Will this work ? (Ethereal jaunt + Immovable rod)

[Grifthin]

Basically this - a player essentially ruined a session of mine by becoming Ethereal (using ethereal jaunt) then activating a Immovable rod inside the enemy as he became material (ended ethereal jaunt). Since the rod was now where the dragon's brain was. Does the spell actually work like that ?

[2xMachina]

Should be shunted out for materializing in solid.

[Lord Vukodlak]

Should be shunted out for materializing in solid.

Correct, when ever attempting to planeshift or teleport inside an object by accident or design. Its the traveler who suffers.

[Rad]

For Balance's sake I'd rule that if the space where an object should materialize is occupied by another one in the prime material, the ethereal object is stuck in the ethereal plane and will "fall" down on the PM as soon as the spot frees itself. Or it could "slide" around and pop in next to the thing, but this is an ummovable rod, so that doesn't seem appropriate.
I'm not sure what the RAW i though.
Another sensible interpretation is that the immovable rod is stuck wherever it is, including the plane, so it won't materialize until it is turned off.
Just my 2cp

[QuantumSteve]

From the SRD

Ethereal Jaunt
"If you end the spell and become material while inside a material object (such as a solid wall), you are shunted off to the nearest open space and take 1d6 points of damage per 5 feet that you so travel."

[Asheram]

Note that it just says "solid object" though, so if your player had, say, placed the rod inside the dragons stomach... Well, things would perhaps be a bit different.

[Ravens_cry]

I don't see the problem with this. It is a clever use of resources. Sure, those things can end an encounter in ways you didn't expect, but I think such lateral thinking should be rewarded, not punished.

[Emmerask]

Basically this - a player essentially ruined a session of mine by becoming Ethereal (using ethereal jaunt) then activating a Immovable rod inside the enemy as he became material (ended ethereal jaunt). Since the rod was now where the dragon's brain was. Does the spell actually work like that ?

Nope does not work that way. Furthermore tell your players that everything they can do their enemies might do to them too this way all those clever instant win schemes (scry and die,commoner rail gun etc) are not used at all or only in a very desperate situation :smallwink:

[Ravens_cry]

Nope does not work that way. Furthermore tell your players that everything they can do their enemies might do to them too this way all those clever instant win schemes (scry and die,commoner rail gun etc) are not used at all or only in a very desperate situation :smallwink:
Commoner rail gun doesn't work anyway, and is an abuse of the rules as rules, precisely the kind of cheese I personally detest, even if it did. Scry and die is merely tactics, tactics that can be used against them.
Planting a rod in a baddies stomach is using the resources at hand in a creative way.
That, in my view, is a good thing.

[tyckspoon]

The rules are generally constructed so that, if you have to ask 'can I materialize something so it coexists in the same space as something else' or 'hey, if I perform this trivial task, will it kill it instantly?' the answer is No. Spells and other abilities do not do that unless their rules say they can, in which case they will usually offer a save or have some other activating condition attached.

[Flickerdart]

Materializing the rod inside the dragon's head shunts it out. Materializing it inside the dragon's stomach simply means it can't move for a while without making STR checks, after which its furnace-like digestive system destroys the rod completely.

[Ravens_cry]

The rules are generally constructed so that, if you have to ask 'can I materialize something so it coexists in the same space as something else' or 'hey, if I perform this trivial task, will it kill it instantly?' the answer is No. Spells and other abilities do not do that unless their rules say they can, in which case they will usually offer a save or have some other activating condition attached.
It won't kill it instantly, but it will slow it up significantly until it's stomach acids and crushing action make it go-by bye.
It's not dead, but it does significantly reduce it's mobility. You did just destroy a 5000 gp magic item to do so through.

[Lin Bayaseda]

If it would work, there'd be no need for an immovable rod, because materializing a simple rock inside the dragon's brain would also kill it. But it doesn't work, and that's the bottom line.

I disagree with the people who say it's "clever use of resources and should be encouraged". It's clever when it actually works. The way it was done, is nothing more than wishful thinking.

