lvl 0 elites in training homebrew campaign

[J Do Baggins]

I am starting a new campaign for my group. I want them to make level 0 characters. During our fist session they will be put through a tet or an obstacle course or some kind of preformance evaluation which will determine there class. See in this world there is war comeing and there a been a conscription order everyone must fight. The pc's will all be people who were average until he came to the evalution the there true skill shown though. I wantthem when they roll there chatacters to keep all 4d6 for there stats. This is an age where gun powder has recently been debeloped. There are crude hernades and single fire muskets pistolsand canons but its still more common for people to use the standard weapons once inside of gun range. There arent tabdard wizzards magicis on its way out. Wizzards are mostly enchanters diviners and transmutations. Sorcerers areonly capable of illusions and divinations. There is still holy magic granted through faith in the gods. I am goig to make a new ranger combat style. A gernade thrower/ gunslinger. Kind of minute man style. He game will focus initially on the pc's being engaged in a massive war after a few levels they will be recognized for there amazing skill and be selected for an elite combat team. Navy seal/ army rangr style team. Go on behind enemy lines type missions and what not. Well any ideas, suggestions, tips, advice, please leave a comment, if your just gonna leave a rude remark please just dont. I will right up the info on the ranger subclas and post it soon.

[Milskidasith]

I don't like this idea; your players are going to want to pick their class, not have it assigned. This is especially bad with an obstacle course because I really can't see how you could even get many roles (basically any caster) if you don't already have levels in it, and the difference between basically all the martial classes at climbing over things is minimal.

[J Do Baggins]

its not really assigned, its they will get the class they act like, if you sneak around you'll be a rouge if you charge in head first with out thinking, you be a barb, if you sit back a plan out the whole ordeal you can be a wizzard but as i explained casters are very dulled down i am more wanting them around as an npc class, and obstacle course was a bad discription, preformance exam wou0ld better describe it, i'm gonna put in all the pc's into a series of situations and see how they react to them. my group rotates 3 different games and we are never shy about telling eachother how we feel about our games. if they don't like theis one next time my turn roles around we'll do something different

[Evard]

I LOVE the idea of running through an obstacle coarse to see which class my new character will be....

Could you post your obstacle coarse?

[Lev]

Er...
Why not just give them a choice of mundane classes to choose from and go from there?

I like the idea of a training camp background though, it's kind of like Starship Troopers except you could get all the players in the same tent instead of segregating the pilots and the military and the special forces. It worked in the movie, but only because all of Rico's friends became sub-characters after he made new ones.

[J Do Baggins]

i am doing the class "assignment" because i wanted to do something unique, and i am not choosing there class i am letting them act like what class they want and that is the class you will get. and once i make the test i will post it up as well as the ranger sub class

[Lev]

Yes, I mean why not give them a choice between very plain classes similar to NPC classes instead of making them level 0? Seems like if you make them level 0 you deny them having a backstory while they are experiencing the training as a roleplaying device.

[J Do Baggins]

no they are levels 0 because they have just been conscripted as soon as they have completed there basic education, so backstories are up to them.

[Morph Bark]

i am doing the class "assignment" because i wanted to do something unique, and i am not choosing there class i am letting them act like what class they want and that is the class you will get. and once i make the test i will post it up as well as the ranger sub class

The problem is is that there are a variety of "I charge in" and "I sneak around" or "I start praying to get divine magic power" classes. For the first you could have barbarian, fighter, paladin, crusader, warblade, hexblade or duskblade. For sneakers there is rogue, ninja, scout, spellthief and bard (arguably). For divine magic there is cleric, druid, shugenja, spirit shaman, favoured soul and healer.

It might be a good idea to talk about this with the players first, or at least gauge their reactions when you tell them the idea. Because if the majority of the players don't like it, you will have a hard time making sure the fun stays going.

Also, since arcane magic is gonna be super-limited, are you gonna be allowing psionics?

[J Do Baggins]

no psioincs my group ex'd that along time ago, and once they have "chosen" a class they are free to change we don't use multi class penalties but they will be initially trained int he class they are suited in and there are many subtle differences between a charging in fighter and a chargeing in barbarian, ect. we also typically only start with basic classes. we are not fancy with exotic classes or anyhting like that. we generally stick with base stuff then modify as we see fit. and again if they don't like it we will do something else next time. so if they are "assigned" barbarian and they hate it they might cross train in fighter then instead, if they were assigned wizzard and hte it they can train in rouge or what ever but they have rolled there characters with what class they want in mind and i will know what they aspire to become i am going to have them tell me there aspirations for the military career are and that will play in

[Lev]

no they are levels 0 because they have just been conscripted as soon as they have completed there basic education, so backstories are up to them.
Ah so level 0 is basically like you having all the (nonexistent) "character sheets" and they make rolls and you tell them what happens based on what you think is good?

The difference between our ideas is that mine has them play dnd characters while training while yours is more like a vidya game intro where you cant see your stats until you pass a tutorial level.

