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Lord Loss
2010-06-30, 01:35 PM
For a campaign that i play in, I'm bringing in a new character: A Dragonborn Sorcerer/ Frost Mage. The PCs are lvl 19. there's no heavy optimization, but the party consists of a Druid and a Paladin that's higher level than us . Therefore, I'm making this character as powerful as he can be within the limits of his classes. The frost Magic feat's Prereqs are modified (houserule).

Here is the character. I have been alotted 560 000 dollars, and have used 309 100 Gold Pieces so far. Also, ranks in Knowledge aern't used except for PrC entry (houserule)

http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=219958

Any modifications I should make?

Siosilvar
2010-06-30, 02:37 PM
I have been alotted 560 000 dollars, and have used 309 100 Gold Pieces so far.

What's the conversion rate on that?

Lord Loss
2010-06-30, 04:45 PM
Erm, by dollars, i meant GP. Srry, I'm tired at the moment.

Keld Denar
2010-06-30, 05:08 PM
Can't open the sheet from work, but I'll check the thread again after I get home. Key thing about sorcerers is to make sure you don't have very many redundant spells. For example, if you have Fireball, you don't really need Lightning Bolt. Sure, there are situations where Lightning Bolt is better, but for most things, Fireball gets the job done and is a little more versatile.

Make sure you have at least one spell that targets each save, one spell that doesn't allow a save (uses touch attacks), and one spell that doesn't allow SR. That keeps you pretty well rounded in nearely every situation. From there, fill in with utility and whatever you feel is appropriate.

Runestar
2010-06-30, 06:24 PM
I recommend heighten spell and slow. Many monsters at higher lvs still have poor will saves, but are protected by an assortment of immunities. Heightened slow can easily make short work of any melee foe reliant on multiple attacks, such as the tarrasque. :smallsmile:

Critical
2010-06-30, 06:27 PM
I'd say you could do a little bit more opti-fu than just straight Frost Mage when you have a druid in your party, but that's just me. 9 Sorcerer levels seems bad to me, try to not up your sorcerer level higher than 6, fill it with PrC's instead, Sand Shaper might be good here, though you do lose a caster level, you gain a huge spell list, you could ask for a refluff to make the spells snowy instead of sandy, if you want. You're missing Polymorph and Alter Self spells, they're really must-have IMO, gives a Sorc more versatility. Get some Sorcerer-only spells from Races of the Dragon, especially Wings of Cover and Wings of Flurry. Get Nerveskitter for your level 1 slot, obligatory. Replace Fly with something else and use Alter Self instead. I'd replace Mass Charm Monster with something else, since most of monsters of that level are immune to mind-affecting spells. Seems fine otherwise.

Lord Loss
2010-06-30, 06:41 PM
I'd say you could do a little bit more opti-fu than just straight Frost Mage when you have a druid in your party, but that's just me. 9 Sorcerer levels seems bad to me, try to not up your sorcerer level higher than 6, fill it with PrC's instead, Sand Shaper might be good here, though you do lose a caster level, you gain a huge spell list, you could ask for a refluff to make the spells snowy instead of sandy, if you want. You're missing Polymorph and Alter Self spells, they're really must-have IMO, gives a Sorc more versatility. Get some Sorcerer-only spells from Races of the Dragon, especially Wings of Cover and Wings of Flurry. Get Nerveskitter for your level 1 slot, obligatory. Replace Fly with something else and use Alter Self instead. I'd replace Mass Charm Monster with something else, since most of monsters of that level are immune to mind-affecting spells. Seems fine otherwise.

What book is Nerveskitter from? I didn't get polymorph because I have shapechange. Switching out Frost Mage for Sand Shaper 8/???5/Sorcerer 6

Also, seeing as I lose a level nine spell, should I keep time stop or Shapechange?

Currently modifying...

Also, are desert insight spells are added to my spell list or my spells known?

Critical
2010-06-30, 06:51 PM
What book is Nerveskitter from? I didn't get polymorph because I have shapechange. Switching out Frost Mage for Sand Snow Shaper 9/???4/Sorcerer 6

Currently modifying...
Ow, right, forgot about Shapechange, sorry. :smallbiggrin: There shouldn't really be more than 2 levels in Sand Snow Shaper, really. I'd do something like Sorcerer 5/Sand Snow Shaper 2/Fatespinner 4/Sacred Exorcist 2(?)/Archmage 5, fits your Paladin Frost Mage concept too. :smallbiggrin: Replace Archmage with more Sacred Exorcist if desired.

EDIT: And the spells are availible to you as any spell you know, as the description states, that's why it's so good. :smallsmile:

Lord Loss
2010-06-30, 07:04 PM
Thanks. Still modifying. What books are Fatespinner and Sacred exorcist from...

Critical
2010-06-30, 07:08 PM
Thanks. Still modifying. What books are Fatespinner and Sacred exorcist from...
Fatespinner's from Complete Arcane, Sacred Exorcist's from Complete Divine. Nerveskitter is from Spell Compendium, by the way.

