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Godskook
2010-05-23, 08:18 AM
Ok, its one of the better methods of avoiding detection out there, but other than a few base classes(Rogue, Scout, and Ranger) and a item/template, I don't really know of any ways to pick this up. So, what ways are there to get HiPS, and what're the limitations on that source of it?

Greenish
2010-05-23, 08:25 AM
Hide in Plain Sight (or similar) (also see the "camouflage" section)
Ranger 17 - natural terrain
Scout 14 - natural terrain
Illusionist 15 (class variant), Unearthed Arcana - unconditional
Assassin 8, ecl 13 - within 10 feet of a shadow
Shadowdancer 1, ecl 8 - within 10 feet of a shadow
Nightsong Infiltrator 10, ecl 17 - natural terrain
Dark Lantern 9, ecl 14, Eberron: Five Nations - does not require natural terrain or concealment, in fact seems totally unconditional
Scar Enforcer 7, ecl 12, Races of Destiny - natural terrain
Wildrunner 5, ecl 10, Races of the Wild - natural terrain
Stalker of Kharesh 4, ecl 9, Book of Exalted Deeds, w/quarter cover or quarter concealment
Wilderness Rogue (UA)
Umbral Disciple 3, ecl 8, Magic of Incarnum, see text
Luiren Marchwarden 5, ECL 10, FR: Shining South - doesn't require cover or concealment, but only works in specific region
Shadar-Kai, race, Fiend Folio, ecl 4
Lurking Terror 3, ecl 8, Libris Mortis - requires cover or concealment
Paladin 6 (Shadow Cloak Knight substitution level), Champions of Valor web enhancement - near shadows
Justice of Weald and Woe 9, ecl 15, FR: Champions of Ruin - natural terrain
Hellbreaker 1, ecl 6, Fiendish Codex II, in any kind of darkness, not called "hide in plain sight"
Shadowspy 9, ecl 13, Complete Champion, in area of sunlight
Sentinel of Bharrai 5, ecl 10, Book of Exalted Deeds, within 10' of natural terrain
Eye of Lloth 6, ecl ?, Drow of the Underdark, within 10' of shadow
Ebonmar Infiltrator 8, ecl 13, Cityscapehttp://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19871954/Lists_of_Stuff

Project_Mayhem
2010-05-23, 08:51 AM
Sources of HiPS? Near the waist of big girls :smalltongue:

Flame of Anor
2010-05-23, 09:08 AM
Sources of HiPS? Near the waist of big girls :smalltongue:

I...like...small Hide penalties and I cannot lie!

Kobold-Bard
2010-05-23, 09:34 AM
This thread caused me great irritation because I couldn't remember what HiPS stood for. I almost started yelling at my computer because I was determined to remember and not cheat and use Google :smalltongue:

Godskook
2010-05-23, 09:39 AM
I...like...small Hide penalties and I cannot lie!

Nah, the original version is Big penalties. I mean, man, I can see those from space.

Tyrandar
2010-05-23, 11:03 AM
I...like...small Hide penalties and I cannot lie!

My class selection brings all the boys to yard. :smallamused:

Zeta Kai
2010-05-23, 01:15 PM
My HiPS, my HiPS, my HiPS!

My lovely lady lips!

:smallredface:

Curmudgeon
2010-05-23, 01:27 PM
Do note that there are many versions of Hide in Plain Sight, and though the name is the same the capabilities vary considerably.

Generally speaking, the Supernatural forms (Assassin, Shadowdancer) remove both Hide requirements (cover/concealment, and not being observed); the Extraordinary versions only satisfy the latter one. The Dark Creature template version also adds additional restrictions, so I think it's the weakest of all of them.

Seffbasilisk
2010-05-23, 03:06 PM
The Dark Template from Tome of Magic, gives HiPS so long as there is some form of shadow.

+1 LA, with a few other happy bonuses.

