View Full Version : Size...Does it matter.

2010-06-09, 09:14 PM
Hi we have a barbarian joining our soon to start campaign and they want to use a two sided weapon...like the orc double axe.

He changed to Dual wielding greataxes..how do we do this...I still think size will be what he needs to alter. Is there an easy way to do this?

2010-06-09, 09:19 PM
Orcs are medium. Double weapons are generally pretty bad, but if you don't need the feat to use one, they're a decent alternative to TWF (generally doing ever so slightly more damage on the offhand). A double-weapon build is mechanically identical to a TWF build. Recommend bonus damage (Sneak Attack, mostly), though a Warblade using Tiger Claw might be interesting...

2010-06-09, 09:19 PM
Hi we have a barbarian joining our soon to start campaign and they want to use a two sided weapon...like the orc double axe.

he is going to be playing an Orc. Im not sure on the size category of them, but i think he needs a size increase. I might be wrong.

Also anyone have any nice double weapon barbarian builds or ways to assist me in this idea?

What do you mean by this? In what regard does he "need" it?

2010-06-09, 09:19 PM
With a title like that, you might get a couple dozen posts about anatomy.

Orcs are medium, most weapons are statted for medium (including the double-axe), and the double-axe is not a good choice for a weapon simply because Two-Weapon-Fighting is not a good choice for a combat style for a Barbarian.

Please take simple questions to this thread next time: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148242)

2010-06-09, 09:24 PM
Ok, we have moved past the double weapon i guess..we are now on to how can he dual wield great axes.

edited main post.

2010-06-09, 09:39 PM
Dual-wielding battle axes can be done with the Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting feat. Using a two-hander, like the great axe, in one hand is more difficult; I'm not actually sure of any way to do that. The Dwarven Waraxe, though, is a hand-and-a-half weapon that can be wielded one-handed if you have the Exotic Weapon Proficiency in it.

I do not recommend doing either of these things. Both are basically wastes of feats.

2010-06-09, 09:45 PM
Welp im open to suggestions..for a nice barbarian setup so he can feel he is powerful and such.

2010-06-09, 09:48 PM
Lion Spirit Totem Barbarian ACF (from Complete Champion) is excellent - he trades Fast Movement (minor) for Pounce (a huge deal). While this is pretty obviously better than Fast Movement, which may concern a DM, having Pounce is inherently more fun than not. With Pounce, he can move and not lose his iteratives, which means he doesn't lose out on most of his damage at higher levels. Pounce is basically necessary if he's going to do the TWF bit.

But a Barbarian does much better with a two-handed weapon than not. Take Barbarian, add Power Attack and Shocktrooper, and you're well on your way to becoming a serious powerhouse. Charge in and tear things to shreds.

2010-06-09, 09:52 PM
book for shocktrooper pls?
Thank you for that...was considering making him a grappler.

2010-06-09, 10:00 PM
Grappling is pretty much awful. It just... doesn't work right. The differences in modifiers are just too large. If you can compete with big beasties, then you auto-crush everything your own size. If you can't compete with the big beasties... why are you even bothering?

Forget where Shocktrooper is from (Complete Warrior, at a guess), but basically when you use Power Attack, you lose AC instead of Attack. Requires Power Attack (obviously); might require a certain amount of Strength or BAB, not sure. You still can't lose more AC than you have BAB.

2010-06-09, 10:05 PM
Ok, glad i did not do that then.

Shocktrooper seems pretty good. Now what do i do with his 10 levels? all 10 barb? or take some prc?

2010-06-09, 10:10 PM
Personally, I have little use for Barbarian; Rage is good but you don't get additional Rages per day at a rate fast enough to justify levels in the class, you get Pounce at 1, Trap Sense is useless, and the DR, again, nice, but not worth the levels.

However, I'm not sure what would be best. It depends on what he wants to do...

Also, you might consider the Water Orc (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/elementalRacialVariants.htm#waterOrcs) for some extra Str, and possibly becoming Dragonborn (Races of the Dragon) for extra Con. Dragonborn Water Orcs are basically the pinnacle of Big Stupid Fighter races.

2010-06-09, 10:56 PM
There are plenty of options for Barbarians that might help. A Fangshields Barbarian substitution level (Champions of Valor, page 40) could replace trap sense with charge movement enhancements -- but you need to be other than humanoid. One useful option is the Feral template (Savage Species, page 116), which makes you a monstrous humanoid. You get a pretty good return in boosts that synergize with Barbarian class features for LA +1, which you can buy off for 3,000 XP at class level 3. You could also look into charge enhancements in the online Cityscape web enhancement (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070228a).

If you're concerned with inadequate rages per day, take Extra Rage (Complete Warrior). You can always retrain this feat (using the rules in Players Handbook II) later as your rages from class levels increase.

2010-06-09, 11:14 PM
With the dms help we made this

3Barbarian/7 Weapon master (sword and fist)

4 flaws

ring of greater enlarge person...allows him to add 2 size categories...his first game..dms choice...cool..w/e..wheres mine...


+3 Greataxe: Keen/Flaming burst
+3 Greataxe: Keen/Frozen burst???

All prereqs for the weaponmaster..are the feats..its the whirlwind line.

What do yall think?

Also before yall ask..the ki critical..says improved critical and get a +2 to crit range...keen is acting as that...asked the dm and approved.

2010-06-09, 11:53 PM
3Barbarian/7 Weapon master (sword and fist)
Just in case you're unaware, the Exotic Weapon Master in Complete Warrior is the official replacement for this class, as stipulated by WotC here (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/20050110x). The old class is invalid in any game that uses Complete Warrior.

2010-06-10, 12:05 AM
I have to say, I don't really hold that WotC rule valid in the case of class 'replacements' that are wildly different from the original. The 3.0 Exotic Weapon Master and 3.0 Spellsword are both good examples.

The Rabbler
2010-06-10, 12:17 AM
I'd go for something along the lines of:

barb 1 (lion totem and whirling frenzy)/Rogue 2 (precise strike (I think))/Fighter 2/Full BaB 1/Fun PrC 4.

if he grabs craven, this will give him an extra 1d6+10 sneak attack damage on every hit. get combat reflexes (huge means lots of reach) and give him a good dex. throw on shock trooper and power attack, and you've got a giant, angry, dual-axe wielding, orc who is surprisingly good at doing damage.

Add the TWF chain and he can make 4 attacks by level 7, and 5 if he rages. each attack is 1d12+5+1/2 str. if he manages to get a flanker (or dip swordsage for Island of Blades and have a teammate nearby), he gets another 1d6+10 damage.

I think that might be good enough to make a newbie feel powerful. This could easily be better-optimized, but I feel like getting stuff (even if it isn't all that much) from lots of sources gives a feeling of power.

2010-06-10, 12:31 AM
at the person who said something about the replacement...meh...i dont know how he is running that but allowed for this one. I like this one heh.

now to help with this setup.

This is what we have.

Custom Human 5 Assassin (houserules starter)/2 Spellwarp Sniper
Elf 1 Ranger/9 Druid: Thinking of going full druid and still working in the TWF...its what she wants.
Warforged Juggernaut

This guy wants the orc and the two handers..hope that helps...We got the flanking down...we got the damage output and a tank like person. This guy needs to be a nice damage source and i figured the improved crit i think it becomes 17-20 with a x4 multiplier...not bad for him.