[imp_fireball]

I am starting a new campaign for my group. I want them to make level 0 characters. During our fist session they will be put through a tet or an obstacle course or some kind of preformance evaluation which will determine there class. See in this world there is war comeing and there a been a conscription order everyone must fight. The pc's will all be people who were average until he came to the evalution the there true skill shown though. I wantthem when they roll there chatacters to keep all 4d6 for there stats. This is an age where gun powder has recently been debeloped. There are crude hernades and single fire muskets pistolsand canons but its still more common for people to use the standard weapons once inside of gun range. There arent tabdard wizzards magicis on its way out. Wizzards are mostly enchanters diviners and transmutations. Sorcerers areonly capable of illusions and divinations. There is still holy magic granted through faith in the gods. I am goig to make a new ranger combat style. A gernade thrower/ gunslinger. Kind of minute man style. He game will focus initially on the pc's being engaged in a massive war after a few levels they will be recognized for there amazing skill and be selected for an elite combat team. Navy seal/ army rangr style team. Go on behind enemy lines type missions and what not. Well any ideas, suggestions, tips, advice, please leave a comment, if your just gonna leave a rude remark please just dont. I will right up the info on the ranger subclas and post it soon.

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Sorry, that had to be said.

Anyway, clean up the wall of text and you may attract more interest for your campaign idea.

Here's something to help you along

- A new ranger combat style involving thrown grenades? You may have to brew up some new feats. Two weapon fighting style already favors thrown weapons. If you come up with something nice, I might steal it though.

- There was some article somewhere about 0th level characters. Although right now, you could just make them equivalent to level 1 commoners (d4 HD, +0 BAB, no good saves, proficient with one simple weapon, no armor) and then substitute the level with whatever they choose after they receive... I don't know, 300xp (must spend the XP to substitute the level)?

- I have this system called 'perks' that I'm trying to write up. Essentially, you choose what class you wish to advance into, gain that class's features, saves, BAB and proficiencies - but not HD (so 0 hp, period; not Con bonus, but with the exception of a class feature that would grant hp or a feat that grants hp such as 'toughness') and instead acquire X perk points. For all intents and purposes, you are considered one level higher in that class.

Alternatively, you could choose a class that you already have a level in, and gain that class's BAB and saves but not class features or HD for taking another level in it. This level is a 'phony level' - you progress in BAB and saves at the chosen class's 'progression rate', but you have not actually gained a level in the class - in this way, you can actually go beyond the class's maximum save and BAB bonus. You increase in ECL as if you had leveled up. You also receive Y perk points (more then what is listed in the previous paragraph) for leveling up.

Perk points can be spent on additional abilities or existing feats, minor or major. They could also be used to gain features normally reserved for something like a template. Many of them ideally encourage a tactical approach to gameplay.

ECL is determined by perk points - perk points = Z amount of xp. Thus, you gain more at each level - alternatively, players do not level up and instead spend their XP on perk points (which can purchase bonuses to a save, bonus to attack, AC, an ability, the duplicate of a class feature, etc.).

Selecting a class (acquire 1st level features of that class) reduces the perk point cost for certain abilities and bonuses you can spend on (ie. since the barbarian has a good fort save progression, the perk point cost for receiving a +1 to fort saves is half of what it would be for a wizard, who has poor fort save progression).

Hosting a game with this system means that you don't declare it a '5th level adventure, ie.' - instead, you declare how many perk points everyone begins with.

To calculate ECL, you must allocate XP earned - both spent and unspent and then effectively determine what level the PC would be had they been playing a game without this system.

Monsters have HD and features as normal, but also an arbitrary number of perk points at GM discretion.

To use creatures with LA and racial hit dice as PCs, refer to the XPA (xp adjustment) system, detailed in another thread (have to find it).
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Perk Point Cost = Zxp/1 perk point.

If using the rules involving leveling up, receive a number of perk points at the new level equal to the amount of XP required to achieve that level after gaining a level in the previous level.

Ie. Bob, the first level fighter needs 1000xp to level up. He levels up, chooses fighter (thus progressing in saves and BAB as a fighter of second level), and receives Z perk points. At 2000xp and 3000xp, he levels up again (choosing fighter each time) and receives Z perk points for each level. At 6000xp, he reaches 5th level and receives 3Z perk points, because he needs 3 times the amount of xp to reach 5th level as he'd needed in order to reach 4th. Ultimately, he has X perk points, +5 BAB, +4 Fort, +1 Ref, +1 Will, 5 feats (3 of which are fighter bonus feats) and 1d10 HD at 5th level.
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It's a good system for when death is right around the corner and strategy is very necessary to survive - might fit your ideal 'special ops' game play quite nicely.

I plan on using it for running games with my gears of war campaign (which will be completed at some point in the distant future).


Seems like if you make them level 0 you deny them having a backstory while they are experiencing the training as a roleplaying device.

Granted, they could easily have a back story - although it'd be an unremarkable one.

I mean, it ain't like they're new borns. :smallbiggrin:

[J Do Baggins]

imp thank you for finally understanding what i am trying to do here. i like your idea but we don't really monitor exp either just kinda decide when the group levels. we're not here to get our entire lives wrapped around this just to have some fun and kill some time twice a week. just time spent together with friends thats all we are looking for, i was really hoping tho for some ideas on situtation that would tests there abilities