For sneak-tastic goodness, look at putting the Dark Creature template on a Whispergnome.

Kobold-Bard
2010-05-23, 03:10 PM
Don't forget the Darkstalker feat from Lords of Madness.

Curmudgeon
2010-05-23, 04:00 PM
The Dark Template from Tome of Magic, gives HiPS so long as there is some form of shadow.
You're misremembering your HiPS versions.
Hide in Plain Sight (Ex): Use the Hide skill even while being observed (except in natural daylight, the area of a daylight spell, or a similar ettect).
Hide in Plain Sight (Su): A shadowdancer can use the Hide skill even while being observed. As long as she is within 10 feet of some sort of shadow, a shadowdancer can hide herself from view in the open without anything to actually hide behind.
Really significant differences. A Shadowdancer can Hide 10' removed from the shadow of a blade of grass. A Dark Creature always needs to be in cover/concealment, and still has no HiPS if outside in daytime.

AvatarZero
2010-05-23, 05:53 PM
Don't forget Rich's Divine Trickster. It's only two clicks away as you read this.

Supernatural HiPS (as the actress said to the bishop), but it's completely unconditional. You could disappear while standing on a podium in broad daylight surrounded by people who have all cast True Seeing. Play a goblin, max out your Hide check, utterly ruin the game for everyone else by being impossible to see.

Kobold-Bard
2010-05-23, 05:54 PM
Don't forget Rich's Divine Trickster. It's only two clicks away as you read this.

Supernatural HiPS (as the actress said to the bishop), but it's completely unconditional. You could disappear while standing on a podium in broad daylight surrounded by people who have all cast True Seeing. Play a goblin, max out your Hide check, utterly ruin the game for everyone else by being impossible to see.

Just pray there's no Psions with Mindsight.

AvatarZero
2010-05-23, 05:58 PM
Just pray there's no Psions with Mindsight.

Darkstalker feat. Can Hide/Flank targets with senses that would otherwise negate those abilities.

What now, motherhubbard!?

Kobold-Bard
2010-05-23, 06:00 PM
Darkstalker feat. Can Hide/Flank targets with senses that would otherwise negate those abilities.

What now, motherhubbard!?

Breath weapon with multi-stacked enlarge breath feat, the clinging breath to deal extra damage the next round to make sure. Burn the entire world to a cinder just to make sure you get them.

Checkmate mofo :smallwink:

Togo
2010-05-23, 06:03 PM
Darkstalker feat. Can Hide/Flank targets with senses that would otherwise negate those abilities.

What now, motherhubbard!?

Max out your spot?

AvatarZero
2010-05-23, 06:10 PM
Breath weapon with multi-stacked enlarge breath feat, the clinging breath to deal extra damage the next round to make sure. Burn the entire world to a cinder just to make sure you get them.

Checkmate mofo :smallwink:

Yeah, because there's no chance that my 13th level character who needed 2d6 sneak attack to qualify for his prestige class has Evasion and an ungodly Reflex save. [/sarcasm]

Meanwhile, even with the -20 hide check penalty for sniping, anything with a breath weapon has exactly no chance whatsoever of spotting the DT while he dumps Dual Wield full attack dagger sneak attacks for 20d6 damage a round, every round, for the next few hours.

Oh, the nerd war is on, now! I'm probably enjoying this too much.

edit:


Max out your spot?

the issue there is that Hide is much easier to increase than Spot, and most high level detection effects focus on magical stealth, ie. illusions and invisibility.

I'm pretty sure that I can get this Goblin Rogue 3 / Cleric 3 / Divine Trickster 7 up to Hide 95 on a natural one. Difficult to get spot that high.

Wings of Peace
2010-05-24, 12:58 AM
Hellbreaker and Lurking Terror are your best options as both function while concealed, not fully concealed, just concealed *nudges incarnum*. Lurking Terror is debataly the best but it requires you be undead. Not hard but something to think about.