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FallenWarriorIV
2010-06-26, 09:52 PM
In Races of Stone, page 133 it says that slight of hand checks can be used to make your verbal and somatic components less obtrusive. But in Complete Scoundrel, page 85 has the same thing but with a limit of once per encounter and more prerequisites. Which is right?

Ranos
2010-06-26, 09:54 PM
Both are. The races of stone alternate skill use just makes the skill trick useless.

FallenWarriorIV
2010-06-26, 10:08 PM
So there's no reason to think that one supersedes the other?

Curmudgeon
2010-06-26, 10:09 PM
Both are. The races of stone alternate skill use just makes the skill trick useless.
That's not quite true. Using Sleight of Hand alone to obfuscate your spellcasting keeps the casting from being noticed, but it doesn't keep you from letting your guard down (i.e., provoking attacks of opportunity). The Conceal Spellcasting skill trick also prevents opponents from making AoOs against you even if you don't cast defensively.

FallenWarriorIV
2010-06-26, 10:17 PM
Man, I could hug you! I've been trying to puzzle that out for nearly a week now.

herrhauptmann
2010-06-26, 10:23 PM
Addendum, how do you think that would work when threatened by a person with the feat 'mageslayer.'
Mageslayer itself shuts down all defensive casting within reach.

FallenWarriorIV
2010-06-26, 10:31 PM
I'd have to read the feat to be able to say. What book is that from?

herrhauptmann
2010-06-26, 10:53 PM
Complete arcane, minis handbook, and I'd swear it's in a later monster manual (near hobgoblin entry)

FallenWarriorIV
2010-06-27, 12:38 AM
Well, I think the Skill Trick would still work, because you're not actually fighting defensively, it's just that the opponent doesn't know you're casting.

Curmudgeon
2010-06-27, 01:09 AM
If you have a higher Sleight of Hand check, Conceal Spellcasting will allow you to cast without provoking AoOs, despite not casting defensively. The only thing Mage Slayer will do to you is let you know that you'll need to use the skill trick. :smallbiggrin: