused:

thats what the feat looks like...

and sorta, when comboed with SotAO (again, by my reading)

Greenish
2010-05-11, 02:24 PM
thats what the feat looks like...It allows you to cast wizard spells from your paladin slots, and gives you CL (but not real casting advancement) for your wizard side.

Mystic Fire Knight 5/High One Warrior-Wizard 5/Abjurant Champ 5/Knight Phantom 5 would have paladin casting as 5th level paladin (but with CL 19, if the prestige classes count), and wizard casting as a 14th level wizard (with CL 19). You'd also have, let's see, 17 BAB, and you could cast your wizard spells with no arcane spell failure in up to medium mithral armour (no shields though).

[Edit]: Mystic Fire Knight (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20051104a) and High One Warrior-Wizard (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060327a) substitution levels can both be found online.

Eldariel
2010-05-11, 03:14 PM
Spell dancer lets you dance in exchange for ignoring the adjustment from MM. This is exactly as stupid as it sounds. It is supposed to fatigue and then exhaust you, with the exhaustion cutting off your ability to dance, but the sandals prevent exhaustion as well as providing a small initiative bonus. You can use ocular spell to make things fixed range, and thus persistable, but I don't recommend it. The build is strong enough already without always-on haste.

Swift Haste gives you always-on haste anyways, being Personal and all.

Doc Roc
2010-05-11, 03:28 PM
Swift Haste gives you always-on haste anyways, being Personal and all.

Well, gorsh, you appear to be correct. That hurts my little boy brain.

Paul H
2010-05-11, 03:53 PM
Hi

Shame you using 3.5. Playing Sorc/Pal from Pathfinder in the PF Society campaign. Going Dragon Disciple -Gets 7/10 CL in PF.

Paladins are more powerful in PF too. Smite Evil lasts until either you or your victim go down (or you rest up), and grants Cha bonus as Deflection bonus to AC vs your victim.

I'll post specific character path shortly...

Cheers
Paul H
(Pathfinder junky)

Tinydwarfman
2010-05-11, 04:08 PM
Hi

Shame you using 3.5. Playing Sorc/Pal from Pathfinder in the PF Society campaign. Going Dragon Disciple -Gets 7/10 CL in PF.

Paladins are more powerful in PF too. Smite Evil lasts until either you or your victim go down (or you rest up), and grants Cha bonus as Deflection bonus to AC vs your victim.

I'll post specific character path shortly...

Cheers
Paul H
(Pathfinder junky)

Heh, oh yeah, I'm looking forward to playing a sorcadin in a 3.5/PF game. Also, archer pallys in PF are actually really good damage machines. Smite Evil + crapload of attacks = death on demand.

Doc Roc
2010-05-11, 04:18 PM
They're still not nearly as good as full casters. I'll take a swiftblade over a paladin any day.

Paul H
2010-05-11, 04:25 PM
Hi

'Death on Demand' sounds about right.

At 15th lvl you fight as an enhanced Large Dragon, 2 Claws, 1 Bite, 2 Wings, 1 Tail Sweep. All with Spells and Smiting.

By 20th lvl you're looking at Sorc 1/Pal 5/Dragon Disciple10/Eld Knight 5

Spells as Sorc 12. Pal 4
BAB 16
Base Saves F12 R6 W13 (Plus cha mod from Paladin)

Tinydwarfman
2010-05-11, 04:25 PM
They're still not nearly as good as full casters. I'll take a swiftblade over a paladin any day.

:smallconfused:... Obviously, nothing is as good as a full caster. And swiftblades are awesome gishes, but don't really support archery, a nice which I love. Swiftblades do sort of need to be high level to be effective gishes though.