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SurlySeraph
2010-05-15, 05:56 PM
Has there ever been any official ruling on what happens if a Dread Necromancer becomes good? I can't find any.

And, if a Dread Necro could become good without consequences, it could take a level in Sacred Exorcist to get both Turn Undead and Rebuke Undead. What consequences would that have, other than being unusual? Would it get separate pools of uses for Turn and Rebuke?

Reynard
2010-05-15, 06:03 PM
Alignment: Not all dread necromancers are evil, although the best of them could easily be described as evil-tolerant. No dread necromancer can have a good alignment. Performing evil acts is a basic feature of the class, but some dread necromancers manage to balance evil acts with good intentions, remaining solidly neutral (most PC dread necromancers fall into this category).

From the Dread Necromancer section in Heroes of Horror.

If there was any penalty for becoming Good as a Dread Necro, it'd have been mentioned there. It's basically impossible to do so, though, since their spells and class features are all considered evil.

The Glyphstone
2010-05-15, 06:10 PM
What happens if you're a Hellbred, with their Evil Exception ability?

Greenish
2010-05-15, 06:12 PM
What happens if you're a Hellbred, with their Evil Exception ability?Evil Exception doesn't allow you to do Evil deeds (such as using DN's class features) without it affecting your alignment.

The Glyphstone
2010-05-15, 06:18 PM
Evil Exception doesn't allow you to do Evil deeds (such as using DN's class features) without it affecting your alignment.

Ah, right.

Ravens_cry
2010-05-15, 06:28 PM
What DOES it (Evil Exception) allow you to do then?

The Glyphstone
2010-05-15, 06:33 PM
Reading the ability, it lets you cast Evil spells and use Evil items without penalty, even if you're Good - i.e., you can cast Animate Dead as a Good cleric, or wield an Unholy sword as a paladin. It doesn't however, actually mention anything about negating the alignment shifts...so that cleric will still be dropping towards Evil every time he casts Animate Dead, and the paladin will still Fall if he uses that sword to kill an orphan.

Coidzor
2010-05-15, 06:40 PM
So, wait... What makes it any different from normal play in regards to spells with the Evil descriptor?

The Glyphstone
2010-05-15, 06:43 PM
Normally, you'd get negative levels from holding an Unholy weapon if you weren't Evil, and you couldn't cast [Evil] spells at all if you were a Good cleric. Hellbred ignore these things....no one ever said it was a valuable racial trait.

Coidzor
2010-05-15, 06:44 PM
Normally, you'd get negative levels from holding an Unholy weapon if you weren't Evil, and you couldn't cast [Evil] spells at all if you were a Good cleric. Hellbred ignore these things....no one ever said it was a valuable racial trait.

How do you get them if you're a good cleric? The reason you can't cast them as a good cleric is that your deity can't grant them to you, not that your alignment prevents casting them.

So where's a cleric getting spells from if not the deity?

Piedmon_Sama
2010-05-15, 06:48 PM
The backstory of the Hellbred goes that they're evil people who were given a second chance. A Hellbred Cleric could have his redemption/repayment of his past evil as the "cause" that grants him his power, even if he dedicates his deeds to some good-aligned god. That's not written anywhere, but it's a logical extrapolation from the fluff.

Greenish
2010-05-15, 06:52 PM
How do you get them if you're a good cleric? The reason you can't cast them as a good cleric is that your deity can't grant them to you, not that your alignment prevents casting them.

So where's a cleric getting spells from if not the deity?Good gods can (and will) grant evil spells, they just disallow their clerics from casting them. An amusing example would be the Repose domain (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/domains.htm#reposeDomain).

Teron
2010-05-15, 06:53 PM
How do you get them if you're a good cleric? The reason you can't cast them as a good cleric is that your deity can't grant them to you, not that your alignment prevents casting them.

So where's a cleric getting spells from if not the deity?
Both a cleric's alignment and his deity's can prevent him from casting aligned spells. A good hellbred cleric of a neutral god or a cause can cast evil spells, whereas a human couldn't.

The Glyphstone
2010-05-15, 06:55 PM
Good gods can (and will) grant evil spells, they just disallow their clerics from casting them. An amusing example would be the Repose domain (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/domains.htm#reposeDomain).

The irony being that Deathwatch is an Evil spell?

Coidzor
2010-05-15, 07:36 PM
Deathwatch isn't the best example though, due to it being accepted as buggered territory.

olentu
2010-05-15, 07:58 PM
I would have said page 291 but then I remembered that pelor is evil.


On a more reasonable note summoning spells.

Noedig
2010-05-15, 10:41 PM
Having Evil Exception says that you cast evil spells without penalty. I'd say an alignment shift is a penalty, so I think you'd be good(no pun intended). And theres no ruling(not that I found) about good clerics *not* being able to cast evil spells. It just pisses their deity off, so they dont generally do it. Then again that is what atonement is for.

If in your case if you played a hellbred DN and did all the [Evil] spells your alignment wouldn't change.

olentu
2010-05-15, 10:45 PM
Having Evil Exception says that you cast evil spells without penalty. I'd say an alignment shift is a penalty, so I think you'd be good(no pun intended). And theres no ruling(not that I found) about good clerics *not* being able to cast evil spells. It just pisses their deity off, so they dont generally do it. Then again that is what atonement is for.

If in your case if you played a hellbred DN and did all the [Evil] spells your alignment wouldn't change.

I think this is the restriction in question


Chaotic, Evil, Good, and Lawful Spells: A cleric can’t cast spells
of an alignment opposed to his own or his deity’s (if he has one). For
example, a good cleric (or a neutral cleric of a good deity) cannot cast
evil spells. Spells associated with particular alignments are indicated
by the chaos, evil, good, and law descriptors in their spell
descriptions (see Chapter 11: Spells).

As for evil exception I would have to look it up for specifics.