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valadil
2010-05-11, 12:03 PM
Are there any options for improving NPC skills beyond level/2 + stat + trained + racial bonuses?

I'm trying to set up a Doppleganger. I'd like his bluff check to be pretty high. Were he a PC he'd have a regional feat and a skill bonus feat to add to bluff. Do NPC rules account for that? I'd rather not give his bluff skill a +fiat bonus.

TricksyAndFalse
2010-05-11, 12:46 PM
Do NPC rules account for that? I'd rather not give his bluff skill a +fiat bonus.

The way the rules account for this is the +fiat bonus you're trying to avoid. NPCs are not built like PCs. They don't get feats, backgrounds, or paragon paths. Your +fiat bonus just makes up for the fact that if the NPC were a PC, they'd have options (and much extra bookeeping and design time) for increasing bluff.

You could instead just set a static DC for detecting your NPC's bluff rather than do an opposed roll. Set the DC to something appropriate for the PCs' levels, and call it good.

valadil
2010-05-11, 12:48 PM
You could instead just set a static DC for detecting your NPC's bluff rather than do an opposed roll. Set the DC to something appropriate for the PCs' levels, and call it good.

I actually kinda like that option. Anything that removes the chance of me rolling a nat 1 is a good thing.

pasko77
2010-05-11, 02:12 PM
I actually kinda like that option. Anything that removes the chance of me rolling a nat 1 is a good thing.

The difference is symbolic, since one of your players rolling a nat 20 brings the same outcome. Or maybe there is something I didn't get.

Cog
2010-05-11, 02:22 PM
The difference is symbolic, since one of your players rolling a nat 20 brings the same outcome. Or maybe there is something I didn't get.

Twice as many die rolls give twice the chance for a natural 20/1.

valadil
2010-05-11, 02:31 PM
Twice as many die rolls give twice the chance for a natural 20/1.

Yup. I'm not counting either as an auto success or failure, but having two rolls gives too big of a range of results. I don't want to have to make this guy's skill 30 points higher than the best PC. That goes beyond a +fiat bonus. Also consider that I have 5 PCs rolling Insight against each of my checks. One of them will likely roll well. All they'd have to do is keep me talking until I got a bad roll.

Current plan is to look at DCs for difficult skill checks and compare that to what an NPC would have (with a moderate bonus).

pasko77
2010-05-11, 03:05 PM
Also consider that I have 5 PCs rolling Insight against each of my checks. One of them will likely roll well.

Yes, this is the main issue for which a stealth or bluff check by a npc is either unbeatable or useless.

I recall a house rule that solved this issue with "group checks", that is the highest score in the group, plus a small "aid another" from other party members, only one check rolled.

Hope you find this idea useful.