Playing a Paladin 3.5

[Froogleyboy]

Okay, one of my players for this game is going to be playing as a paladin. Now, this is his first time gaming, and I'm worried he's gonna get frustrated with all the rules and codes of honor for Paladins. Are there any tips for paladins that keep them fun without them simply being a walking code-of-honor
(and no, Unearthed arcana is not allowed)

[Prodan]

Play a Crusader.

[The Cat Goddess]

Avoid the stupid cliche of "Code of Conduct is an excuse to mess with a character". In a campaign where it's reasonably obvious who the good guys are and who the bad guys are, the Paladin's Code of Conduct doesn't significantly hinder the player... and can even allow for RPing opportunities.

[Private-Prinny]

Play a Crusader.

+1 to this.

Of course, depending on the party, a paladin can still be good.
Some basic tips:

Phylactery of Faithfulness should be bought ASAP.
Paladins get great splat support. Complete Champion in particular has such amazing things as Battle Blessing.
Talk things out with your DM, because whether or not your buddy's paladin falls is entirely up to him.
Make damn sure that his mount has wings, since you can't trade it out for an ACF.

[quiet1mi]

Complete Scoundrel: Agressive Scoundrel mixed with Divine Scoundrel...

[Stompy]

Okay, one of my players for this game is going to be playing as a paladin. Now, this is his first time gaming, and I'm worried he's gonna get frustrated with all the rules and codes of honor for Paladins. Are there any tips for paladins that keep them fun without them simply being a walking code-of-honor
(and no, Unearthed arcana is not allowed)

Honestly, the DM nor the player shouldn't let the code of conduct be strangle-hold tight, especially if it alienates non-evil party members.

I recommend a three strikes system, instead of zero tolerance "lolhax lose your paladin stuffs because you lied" system. Remove strikes when appropiate, like when the paladin feels sorry about his transgressions.

This system should not be used in the event the paladin does something outrageously evil and willing.

[PId6]

Make him fall and get him to become a Blackguard.

[Froogleyboy]

Okay, I believe there's a misunderstanding. I'm the DM, but my friend is playing the pally

[Runestar]

Then you may want to first discuss with him what an acceptable code of conduct entails, rather than find yourself having to do a lot of fire-fighting ingame. :smallamused:

[QuantumSteve]

If your player wants to play a Pally, he should already have an idea of what "honor" means to him. Sit him down and hash out what he thinks it means to be a Paladin. Personally, I think the Code of Conduct as is in the PH is downright awful, but it makes for a good starting point for what the Code should be.
As long as you and he are on the same page as to how his character is required to act, problems should be minimal. No Phylactery of Faithfulness needed.:smallbiggrin:

[Froogleyboy]

{Scrubbed}

[Lev]

{Scrubbed}

[Froogleyboy]

It was his idea, but lets not touch that subject

[Marriclay]

generally, he can be the same happy go lucky sword swinging murderer that the fighter is. he just has to be a bit more pious about it, and not go drinking and flirting afterwards. beyond that, just get him to go to his church every once in a while, report to priests about his adventurers, maybe get him to make sure that his allies are safe, and generally be a nice guy. as long as he doesn't start stabbing people in the back, consorting with demons, or something like that, he should be perfectly fine playing DnD like anybody else, codes or no

[Dracons]

I'll echo what others say. Sit down with him, and come up with a fair code for him, based on who his God is and what temple he is from. Being a Paladin of a God of Justice would have a differnt code from a God of Venegence, a God of Love, and a God of Knowledge.

For any of the above, if a Paladin went against a dark lich, the God of Justice would likely try to imprison him to stand trial of all his crimes, a paladin of venegence would likely slay the lich to avenge all those he ever killed, a god of love may try to get some kind of redeeming factor, such as bringing in descedents, or losted love ones etc, and a god of knowledge would likely try to preserve the lich's knowledge for all to share, even if its dark and forbidden, if anything to keep it hidden from evil.

Just sit down, and get a code of honor you feel is both fair, somewhat easy to follow without breaking it, but not so easy it never comes into play.

Even stuff like drinking gets people in a tift, such beer is a poison, and paladins can't use it.

[Ferrin]

{Scrubbed}

I like that new non-violence conduct you have there, much better then what it was during the crusades.

