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View Full Version : Best Gearless Class(3.5)



PersonMan
2010-05-26, 09:14 PM
For a campaign setting I'm building, there is a race of creatures, the Armands, who see little value in material possessions but much more in experiences, stories, etc. In my setting they love combat experience the most, and seek it out rather than avoid it.

So, I need a class that has more of a martial bent to it(no fullcasters, please) that can function fairly well without gear. If I don't find anything, they'll just end up being Monks. It's up to you to save them, Playgrounders.

arguskos
2010-05-26, 09:16 PM
inb4Totemist?

No, seriously, Totemist. Magic of Incarnum was like tailor made for this.

PersonMan
2010-05-26, 09:17 PM
I've heard so many things about that book. I really need to go buy that, once I become un-broke...

nedz
2010-05-26, 09:20 PM
Glaivelock ?
The're not really casters

Amphetryon
2010-05-26, 09:23 PM
Totemist, Dragonfire Adept, Serpent Totem Barbarian (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#serpentTotemClassFeatu res) (with Whirling Frenzy and Complete Champion's Lion Totem) into Frostrager, Savage Bard (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#bardVariantSavageBard) . There's also Druid, of course, but you asked for something that's not a full caster.

The Glyphstone
2010-05-26, 09:24 PM
Yup, you want Totemist, or even Incarnate, like there's no tomorrow.

Il_Vec
2010-05-26, 09:26 PM
Obligatory:
Have you considered Warmarked or Swordsage?

Magikeeper
2010-05-26, 09:27 PM
No fullcasters, huh? So druids are out.

An entire race of heavily optimized melee builds? That could work.

Magic of Incarnum and Tome of Battle would be of use to you. Warblades, Swordsages, and Totemists in particular.

Krazddndfreek
2010-05-26, 09:27 PM
VoP Unnarmed Swordsage works well at lower levels.

PersonMan
2010-05-26, 09:28 PM
Tome of Battle is also on my get list, although there's a copy at my local library I can get.

Eldariel
2010-05-26, 09:37 PM
Mystic Wildshape Ranger/MoMF is pretty damn good. Gets 5th level spellcasting and the all-important Wildshape. If Spellbook is allowed, Sword of the Arcane Order would lead to major profits.

balistafreak
2010-05-26, 09:41 PM
VoP Totemist.

Because I enjoy spreading the gospel, there's a reading of VoP that makes only one of the bonus feats you receive from it an Exalted feat and the rest of them bonus generic feats, which is (obviously) awesome. It's a ruling that humorously rides the line between over-the-top RAW and houseruling.

Make sure to make that one forced exalted feat Touch of Golden Ice. No really, when you're making 7 natural attacks a turn at no attack penalty it practically guarantees (at low levels) paralyzing your opponent even if he doesn't instantly dies.

How to get seven attacks? Giralon arms, using those as primary + secondary, gets you 4 attacks. Be a Warforged and add in two Warforged slams (the second one comes from a Warforged feat) and a bite (another Warforged feat). I think you can add a couple other attacks with some clever Chakra binding, but you need a much higher level than I normally play at, if I recall correctly.

VoP also works out pretty well here, because all of your natural weapons count as magical weapons. I think you actually turn a "profit" at lower levels as opposed to attempting to buy enough natural-attack improvements to cover all your attacks.

You MUST splash a level of Lion Totem Barbarian for pounce or else suck, and no, wasting a precious bind on Sphnix Claws for pounce is not the answer. When you're done taking Multiattack and Improved Multiattack, you can take other feats to improve your admittedly slower essentia progression.

JaronK
2010-05-26, 09:42 PM
Since it hasn't been mentioned enough, Totemist.

JaronK

mabriss lethe
2010-05-26, 09:45 PM
I'll throw in binder as a rather good gearless combat class. With the right vestiges, you can summon all sorts of weapons and armor, get natural weapons and charge attacks with energy damage, not to mention all sorts of other nifty tricks.

9mm
2010-05-26, 09:47 PM
this thread needs one thing... MOAR TOTEMIST!

Fax Celestis
2010-05-26, 09:49 PM
I've been toying with a Entomanthrope (Spider) Razorclaw Shifter Wildshape Ranger/Nature's Warrior/Master of Many Forms build. I'm sure it would fit here nicely.

