PDA

View Full Version : Small and Smart? (3.5)



OMG PONIES
2010-06-15, 12:11 PM
Straightforward question: are there any small (or smaller) races that give a bonus to INT?

I've got a factotum/wizard based loosely on Winston Wolfe from Pulp Fiction, but I'm trying to make him as small as possible for some stealth bonuses. If no good races are available, I'm pretty set on playing him as a Whisper Gnome, but I'd like to see what's out there.

Rannil
2010-06-15, 12:21 PM
Tinker gnomes from the Dragonlance setting. Also no LA.

And Pixies! Lots of LA though.

Greenish
2010-06-15, 12:22 PM
Petal is tiny fey at +2 LA, but is listed as cohort only.

Kobolds are small, and with their Slight Build racial count as one size smaller when it's beneficial for them.

OMG PONIES
2010-06-15, 12:24 PM
Would Slight Build count when it comes to, say, size bonuses to Hide?

Greenish
2010-06-15, 12:27 PM
Would Slight Build count when it comes to, say, size bonuses to Hide?
Slight Build: The physical stature of kobolds lets them function in many ways as if they were one size category smaller. Whenever a kobold is subject to a size modifier or special size modifier for an opposed check (such as Hide), the kobold is treated as one size smaller if doing so is advantageous to the character. A kobold is also considered to be one size smaller when "squeezing" through a restrictive space. A kobold can use weapons designed for a creature one size smaller without penalty. However, the space and reach of a kobold remain those of a creature of their actual size. The benefits of this racial trait stack with the effects of powers, abilities, and spells that change the subject's size category.Races of the Dragon web enhancement (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a).

Kylarra
2010-06-15, 02:11 PM
Beguiler! obligatory text

OMG PONIES
2010-06-15, 03:15 PM
I've heard whispers of this Beguiler race. Where can I find it?

Rannil
2010-06-15, 03:21 PM
I've heard whispers of this Beguiler race. Where can I find it?

Shining South pg 60

It appears to be a rat. Small enough?
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/84366.jpg

Shamefully I don't have that book.

Also check out this link (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=7631.0;wap2). Shows stats and stuff.

Greenish
2010-06-15, 03:32 PM
It appears to be a rat. Small enough?Rats are Tiny. Beguiler is just Small.

Endarire
2010-06-15, 03:37 PM
Blue (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/monsters/blue.htm).

They should be LA 0 instead. The Expanded Psionics Handbook had them LA0 on a page and LA1 on the next.

Darrin
2010-06-15, 03:49 PM
Straightforward question: are there any small (or smaller) races that give a bonus to INT?


Lesser Tiefling (Player's Guide to Faerun): +2 Dex, +2 Int, -2 Cha. Humanoid with Extraplanar subtype.

Savage Progression Drow (WotC online article (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a)): +2 Dex, -2 Con, +2 Int. You can just skip/ignore the 2 racial class levels.

Arcane Gnomes from Dragon #291: -2 Str, +2 Con, +2 Int, -2 Wis ,UMD is always a class skill (not exactly a concern for a Factotum), no speak with animals, favored class wizard.

Dragonwrought Kobold can get up to +3 Int based on the age category.

Fax Celestis
2010-06-15, 04:06 PM
You could try my kobold. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105775)

Frosty
2010-06-15, 04:30 PM
Beguilers need to be Lightning-heavy Warmages. *runs*

Dusk Eclipse
2010-06-15, 04:35 PM
Beguilers need to be Lightning-heavy Warmages. *runs*

I see what you did there.

Kylarra
2010-06-15, 04:36 PM
Beguilers need to be Lightning-heavy Warmages. *runs*Nah, just conjurer spec'd wizards with eidetic spellcaster. :smallcool:

Frosty
2010-06-15, 04:41 PM
They also need Silent Spell as they can't form the right words for magical incantations, what with their limited vocabulary and all (some would call it singular).

Dusk Eclipse
2010-06-15, 04:49 PM
They also need Silent Spell as they can't form the right words for magical incantations, what with their limited vocabulary and all (some would call it singular).

CURSE YOU FROSTY now I want to play one....

Frosty
2010-06-15, 05:02 PM
CURSE YOU FROSTY now I want to play one....

My work here is done :smallbiggrin: Now remember to diversify...your vocabulary doesn't HAVE to be singular. You can mix it up between "Pea" "Pika" and "Pikachu" and there are all sorts of differeent tones and inflections to use!

I recommend going for the Elemental Savant prestige class.

Mark Hall
2010-06-15, 05:02 PM
Rats are Tiny. Beguiler is just Small.