Lord Loss
2010-06-30, 07:15 PM
Of the three, I only have CD. Also, should I keep Shapechange or Time Stop?

Critical
2010-06-30, 07:19 PM
Of the three, I only have CD. Also, should I keep Shapechange or Time Stop?

Whoah, pretty strict over here. Lets see then, how about Sorcerer 5/Snow Shaper 1/Frost Mage 4/Sacred Exorcist 5/Archmage 5? And out of those two spells, I'd get Shapechange first, because you can turn into a Choker and have enough of the speed. :smalltongue:

Lord Loss
2010-06-30, 07:22 PM
Also, when archmage says Spell Slot, does it means Spell per day or spell known (Havent played a caster in a long while)

CD's in French, so I'll translate to the best of my ability

dextercorvia
2010-06-30, 07:27 PM
Slot=Spell per day

Critical
2010-06-30, 07:28 PM
Also, when archmage says Spell Slot, does it means Spell per day or spell known (Havent played a caster in a long while)

CD's in French, so I'll translate to the best of my ability
If you're talking about the High arcana power costs, then it's the Spells per Day.

EDIT: Swordsage'd.

Runestar
2010-06-30, 07:39 PM
If you are taking nerveskitter, consider taking chain spell as well, so you can boost your entire party.

Between shapechange and timestop, I would choose timestop, if only because it is easier to run. If you want to transform, consider dragonshape from PHB2, if only because it breaks the game less.

Greater celerity isn't all that useful unless you have full-round actions (metamagicked spells?) You would be no worse off taking celerity instead. Iron body also seems questionable, as does mass charm monster. Consider replacing them with mindblank (good buff for fighters), maze and greater arcane fusion.

Arcane spellsurge is a great spell as well.

Your lower lv spells are also quite limited in use. Power word: pain, the stat boosters (barring imbued summoning) and fireball are flat out useless at this point. Maybe bring in some swift-action spells or buffs such as false life/vampiric touch. Benign transposition is nice as well.

PId6
2010-06-30, 07:39 PM
At this level? I would say that Sand Shaper's extra versatility, while nice to have, isn't really needed when you already have a pretty big list and you can supplement your spells known with your vast WBL. The lost CL isn't really worth it IMO.

Sorcerer 5/Frost Mage 8/Ruathar 1/Abjurant Champion 5

Ruathar is from Races of the Wild, and it lets you qualify for Abjurant Champion. Abjurant Champion is from Complete Mage, and provides very nice boosts to AC as well as lets you freely quicken lower-level abjuration spells. If you gain levels afterward, just keep taking them in Frost Mage.

Lord Loss
2010-06-30, 07:50 PM
What does WBL stand for? Also, I'll switch out the stat booster but I think I'll keep Sand Shaper. Thanks for all the help (not to mention patience), I really appreciate it.

The Glyphstone
2010-06-30, 07:52 PM
Wealth By Level.

PId6
2010-06-30, 07:58 PM
What does WBL stand for?
Wealth by Level as Glyphstone said. Basically, you've enough gold at 19th level that you can afford items like Knowstones, Drake Helms, Runestaves, and even regular Scrolls and Wands to expand your spell list.

Lord Loss
2010-07-01, 05:57 AM
What spell should I contingency? I thought either Limited wish to rez myself or port to the church where my followers are gathered.

PId6
2010-07-01, 06:14 AM
Contingency requires actually casting the spell when you cast that, so you'll have to pay the XP cost for Limited Wish when you set the Contingency. That means that if you don't use it during that time, you've wasted 300 XP. Not a huge deal at your level, but something to keep in mind. Extend it so that it lasts twice the number of days if you do choose something like this.

Limited Wish for Revivify is fairly good, giving you a second chance at life. Otherwise, Contingent Teleport, Dimension Door, or Resilient Sphere for protection purposes is a good idea. It's usually best to leave it as an "OH SHI-" button to save your hide when all else is lost.

Lord Loss
2010-07-01, 06:23 AM
So, I guess I'll Contingency Greater Teleport to my private Church/Tower that houses and trains Paladins, Exorcists, Clerics and Dragonhunters of Bahamut (Only hunt Evil Dragons).. I took leadership and I'm debating what class to build him as.

Critical
2010-07-01, 06:32 AM
Limited Wish won't work, since you can Contingency level 6 spell tops. How about Polymorph from a scroll to Polymorph into a Troll or some other creature with regen when you're low on HP?

Lord Loss
2010-07-01, 06:49 AM
good idea. Polymorph it is. Is the price per spell on the scroll or for the whole bundle?

http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=219958

Critical
2010-07-01, 07:11 AM
good idea. Polymorph it is. Is the price per spell on the scroll or for the whole bundle?

http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=219958

Um, sorry, didn't understand. By the way - add Mage Armor and Shield to your spells, your AC is low.