Instead of forcing it on him he should just show him the BoED, probably has a lot more he'd want if he plays a paladin for flavor. :smallwink:

[Ravens_cry]

A paladin must be the open hand of mercy and closed fist of justice.
In them is entwined the Holy Opposites, justice and mercy.
You are not merely Lawful and Good, you are Lawful Good.
Do not be so hard hearted your justice turns to vengeance, do not be so soft as to let evil loose upon the world.
Remember, you do not carry the whole world on your shoulder. You are not a god, you can not be everywhere at once,you can not foresee every result of every action. Work to find new answers in apparent dichotomy.
You have chosen a hard road, and a narrow one.
It is not an easy thing to be the one to stand before others and say, 'No, this is wrong.'
It is also not easy to realize you yourself can be wrong.
Go forth, Paladin, and add what rightness you can to the world.
If you leave this world better then you entered, then it is enough.
Your journey awaits.

[Lev]

{Scrubbed}

[The Cat Goddess]

{Scrubbed}

[Ferrin]

{Scrubbed}

While I'd love to talk about it, we really shouldn't. Let's just say that people in power tend to abuse it.

[Ravens_cry]

Yes, this is precisely why we cannot discuss this here.

[Ferrin]

But back to the topic! I think everyone would agree with that! :smallwink:

I have nothing more to add then letting him take a look at the BoED.

[Anterean]

Basically what the cat goddess said earlier.

You are the GM and as such you decide what the specifics of the code is, when to whack him in the head with it, and more importantly when not to.
If you don´t go out of your way to make the code a ball and chain for your friend, such as having him fall for killing the one neutral orc that was fighting to defend his tribe when the adventures come to put and end to them raiding the country side, you properly won´t have a problem.

[Killer Angel]

Well, he's quite the bible thumper irl, so we're gonna use that as his code. Very convinent, no?

Leaving rl implication aside, there's no problem, it's very easy to not mess with anyone who plays a pally.
Speak with him and discover what kind of pally he wants to play: the good and chivalrous type ala Parsifal? A ready to fight and righteous smiter of all evil? Set the code of conduct accordingly to what he expects.

[gorfnab]

You could modify the the Latin Rule (http://books.google.com/books?id=cBqgOXfMxAoC&dq=%22Knights+Templar%22+%2B%22Latin+Rule%22&printsec=frontcover&source=in&hl=en&ei=64r_S7W3L8H38AavwNXsDQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=11&ved=0CD8Q6AEwCg#v=onepage&q=%22Knights%20Templar%22%20%2B%22Latin%20Rule%22&f=false) (the codes of conduct starts on page 19), as in the code of conduct of the Knights Templar, into something usable for your paladin.

[Ossian]

Never had any problems with Paladins' codes of conduct.

Tip: if your party is not composed by randomly murderous thieves with a plot-excuse for killing and stealing you shou... wait, never mind, it is D&D.

Well, you can play a fighter, and let the character say that he is a "noble knight and a paladin of XY"

Or play a cleric, and call it a paladin. It's a religious dude with combat buffs.

I mean, if the player has (as he seems to) some kind of already stringent and relatively high-morality code of conduct IRL, the paladin should not pose a challenge. The rest of the party, on the other hand, probably will.

Before you get into arguments, ask yourself what do you want from this campaign. If you have a bunch of people blasting their way up the social ladder and killing the occasional evil overlord to atone for their sins, paladin just does not fit.

O.

[paddyfool]

- Take a look at Fax Celestis' Paladin (http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&ved=0CBQQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.giantitp.com%2Fforums%2Fshowt hread.php%3Ft%3D33551&rct=j&q=fax+celestis+paladin&ei=DJD_S-fbMo_u0wT0l5n3Ag&usg=AFQjCNGMbZRO4vqYKRUuYzfQJF72GK3Orw). It's very customisable by doctrine, and scales better than the standard Pally.

- Consider offering him a more SAD version of the Pally, that bases his class abilities off either Wis or Cha rather than a mix of the two (effectively either giving him "Serenity" or "Charismatic Priest" as a bonus feat).

- Consider offering him a shorter recharge time on his Smite Evils, and/or the Pathfinder version ("if it doesn't hit, it isn't spent").

But yeah, codewise, you're doing it well to talk it through with him beforehand.

[Kaiyanwang]

Leaving rl implication aside, there's no problem, it's very easy to not mess with anyone who plays a pally.
Speak with him and discover what kind of pally he wants to play: the good and chivalrous type ala Parsifal? A ready to fight and righteous smiter of all evil? Set the code of conduct accordingly to what he expects.

Agree. The OP is the DM, so he can fit the code for the player.

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff of Moddingham: Real world religion and politics are Inappropriate Topics on this Forum. Give these inappropriate topics a wide berth. They are broad subject matter bans. There is no "clean," "innocuous," or "undisputed" allowances here.