[Emmerask]

Well there are several problems with allowing such actions (the materializing it into the stomach thing):

a) how fast does species xy body fluids dissolve the rod
b) how much damage can such a rod sustain until it ceases to function
c) does this have any impact on other spells/items/abilities - we want to stay as consistent as possible as dms

Never a good idea to mix d&d with real world physics or biology, so in a session I prop would not allow it until I had time to think about it and research how it would impact gameplay :smallwink:

Well the answer to the op which we got sidetracked a bit is obviously No! it does not work this way :smallsmile:

[Ravens_cry]

Actually, there are rules for what happens when a creature is swallowed whole and the damage they take. Simply apply that to the object.
Done.

[Curmudgeon]

Dragons of Huge size and larger need to move 8,000 pounds (the Immovable Rod's force limit) just to stand up. Materialize it in their empty stomach and they'll just push it into inert (fall to the ground) mode immediately. So it really doesn't matter how long it takes to digest; it won't delay the dragon more than a single move action, if at all.

[Ravens_cry]

Dragons of Huge size and larger need to move 8,000 pounds (the Immovable Rod's force limit) just to stand up. Materialize it in their empty stomach and they'll just push it into inert (fall to the ground) mode immediately. So it really doesn't matter how long it takes to digest; it won't delay the dragon more than a single move action, if at all.
Dang. That actually makes sense.
Still, if I wanted to be a Munchkin, I cOuld point out that when "a creature pushes against an immovable rod, it must make a DC 30 Strength check to move the rod up to 10 feet in a single round." (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/rods.htm#immovableRod)
But I am not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin, not a Munchkin. . .

[Curmudgeon]

I cOuld point out that when "a creature pushes against an immovable rod, it must make a DC 30 Strength check to move the rod up to 10 feet in a single round." (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/rods.htm#immovableRod)
That's only if the dragon wants to move it in a purposeful manner. Or it could just slump a little bit (falling prone is a free action, and this is even less) and let its weight overwhelm the Rod's capacity entirely. Much simpler to let gravity solve your problem than making repeated Strength checks.

[RiOrius]

It won't kill it instantly, but it will slow it up significantly until it's stomach acids and crushing action make it go-by bye.
It's not dead, but it does significantly reduce it's mobility. You did just destroy a 5000 gp magic item to do so through.

You're going by the "rod in the stomach" tactic. What would you propose for the "rod in the brain" tactic?

It's harder to say that the dragon can live with a rod lodged in its brain, and harder to say that the rod will break in a few rounds anyway. Plus, while a stomach rod would presumably only limit the dragon's movement, a brain rod would also limit its ability to move its head (and thus breathe, bite, or even see).

My take would be to treat this tactic basically like a spell. Give the dragon a reflex save; if it fails, declare the rod is shunted and deals Xd6 damage to the dragon. Maybe half damage on a save.

Don't try to model what a dragon can do with an immovable rod in various body parts. Keep it simple to keep the game flowing and reasonable. The rules weren't made to accommodate strange situations.

[Curmudgeon]

You're going by the "rod in the stomach" tactic. What would you propose for the "rod in the brain" tactic?
That's solid tissue, so the rod is shunted away.

[AstralFire]

I would allow it in a game full of PCs who don't really push the envelope past T3/T4, with frequent rules fudging for what makes sense versus what the rules say. I wouldn't allow it at higher tiers of play. Live by the rules, die by the rules. Live by seat of my pants, die by them. :)

[Foryn Gilnith]

My take would be to treat this tactic basically like a spell. Give the dragon a reflex save; if it fails, declare the rod is shunted and deals Xd6 damage to the dragon. Maybe half damage on a save.

Fine idea. You can make it more complex by adding Knowledge (arcana) checks, Spot checks, Dexterity checks, whatever; but at the end of the way it will come down to an effect like this.

[Anxe]

The immovable rod isn't really unmovable (One can move it if 5000 pounds of pressure is exerted), so I'd say its shunted out.