[3.5] An LA 0 race

[Marriclay]

Alright, I'm building a character for a gestalt game, and the DM has told us that 1 side has to be entirely Level adjustment or RHD. We're starting at Level 10, and I wanted to use Monster of legend from the MM2, since the update to 3.5 provides it with a nice +7 LA.

unfortunately, it doesn't work on humanoids, so I was wondering if someone knew of a good monstrous humanoid race with a total effective level of +3 or less?

[Ilmryn]

Alright, I'm building a character for a gestalt game, and the DM has told us that 1 side has to be entirely Level adjustment or RHD. We're starting at Level 10, and I wanted to use Monster of legend from the MM2, since the update to 3.5 provides it with a nice +7 LA.

unfortunately, it doesn't work on humanoids, so I was wondering if someone knew of a good monstrous humanoid race with a total effective level of +3 or less?

The Feral Createre template from savage species is LA +1, can be applied to any humanoid, and changes your type to monsterous humanoid.

[sonofzeal]

Not an optimal choice at all, but I've always loved Gnolls...

[Greenish]

Dragonic Half-Minotaur Goliath is +3 LA Monstrous Humanoid.

[Thrice Dead Cat]

Primordial (LA +2) Incarnate Construct Warforged is +0LA with the giant type. Throw on something for the remaining LA for fun and profit.

[Zovc]

The Feral Createre template from savage species is LA +1, can be applied to any humanoid, and changes your type to monsterous humanoid.

Feral is a great template.

If you aren't casting spells, Mineral Warrior is always good. LA+1 (Doesn't change your creature type.)

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

As others have said, Feral from Savage Species is spectacular for +1 LA and changes your type to monstrous humanoid.

Goliath in Races of Stone is a +1 LA monstrous humanoid base race.

Llolth-Touched in Monster Manual IV is extremely powerful for a +1 LA, though it has some RP implications and changes your alignment to chaotic evil. If possible adapt it to whichever deity you intend for your character to worship and switch it to a more playable alignment/flavor.

Shadow Creature in Lords of Madness is a +2 LA and gives superb benefits, including fast healing and permanent total concealment as long as you carry a parasol (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0700.html).

Phrenic Creature is a +2 LA that gives quite a few strong psi-like abilities and power resistance, along with some decent bonuses to your mental stats.

Personally, I'd go with a Goliath Shadow Creature, since opponents will always suffer a 50% miss chance against you, and it will be impossible to target you with any spells that don't require an attack roll or affect an area. You'd be an extraplanar creature native to the plane of shadow, but that will seldom come into play.


Edit: You could just scrap the Monster of Legend idea and make a Tauric Human + Lammasu (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/lammasu.htm). That would have 7 HD and a +3 LA, Pounce with two rakes, flight, a permanent Magic Circle which ignores SR, and +10 natural armor. Best of all, you'd get 7th level Cleric spellcasting as a racial ability that doesn't count as having been gained at any particular character level, so you could take Cleric 10 on the other side of the build and have 17th level Cleric spellcasting. I'd probably include three levels of Prestige Paladin (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/prestigiousCharacterClasses.htm#prestigePaladin), especially since you could probably get the DM to allow you to use Spirited Charge without being mounted like similar creatures (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/inevitable.htm#zelekhut), which could lead to Leap Attack + Shock Trooper + Pounce shenanigans. Even if he won't let you have spellcasting above your character level, get one Cleric level for turn undead and two more domains along with Prestige Paladin 3 and fill the other six levels with whatever you want. Your racial HD will give you Fighter BAB, d10 HP, and good Fort and Reflex saves, so you could easily have a +10 BAB without Persistent Divine Power.

[Fax Celestis]

Lizardfolk are 2 RHD/LA +1 and are Monstrous Humanoid (Reptilian).

[Lycanthromancer]

Necropolitan with as many instances of evolved undead as you can fit in.

Both are from Libris Mortis.

Wait, shouldn't necropolitans come in three adjacent flavors?

[TroubleBrewing]

Dragonic Half-Minotaur Goliath is +3 LA Monstrous Humanoid.

This. If you wanted supreme silliness, add Dragonborn of Bahamut on it for FREE! Granted, then you have to be good. Which can be kind of rough. But it depends on your play style.

