[PF + 3.5] Feats for a melee Bard

[Cedrass]

Ok, so I decided recently to start planning a character build and wanted to challenge myself so, I'm doing something I never did: a Bard. And to make things even better, I want him to go in melee and be effective at it.

So far I found ways to improve my Inspire Courage to good levels (I think), but I'm still short on feats... I'm missing 3 actually. Here's what I have so far:


1st - Lingering Song
3rd - Weapon Finesse
5th - Melodic Casting (Still not sure about this one, but it seems very good)
7th - Practiced Spellcaster (I'll go Warblade for 4 levels starting at level 9)
9th - Song of the White Raven
11th - Snowflake Wardance
13th - Iron Skin Chant


I think this list is pretty solid, as far as my feats go, but I can find anything for the last 3 feats. I was wondering if someone could help me get trough with this, seeing as I'm pretty much in unknown territory, having never done a bard before.

EDIT: It's the PF Bard, and "One daily use of Bardic Music" equals 2 rounds.

[PId6]

Which version bard are you using? 3.5 or PF? I ask because the PF bard is... not quite an upgrade.

[Cedrass]

Oh sorry, it's the PF Bard, and my DM rules that "One daily use of Bardic music" equals 2 rounds.

[Keld Denar]

I'd use more Warblade than Bard. In fact, Bard4/Warblade16 is decent. Just focus on IC. It'll cost you too many actions to get all the other songs running, and they are really pretty poor for their cost.

Plus, they'll be REALLY taxing on your bardic music uses per day.

EDIT: Oh dear god...see if you can use the 3.5 bard. Seriously...you want to be able to do something OTHER than sing in combat.

[PId6]

I'd use more Warblade than Bard. In fact, Bard4/Warblade16 is decent. Just focus on IC. It'll cost you too many actions to get all the other songs running, and they are really pretty poor for their cost.

Plus, they'll be REALLY taxing on your bardic music uses per day.
Problem is, he won't have many rounds of bardic music if he multiclasses out of bard too soon, thanks to the PF nerf. :smallsigh:

[Cedrass]

Problem is, he won't have many rounds of bardic music if he multiclasses out of bard too soon, thanks to the PF nerf. :smallsigh:

Exactly, plus I'd prefer this character to be more of a battle mage really, hence why I want bard levels.

[PId6]

Are 3.5 PrCs and items allowed? What books are available? Have you seen the bard handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=8284.0)? And how does Lingering Song interact with PF Bardic Music?

I'd suggest something like Bard 8/Warblade 1/Bard +2/Warblade +1, then alternating two levels of bard per level of warblade, ending up with Bard 16/Warblade 4, having picked up some choice maneuvers, gaining access to 6th level spells, and getting 16 BAB.

Race: In PF, there's no reason why you shouldn't go human (though Strongheart Halfling is still a bit better if available). Make that Silverbrow Human if you want Dragonfire Inspiration.

Feats:

1: Versatile Spellcaster
1: Practiced Spellcaster (or Dragonfire Inspiration)
3: Weapon Finesse
5: Song of the Heart
7: Snowflake Wardance
9: Song of the White Raven
11: Power Attack (or Practiced Spellcaster, if using DFI)
13: Anything (Arcane Strike is decent; Extra Music is there if you need it; Martial Study/Stance are always useful; TWF if you're using DFI; Point Blank/Precise Shot/Rapid Shot if you want to have a ranged option; Words of Creation if you want books thrown at you)

Melodic Casting doesn't seem necessary when you can maintain music as a free action anyway. Ironskin Chant isn't very worthwhile either.

[Cedrass]

Oh I didn't remember about Versatile Spellcaster! Thank you!

Also, I won't go Human for this character. It's what I've been doing for the last 3 characters, so I want to change my race. I'm actually thinking of Catfolk =x They look kind of decent considering I won't have that pesky +1 LA since we're playing PF.

Dragonfire Inspiration is also something I won't use, it just does not fit the character.

As for Power Attack, I wanted to get it, but I don't know how I'll get that 13 Str, I don't want to waste my stats boost for that.

Vesatile Spellcaster will be take for sure, so I'm still missing 2 feats (if we don't count Power Attack, seeing as I don't know if I'll be able to take it). Any ideas?

EDIT: Here's my stats (for now ayways): Str 10, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 16, Wis 10, Cha 18

I'm also wondering if Knowledge Devotion would be good, seeing as I'll have acces to ALL knowledges, albeit they won't be that great (half my bard level + Int)

[gbprime]

At low to mid levels, Knowledge Devotion is a great add for a skill-rich melee build. It's good for +2 to hit and damage pretty consistently, more if you're a factotem or broken-skills build. You can retrain it later in your teens or keep the +3 to +4 it nets. I'd drop melodic casting for that one.

lol. swordsaged by the OP. :smallredface:

[mcl01]

If a lot of 3.5e stuff is allowed, melee bards can have it pretty nice. I would suggest some sort of dipping into paladin or cleric for turn undead and divine feats. Paladin fits the melee theme a bit better.

Bard 16/Paladin of Freedom 4 (Holy Warrior Variant) focused on CHA.

Nice feats:
Devoted Performer
Extra Turning
Divine Might
Knowledge Devotion
Travel Devotion
Animal Devotion
Snowflake Wardance
Lingering Song

Focused on light IC optimization, huge cha bonuses fueling spellcasting (6th level bard spells - not groundbreaking, but quite tasty)/divine feats/devotion feats. On top of that, you have a lot of bardic music, better IC, and access to crystal echoblade for a nice +8 sonic damage per hit. You also either get a very nice bardic knowledge check or Bardic Knack bonus. (an effective 8 ranks in all skills minimum? And with jack of all trades, you can use untrained skills to boot)

An alternative, switch out paladin 4 for cleric 1. You end up losing 2 BAB (and 1 attack), but you advance your bard casting further, get domains (which can be traded for bonus feats), and some minor cleric spellcasting.

[PId6]

If it's only up to 13th, then you're only missing one feat, since not being human takes away one. Yeah, Knowledge Devotion is probably the best choice thanks to PF Bardic Knowledge. Other options include:


Nymph's Kiss is pretty good if you take it 1st level, though beware the Exalted requirement.
Lingering Song is very much worth taking if it still works as written (unlikely, given PF bard, but worth asking).
Extend Spell is always nice, especially with Versatile Spellcaster.
Arcane Preparation gets you access to Sanctified Spells, namely Greater/Luminous Armor, though you'll have to carry around a Wand of Lesser Restoration to negate the Str damage.