Lord Loss
2010-07-01, 07:15 AM
Good idea. Should I also, buy more AC boosting items? If so, which ones?

Critical
2010-07-01, 07:22 AM
Good idea. Should I also, buy more AC boosting items? If so, which ones?
Do you have access to Magic Item Compendium and would your DM allow custom items made via formulas from DMG(they're cheesy, though)?

Rothen
2010-07-01, 07:22 AM
Do you have the Magic Item Compendium? I can really reccomend runestaves to help with your Spells Known.

Essentially, they allow you to cast a spell that is not on your Spells Known list X times per day, although you still have to use up an appropriate spell slot for the day.
It's great for stuff like Mage Armor, since you'll only cast it 1/day.

Prime32
2010-07-01, 07:56 AM
Um, sorry, didn't understand. By the way - add Mage Armor and Shield to your spells, your AC is low.mirror image, blur and displacement will provide better protection, assuming your enemies don't have true seeing. And if they do, blink retains effectiveness.

Lord Loss
2010-07-01, 08:20 AM
Do you have access to Magic Item Compendium and would your DM allow custom items made via formulas from DMG(they're cheesy, though)?

Yes, I have MIC. What items should I get?

@ Rothen. I got the Runestaff of Destruction. Any others I should get?

Critical
2010-07-01, 09:07 AM
Yes, I have MIC. What items should I get?

@ Rothen. I got the Runestaff of Destruction. Any others I should get?
Lets see, get Psychoactive Skin of Tumbler and spend a rank or two in tumble, definitely Belt of Battle, get +1 Warning Dagger for an Initiative boost, +X Ghost Ward Buckler and +X Twilight Mithral Chainmail. Grab a Vest of Resistance +5 and a Raptor's Mask, too.
And, uh, follow Prime32's advice and get Mirror Image, Greater one if you have PHB2 availible. :smallwink:

Lord Loss
2010-07-01, 09:46 AM
Thanks for all the help! Extra Thanks to Critical, who provided tons of suggestions, I realy needed it! I'm going to The Game in roughly thirty minutes. Wish me luck!

Fouredged Sword
2010-07-01, 09:50 AM
Take a hard look at versitile spellcaster and practical metamagic. Maximize is nice, but generaly not as good as a empower at only +1 level cost. Expecialy when you can use two slots of one level to cast the spells of the next. This will really help counter the loss of a ninth level spell from sandshaper.

Also arcane thisis your best damage spell. Now it is empowered for free. (-1 for practical metamagic, -1 for thisis)

Pop open Races of the Dragon to find em.

Also if you really want to be a pain, pull out felldrain from liber mortis. Practical metmagic that and you can be throwing our negative levels like candy. Even fireball is useful of everything in the area takes a negative level. Magic missile becomes just unfair to any groups of foes not shielded.

May have a alignment problem with that last one though.

Lord Loss
2010-07-01, 09:54 AM
Take a hard look at versitile spellcaster and practical metamagic. Maximize is nice, but generaly not as good as a empower at only +1 level cost. Expecialy when you can use two slots of one level to cast the spells of the next. This will really help counter the loss of a ninth level spell from sandshaper.

Also arcane thisis your best damage spell. Now it is empowered for free. (-1 for practical metamagic, -1 for thisis)

Pop open Races of the Dragon to find em.

Also if you really want to be a pain, pull out felldrain from liber mortis. Practical metmagic that and you can be throwing our negative levels like candy. Even fireball is useful of everything in the area takes a negative level. Magic missile becomes just unfair to any groups of foes not shielded.

May have a alignment problem with that last one though.

what book is practical metamagic from?

Fouredged Sword
2010-07-01, 11:18 AM
Both Practical Metamagic and Versatile Spellcaster share the same page 101 of RotD. As a dragonborn sorcerer you are a perfect fit for both. It really makes empower shine in later levels.

I am a real fan of quicken Truestrike + empowered, empowered, empowered, Disintegrate. It hits hard (5d6 per level, caps at 50d6). Use vs wizards and such with low fort saves or it deals only 12d6.

Metamagic reducers are your friend.

I would also consider a change of class setup. If you want to go to town with arcane metamagic I strongly suggest a Ultimate Magus. You need one level of wizard, one level of spellthief and some early entry cheeze to gain a second level spell at first level, but it lets you have a pool of spells to sacrifice for metamagic. One level one spells is worth an empowered or extended 9th level spell. Play your cards right and you can even persist a ninth level spell.

This is likely a little far from the base concept though.

PId6
2010-07-01, 04:26 PM
Limited Wish won't work, since you can Contingency level 6 spell tops.
*cough*Reserves of Strength*Cough* :smallwink:

Runestar
2010-07-01, 05:24 PM
I am a real fan of quicken Truestrike + empowered, empowered, empowered, Disintegrate. It hits hard (5d6 per level, caps at 50d6). Use vs wizards and such with low fort saves or it deals only 12d6.

You can only apply a metamagic feat to a spell once in 3.5e, IIRC.