[oxybe]

Necropolitan with as many instances of evolved undead as you can fit in.

Both are from Libris Mortis.

Wait, shouldn't necropolitans come in three adjacent flavors?
http://dallaspenn.com/pics/albums/album01/franenberry.jpghttp://sylviagarza.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/boo-berry-cereal-box-11.jpghttp://blogs.babycenter.com/momformation/files/2009/03/count_chocula.jpg

[Lycanthromancer]

http://dallaspenn.com/pics/albums/album01/franenberry.jpghttp://sylviagarza.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/boo-berry-cereal-box-11.jpghttp://blogs.babycenter.com/momformation/files/2009/03/count_chocula.jpgI do believe Frankenberry is a servant of Tem-Et-Nu.

[Morph Bark]

Is there any template that grants Powerful Build?

Because that would be great on a Dragonborn Incarnate Warforged...

[Greenish]

Is there any template that grants Powerful Build?Not that I know of, but well, you could just take half-minotaur and get the actual size. Reach is pretty nice.

[Keld Denar]

Necropolitan with as many instances of evolved undead as you can fit in.

Both are from Libris Mortis.

This. Now be a Sorcerer or similarly Cha based caster. Every level you gain, you'll gain a +1 DC on all spells. Better yet, be a Sorcadin gish so you can take advantage of the Str too. You'll have a HUGE Natural Armor from stacking Evolved, which you can convert to a Deflection bonus with a casting of Scintilating Scales. So, your AC will be really high, your saves will all be really high (from Divine Grace), and you'll have a bunch of spellcasting to further augement your badassery.

Hmmmm, if you were a Dragonwraught Kobold before becoming a necropolitan, would you still qualify for Draconic Rites?

Alternatively, sub Necropolitan for Gravetouched Ghoul (also LM). Its a +2 LA template that gives you some great ability mods, paralyzing touch, 3 natural attacks (with Multiattack as a bonus feat), and some other abilities. Then stack Evolved as high as you can.

[Morph Bark]

Not that I know of, but well, you could just take half-minotaur and get the actual size. Reach is pretty nice.

Yes, but imagine a Half-Minotaur with Powerful Build... :smalltongue:

Reason I asked is because Powerful Build is one of the few things you keep when you go Dragonborn.

[IdleMuse]

Strictly RAW, some instances of Powerful Build aren't that usefulwith size increases. Take Jotunbrud for instance, the Human regional powerful build-like feat. It specifically lets you count "as large" for the purposes of certain tests, not one size category larger.

The Goliath's Powerful Build DOES specifically state that it stacks with size-changes though, and is thus one of the nicer ways of getting it.

[PlzBreakMyCmpAn]

Is there any template that grants Powerful Build?

Because that would be great on a Dragonborn Incarnate Warforged...Yes stoneboned. Fail opti-fu around here...

[Morph Bark]

Dragonic Half-Minotaur Goliath is +3 LA Monstrous Humanoid.

Feral in place of Draconic works better. :smalltongue:


Yes Stone boned. Fail opti-fu around here...

Source?

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Stone Boned isn't anywhere in the official monster index (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/lists/monsters), and it's not in crystalkeep's 3.5 or 3.0 template index. Probably 3rd party, in which case you can also make a craft check to create a nonmagical weapon with a natural threat/crit of 1-20/x4.

[Volthawk]

Stoneboned is in Dragon 350. And it is on Crystal Keep, Page 22. One word, not two.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

That explains it, but I don't see any reason to take that over Goliath. Assuming you go Stoneboned Human you'd have to spend your extra feat on Evolved to get rid of the speed or dex penalty, and you'd still have a higher LA. Goliath + Feral or Draconic or Mineral Warrior or Llolth-Touched would be way better than using that at the same LA. While it is a template that grants powerful build, there are very few times when it would be an optimal choice.

[2xMachina]

Lets you use other races though.

Take a small race (I remember a thread on this), tack on Stoneboned, Half Minotaur, Half Orge.

Large size, counting as huge, with a LOAD of +Str from race.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Half-Goristro (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060630a) gives Str +8, Con +8, plus a size increase if you're Large or smaller. Get Major Titan Bloodline (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/bloodlines.htm#titan) for oversized weapon at 11th level.

