Batman vs Ozymandias

[Dhavaer]

Well, why not?

I'd say they're pretty evenly matched. Both planners and plotters, both gifted physically, mentally and financially.

I'd give it to Ozymandias, on the grounds that I don't think Batman can catch bullets.

[KayJay]

Are we referring to ozymandias, Apocalypse's henchman? If so, I know nothing about him other than the fact that he probably isn't too strong, to defer to Apocalypse all the time :)

[Bakta]

Nope,

The catching bullet, barring a mistake, refers to Watchmen's ozymandias.

In which case, Ozy would think that fighting, even the Bat, might be too crude.

[sun_tzu]

Close fight. Very close fight.
Batman has a bit of Ozymondias and a bit of Rohrsarch in him...Can't catch bullets, tough. Ozy would win in a straight-up fight. If Batman decided instead to bide his time and plan a strike from the shadows, it would turn into a VERY interesting duel of minds...I think Ozy's close to Bats' level in terms of cunning, but probably a notch below, giving Batman a realistic chance of winning.
Either way, very close fight.

[Dhavaer]

So Ozymandias > Batman in terms of physical power, and Batman > Ozymandias in terms of cunning?

[nothingclever]

So Ozymandias > Batman in terms of physical power, and Batman > Ozymandias in terms of cunning?
Which is the outcome of every Batman versus thread.

[sun_tzu]

Which is the outcome of every Batman versus thread.

All right. I'll remedy to it shortly.

[Thray]

I think if Ozymandias targeted Batman outside of combat, he would probably win (Ozymandias seems to have more social/business connections, wheres most of Batman's stuff is inside his lair, giving Ozymandias an extreme social advantage).

[Piedmon_Sama]

I think people give Ozy a little too much credit--yes, his feat was impressive, but remember it took him years to accomplish and he was unopposed throughout. No one tried to stop him until it was too late. Veidt has never encountered an intellect to match his own before, wheras Batman has battled "level 12 intellects" from Lex Luthor to Brainiac.

[Tarlonniel]

Batman has battled "level 12 intellects" from Lex Luthor to Brainiac.

So has Superman, but apparently that doesn't gain him any smart points.

[Tabmow]

I think people give Ozy a little too much credit--yes, his feat was impressive, but remember it took him years to accomplish and he was unopposed throughout. No one tried to stop him until it was too late.

Wait, we're counting being clever enough to act for years without anyone catching on to oppose him against Ozymandias?

[SumGuy]

I think if Ozymandias targeted Batman outside of combat, he would probably win (Ozymandias seems to have more social/business connections, wheres most of Batman's stuff is inside his lair, giving Ozymandias an extreme social advantage).


I disagree wholeheartedly. Bruce Wayne is, depending on which era of the comic we're talking about, either the owner or figurehead of Wayne Enterprises and the President of the Wayne Foundation. Thats a lot of social and political capital ripe for use. Also, Bruce is RICH on a level above and beyond Bill Gates, which is how he is able to finance himself as Batman. Granted, I think that if Ozy actually attacked Batman in a social setting, it wouldnt even be a question that the Bat would go down hard.

Edit: Btw, since we're talking about the various intellect levels of DC heros, can anyone link me to a site which contains this info?

[Dragonmuncher]

Ozy is the smartest man in the world, and he's a better fighter than Batman.

Ozy wins.

[Holy_Knight]

Ozy is the smartest man in the world, and he's a better fighter than Batman.

Ozy wins.
Since they're from different worlds, it's not a given that Ozy actually is smarter than Batman, though they're certainly a good match for each other intellectually. I don't agree that Ozymandias is a better fighter, though. As for this:



I'd give it to Ozymandias, on the grounds that I don't think Batman can catch bullets.
No, Batman doesn't catch bullets--he evades them. That's advantage Batman if you ask me, especially when you look at the recovery time Ozymandias needs after catching one.

[Pax_Chi]

I'd say this is Batman's fight to lose, depending on whether or not he underestimates Ozy.

On average, Batman's physically more impressive, more skilled and carries better weaponry. Ozy's big combat feats to date are being able to defeat two relatively unimpressive street level fighters. His other big feat is being able to catch a single bullet fired at him, the cost of which is injuring his hands and briefly stunning himself, because he was forced to catch a bullet that he couldn't dodge. Batman, conversely, can dodge bullets on a nightly basis, and has at least once deflected a bullet with a batarang.

In a physical fight, Batman would probably handily defeat Ozy.

In a planning fight, Batman's probably superior as well. Ozy's big competition in his scheme was a group of out mostly out of shape costumed adventurers with no high technology, esoteric skills or impressive abilities beyond Nightowl's tech, all of which was below Batman's tech level. Ozy's only true problem was Dr. Manhattan, a superhuman that could basically be described as Firestorm with an unreliable precognitative sense that he fooled with some clever tactics.

Ozy really didn't have any competition for his little plan. There's no way he would have been able to pull it off in the DC or Marvel settings. Too many heroes more compitent than he is.

I'd say Batman with a solid majority, barring Bruce severely underestimating this Watchman.

[The_Werebear]

I think in pure hand to hand, they are evenly matched. Also, they appear to be about as smart as each other. However, Ozymandias has a much higher ego than Batman, and Batman has 400+ handy gadgets on him at all times. Ozymandias keeps those in his lair.

In neutral ground, Bats takes Ozymandias after a long, drawn out, grueling, hit and run fight.

Oh, and someone mentioned that Ozymandias can catch bullets. Since when does Batman shoot people?

[Dhavaer]

He throws Batarangs.

[The_Werebear]

But Batman throws three in close sucession, and the first one would probably take Ozy's fingers off when he caught it.

[Dhavaer]

I don't think it would be any more dangerous to catch a batarang than a bullet.

[The_Werebear]

Until the next two hit you.

Of course, the lack of follow up bullets in the comic did prevent us from judging how the next two sharp object heading for his head would affect him.

[Holy_Knight]

Until the next two hit you.

Of course, the lack of follow up bullets in the comic did prevent us from judging how the next two sharp object heading for his head would affect him.
Considering that catching it left him flat on the ground, it seems pretty clear that one is his limit. If nothing else, that leaves him very vulnerable to whatever follow-up attack comes next.

[bluish_wolf]

Well, why not?

I'd say they're pretty evenly matched. Both planners and plotters, both gifted physically, mentally and financially.

I'd give it to Ozymandias, on the grounds that I don't think Batman can catch bullets.

When did Ramesses the Great learn how to catch bullets?

[The_Werebear]

When did Ramesses the Great learn how to catch bullets?

More importantly, since when does Ozymandias use a gun?

[Rex_Hondo]

This might be considered a copout, but I give this one even odds. The only certainty is that it would be long, drawn out, and ugly.

[Holy_Knight]

This might be considered a copout, but I give this one even odds. The only certainty is that it would be long, drawn out, and ugly.
What a copout!

[Ugly_Panda]

Time for lateral thinking.

Ozymandias doesn't hesitate to kill people, Batman doesn't kill at all. Even if Batman somehow manages to beat Ozymandias, Batman is going to get blown up.