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View Full Version : Help With A Dagger-Wielding Paladin [3.5]



Mr.Bookworm
2010-05-24, 09:38 PM
I'm currently building a Human Paladin 6 who will be wielding a dagger (punching variety, if it matters). It'll be Dex and Cha focused, with light armor.

I'm looking for advice on how to build this guy.

As there is no other humor in this post, I offer the following humorous wordplay as compensation:

Two guys walk into a bar.

The third one ducks.

krossbow
2010-05-24, 09:41 PM
I'm currently building a Human Paladin 6 who will be wielding a dagger (punching variety, if it matters). It'll be Dex and Cha focused, with light armor.

I'm looking for advice on how to build this guy.

As there is no other humor in this post, I offer the following humorous wordplay as compensation:

Two guys walk into a bar.

The third one ducks.



i add FOOR THE EMPRAH.

IonDragon
2010-05-24, 09:46 PM
Um... If you're looking for how to make him optimized... Come up with a new concept. Sorry, but that's just TERRIBLE.

Also, WHY? Paladins get Heavy Armor Prof., and Martial Weapon Prof.. Why would you not use them?

Amphetryon
2010-05-24, 09:56 PM
Bard/Paladin multiclass into Sublime Chord with the feat that allows them to stack (Devoted Performer, Complete Adventurer). Use a Whip-Dagger (DU134 p50). Please, use a Whip-Dagger (Or... DR353 p28). Bard/Cleric/Prestige Paladin/Sublime Chord is possibly better, but harder to jump through.

Without these, it's exceedingly hard to make this build concept efficient in a traditional sense.

EDIT: Sources and commentary.

Piedmon_Sama
2010-05-24, 10:04 PM
Maybe you could ask your DM about trading some some stuff like Laying on Hands and the Morale Bonus for bonus feats, and get stuff like stealthy or acrobatic strike, so your Paladin can basically hide, come out of the shadows and combine a backstab with Smite Evil. And it'd help if you took Rogue levels after Paladin 6 since the class doesn't offer much after that level anyway?

EDIT: My guess is you're going to get a lot of suggestions involving multiclassing. What I've learned from bitter, bitter experience is that the Paladin is simply not a flexible class. It's designed to be a stereotypical knight-in-shining-armor who goes sword and board or greatsword and clanks about in the heaviest armor money can buy. The very first D&D character I ever made was a Paladin who had a fullblade and also dual-wielded punching daggers and I basically had to cheat to make him and he still sucked. That was 10 years ago, but still, Paladin's nowhere near as flexible as Fighter or Rogue.

Yorrin
2010-05-24, 10:12 PM
How paladin do you want? I mean, I can toss out a LG build that includes a couple of levels of Paladin...

Bard 4/Human Paragon 3/Akodo Champion 2/Iajutsu Master 5/Exemplar 1/Marshal 1/Swordsage 2/Paladin 2

Feats: (doesn't include feats forced on you by classes)
1- Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Bastard Sword)
1- Iron Will
1- Weapon Focus (Bastard Sword)
1- Exotic Weapon Proficiency(Gnome Quick Razor)
3- Snowflake Wardance
6- Ki Shout
6- Quick Draw
9- Improved Initiative
12- Travel Devotion
15- Improved Unarmed Strike
18- Ascetic Mage

This uses Charisma out the wazoo. You're required to pick up Weapon Focus: Bastard Sword, but it works better with a Gnome Quick-Razor with the Blurstrike enchantment. The key to the build: Iajutsu Focus. You're gonna be rolling 9d6 with a Cha mod on each by lvl 16. But by 20 you'll be getting it to AC once, saves twice, to-hit 4battles a day, and your social skill will be rather impressive.

lsfreak
2010-05-24, 10:17 PM
Be a rogue. Call yourself a paladin. Sneak attack is the gods letting you see into the weakness of your opponents. Diplomacy and Intimidate are people seeing the truth of your faith. Do the standard rogue shtick (refluffed craven, weapon finesse, shadow blade). Maybe go into arcane trickster, unseen seer, or jade phoenix mage if you want a more overt magic about him. Call them all gifts from your god rather than 'I can a spell/use a maneuver.'

Thurbane
2010-05-24, 10:26 PM
...or, yanno, maybe someone just suggest him a build using his criteria? Just a thought. Not every build has to be optimized...

Yorrin
2010-05-24, 10:31 PM
...or, yanno, maybe someone just suggest him a build using his criteria? Just a thought. Not every build has to be optimized...

Sigh. Well then use the Paladin ACF to get the Cha to AC instead of saves and Pick Up the Divine Might feat to use Turn Undead attempts to add Cha to your damage a few times a day. You'll prolly want to grab a flying mount- look into Griffon or Giant Owl.

Combat Reflexes is your friend. Look in Player's Handbook 2 and Complete Warrior/Adventurer (can't remember which- AFB) for good feats regarding AOs.

Thurbane
2010-05-24, 10:36 PM
Yeah, sorry if I came accross as overly passive aggressive in that post. My bad. :smallfrown:

Anyway, a suggestion for the build: Human Paragon class (UA) will only lose you one BAB, but you'll get some sweet skills (one of which will be a class skill forever - UMD?), a bonus feat and a +2 to ability of your choice. It will also progress Paladin casting 2/3.

Yorrin
2010-05-24, 10:37 PM
Yeah, sorry if I came accross as overly passive aggressive in that post. My bad. :smallfrown:

Not your fault- the internet makes vocal tonality hard to translate. And you were right about the over-optimization mentality.

Mr.Bookworm
2010-05-24, 10:58 PM
I also forgot one critical part. Really critical.

This is core only, though I miiiiiight be able to swing one or two things by.

With that in mind, I probably will end up doing a LG Rogue who acts like a Paladin.

Though where is the whip-dagger?

EDIT: Though it would be awesome if there was any way to actually do it using a Paladin.

EDIT^2: And thanks for all of the suggestions.