That makes a Poison Dusk Lizardfolk (small, no Str penalty),
Stoneboned (powerful build, +4 Str),
Half-Minotaur (medium, +8 Str),
Half-Ogre (large, +12 Str),
Half-Fiend Goristro (huge, +16 Str),
Major Titan Bloodline (oversized weapon, +1 Str)
Huge size, Strength 70 (18 base, 41 race, 5 levels, 6 enhancement), colossal size weapon.

[Bayar]

Wasn't Shadow Creature reprinted in Tome of Magic with a LA of +1 ?

[Snake-Aes]

Half-Goristro (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060630a) gives Str +8, Con +8, plus a size increase if you're Large or smaller. Get Major Titan Bloodline (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/bloodlines.htm#titan) for oversized weapon at 11th level.

That makes a Poison Dusk Lizardfolk (small, no Str penalty),
Stoneboned (powerful build, +4 Str),
Half-Minotaur (medium, +8 Str),
Half-Ogre (large, +12 Str),
Half-Fiend Goristro (huge, +16 Str),
Major Titan Bloodline (oversized weapon, +1 Str)
Huge size, Strength 70 (18 base, 41 race, 5 levels, 6 enhancement), colossal size weapon.

I want to go to their yearly family reunions.

[Volthawk]

Wasn't Shadow Creature reprinted in Tome of Magic with a LA of +1 ?

Nope, that's Dark, the diluted version

[2xMachina]

I want to go to their yearly family reunions.

A wizard did it. Breeding program.

[Lycanthromancer]

A wizard did it. Breeding program.That's what she said.

...The wizard, that is.

[Heliomance]

Necropolitan with as many instances of evolved undead as you can fit in.


Kinda tricky, seeing as Evolved comes with rules on how to apply it. You've got a 1% chance of getting the template for every hundred years you've been undead.

[oxybe]

That's what she said.

...The wizard, that is.

said wizard also produced a thesis showing how the experiment can actually be repeated not only in a controlled environment, but also in the wild. several pages are extraneous padding and ego-inflation, but the theory is sound and has proven to be invaluable in certain circles, mostly the lower variety.

[2xMachina]

Just say you're old. Very old. Like ancient. Very ancient.

[Lycanthromancer]

Just say you're old. Very old. Like ancient. Very ancient.Or just really really attuned to the negative energy plane. Given that you're level 10, you could cast bestow curse to do this, which you'd cast at level-up. After all, Savage Species indicated that you could curse someone to age another age category, which could very well be +100 years for an undead (and it wouldn't affect you negatively at all, being the evil dead and all).

[2xMachina]

Heck. Planeshift over to the negative energy plane and live there. Am I attuned? You bet I am.

BTW, is there a negative energy planetouched?

[Lycanthromancer]

Take the 1st level of the ghost savage progression, from Ghostwalk? If you're a spellcaster you won't generally need strength anyway (and frees up some points from the Con you don't have), and that +18 Cha from 9 levels in evolved undead will net you a decent AC in addition to your spellcasting and incorporeal traits.

So, let's say Sorcerer X/PrC X//Savage Ghost 1/Evolved Undead 9. Take a PrC that grants access to more spells, such as Rainbow Servant or Sandshaper (hell, go both!).

Ooh. A Sandshaper ghost?

POLTERGEIST!

[Lord Vukodlak]

Alright, I'm building a character for a gestalt game, and the DM has told us that 1 side has to be entirely Level adjustment or RHD. We're starting at Level 10, and I wanted to use Monster of legend from the MM2, since the update to 3.5 provides it with a nice +7 LA.

unfortunately, it doesn't work on humanoids, so I was wondering if someone knew of a good monstrous humanoid race with a total effective level of +3 or less?

Some other ideas, a Weretiger has 6HD and a +3 level adjustment, it certainly provide some nice adjustments.


Heck. Planeshift over to the negative energy plane and live there. Am I attuned? You bet I am.

BTW, is there a negative energy planetouched?

Planetouched are descendants of citizens of those planes. I suppose of a living creature dwelt in the negative energy plane it could produce planetouched descendants. However I think it be unlikely.