Lycanthromancer
2010-05-26, 10:09 PM
It's not technically 'caster,' so I'll toss this in: Talashtoran monk/psychic warrior or monk/ardent. Flavor things such that you're just expending limited stamina to get shapeshifting (claws, tentacles, bite attacks, breath weapons, full-on full-body shapechanging, etc).

gallagher
2010-05-26, 10:22 PM
It's not technically 'caster,' so I'll toss this in: Talashtoran monk/psychic warrior or monk/ardent. Flavor things such that you're just expending limited stamina to get shapeshifting (claws, tentacles, bite attacks, breath weapons, full-on full-body shapechanging, etc).
great idea for the OP. expand and inertial armor is almost a necessary for the gearless warrior, and your offensive powers will keep you doing heavy damage. have a decent CON and take a level of warlock and the hellfireloc levels, then you wont need the offensive powers, you still get evasion and wis to armor, and wont need to go talashtoran. thats just a fun way to be flavorful and cool/scary, and not necessarily optimized.

dgnslyr
2010-05-26, 10:30 PM
Well, since a swordsage with Improved Unarmed Strike is basically a monk that doesn't suck, that would work out pretty nicely.

Thurbane
2010-05-26, 10:30 PM
I'll throw in binder as a rather good gearless combat class. With the right vestiges, you can summon all sorts of weapons and armor, get natural weapons and charge attacks with energy damage, not to mention all sorts of other nifty tricks.
Seconded. Much love for Binders here too. :smallsmile:

PersonMan
2010-05-26, 10:30 PM
Decent Con is taken care of, as is Dex, as they have +6 to each of them.

So, other than becoming un-broke and buying MoI, are there are big suggestions? Preferrably something with little multiclassing, most to all of the race is going to be like this.

Thrawn183
2010-05-26, 10:36 PM
A Crusader can heal itself without casting or magic items.

Eldariel
2010-05-26, 10:37 PM
Decent Con is taken care of, as is Dex, as they have +6 to each of them.

So, other than becoming un-broke and buying MoI, are there are big suggestions? Preferrably something with little multiclassing, most to all of the race is going to be like this.

Again, Wildshape Ranger/Master of Many Forms (with other classes to taste; Monk, Nature's Warrior, Warshaper, Abjurant Champion and company all offer various bonuses) is very easy and efficient non-equipment user.

Optimystik
2010-05-26, 10:57 PM
Even if actual manifesting is banned, Soulbow is a great gearless fighter. Go Xeph for speedy-shootiness.

Renzoku shine shine missile

Thurbane
2010-05-26, 11:49 PM
A Crusader can heal itself without casting or magic items.
So can a Binder, with Buer. Can heal the whole party, out of combat, up to full HP.

Hand_of_Vecna
2010-05-27, 10:43 AM
Since it's a homebrew race have you considered giving them something akin to VoP? Have it cost 0 feats and not grant exalted feats. Depending on how extreme the race's views are it could be much more forgiving allowing a single nonmagical weapon of any kind (and perhaps even the ancestral relic or item familiar feat) and it should allow a reasonable amount of money to be carried to pay for food and lodging (I'd remove the sustenance ability).

Of course the feat will be conditional on a set of morals appropriate to the race and might allow all alignments as long as the subject isn't greedy for material goods and you should probably allow those who fall to atone.

Thurbane
2010-05-27, 10:27 PM
Since it's a homebrew race have you considered giving them something akin to VoP?
I assumed he was talking about the Armand from MM III?

Endarire
2010-05-27, 10:30 PM
Does a Soulknife count?

Also, a Hood (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872838/Little_Red_Raiding_Hood_A_Tale_of_38_Guide_to_the_ 35_Dragoon) that focuses on unarmed attacks and natural weapons.

Lycanthromancer
2010-05-27, 10:38 PM
Does a Soulknife count?Not really, no. They need extra WBL to make up for their horrible class features.

Kalaska'Agathas
2010-05-27, 11:54 PM
It's not technically 'caster,' so I'll toss this in: Talashtoran monk/psychic warrior or monk/ardent. Flavor things such that you're just expending limited stamina to get shapeshifting (claws, tentacles, bite attacks, breath weapons, full-on full-body shapechanging, etc).

Yeah, that. That or a mix of that and Incarnate and Totemist (Soulborn is sadly not so good).

QuantumSteve
2010-05-27, 11:55 PM
Since it's a homebrew race have you considered giving them something akin to VoP? Have it cost 0 feats and not grant exalted feats. Depending on how extreme the race's views are it could be much more forgiving allowing a single nonmagical weapon of any kind (and perhaps even the ancestral relic or item familiar feat) and it should allow a reasonable amount of money to be carried to pay for food and lodging (I'd remove the sustenance ability).

Of course the feat will be conditional on a set of morals appropriate to the race and might allow all alignments as long as the subject isn't greedy for material goods and you should probably allow those who fall to atone.

^This. Even just altering an existing race (i.e. Armand) to be a race of martial fighters without wealth, it's a lot easier to give them special abilities in lieu of expensive gear than to use try to char op gearless classes. You get a lot more versatility too, these guys can be any class you want and still be level appropriate rather than all being shoehorned into whatever class works mechanically.