So they're rodents of unusual size?

Are we sure they exist?

Dusk Eclipse
2010-06-15, 05:12 PM
My work here is done :smallbiggrin: Now remember to diversify...your vocabulary doesn't HAVE to be singular. You can mix it up between "Pea" "Pika" and "Pikachu" and there are all sorts of differeent tones and inflections to use!

I recommend going for the Elemental Savant prestige class.

I hate you :smallannoyed:, you have no idea on how much I hate you







:smalltongue:

Greenish
2010-06-15, 05:15 PM
Nah, just conjurer spec'd wizards with eidetic spellcaster. :smallcool:Sorcerers with Spell Thematics. Brilliant feat, that.

KillianHawkeye
2010-06-15, 05:16 PM
Blue (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/monsters/blue.htm).

They should be LA 0 instead. The Expanded Psionics Handbook had them LA0 on a page and LA1 on the next.

They were errata'd to be LA +1, so the SRD version is "correct" (for certain definitions of correct).

Frosty
2010-06-15, 05:28 PM
I hate you :smallannoyed:, you have no idea on how much I hate you







:smalltongue:

You should be thanking me! It's your DM who should be hating me :smallwink:

TurtleKing
2010-06-15, 05:33 PM
On the Beguiler note what would happen if they touched a thunderstone...?:smallwink:

Greenish
2010-06-15, 05:33 PM
They were errata'd to be LA +1, so the SRD version is "correct" (for certain definitions of correct).Goblins are rather poor even for +0 LA creatures, but give them one(!) power point and BAM! they become +1 LA. :smallamused:

Seriously, blues are more overtaxed than hobgoblins, the posterboys for undeserved LA.

Frosty
2010-06-15, 05:35 PM
On the Beguiler note what would happen if they touched a thunderstone...?:smallwink:

Don't do it unless you've learned everything you wanted to learn! It'll become the bigger and slower Rai-guiler!

KillianHawkeye
2010-06-15, 05:35 PM
That's why I added that little disclaimer at the end of my post. :smallwink:

Akal Saris
2010-06-15, 09:38 PM
If you play a beguiler, keep an eye out for stone dragon crusaders and dwarven defenders. They're Ground-types.

Thurbane
2010-06-15, 09:40 PM
Lesser Tiefling (Player's Guide to Faerun): +2 Dex, +2 Int, -2 Cha. Humanoid with Extraplanar subtype.

Savage Progression Drow (WotC online article (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a)): +2 Dex, -2 Con, +2 Int. You can just skip/ignore the 2 racial class levels.
...um, aren't these both medium races?

Mongoose87
2010-06-15, 09:45 PM
...um, aren't these both medium races?

You're a medium race!


:smallfurious:




:smallbiggrin:

Vaynor
2010-06-15, 09:49 PM
The Beguiler is not a playable race according to Shining South, it has LA +0 (Cohort) and does not advance through character levels. Unless this was changed in another book (errata?).

Darrin
2010-06-15, 10:51 PM
...um, aren't these both medium races?

Whoops. Forgot about the OP... I was just brain-dumping Int bonus races.

Uh... well... you can apply the Corrupted template from BoVD, and then the Dungeonbred template from Dungeonscape to drop them by a size category.

dspeyer
2010-06-15, 11:02 PM
LA 0:

Old gnome
Grey elf with permanenced reduce person

LA 1:

Blue

LA 2:

Phrenic (anything small)
Wyrmling Copper Dragon (if you can make the RHD work for you)

gorfnab
2010-06-16, 12:21 AM
The Beguiler is not a playable race according to Shining South, it has LA +0 (Cohort) and does not advance through character levels. Unless this was changed in another book (errata?).
That's what DM fiat is for. I'm currently playing a Beguiler Beguiler in a campaign and it actually works out very nicely. Since it is not humanoid it makes for some rather interesting roleplaying situations too.

Also I think Pikachu would be closer to a Beguiler Incarnate with the Lightning Gauntlets soulmeld.

And then there is this build using Beguiler. Ling Ling from Drawn Together
(http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1276.0)

Vaynor
2010-06-16, 01:00 AM
That's what DM fiat is for. I'm currently playing a Beguiler Beguiler in a campaign and it actually works out very nicely. Since it is not humanoid it makes for some rather interesting roleplaying situations too.

Also I think Pikachu would be closer to a Beguiler Incarnate with the Lightning Gauntlets soulmeld.

And then there is this build using Beguiler. Ling Ling from Drawn Together
(http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1276.0)

I hope he removed the true sight ability and the large Dex bonus, because that's very overpowered for an LA +0.