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Shadowpanther
2010-07-13, 04:44 AM
ok guys, So the system we are using is 3.5 D&D. The concept was to use my instrument to the fullest. So hidden blade in guitar. Guitar strings to strangle people to death. Sneaky like a rogue. But as much charisma as a prince.
What i want to do, is maximize my melee damage. But have short range weapons much like ninja stars, or throwing knifes. I am NOT a two weapon fighter and i do not want to be squishy. So any ideas on a build? Things to focus on? Stuff like that. I've played plenty of rogues, but never a bard. Any special classes or builds that i should be looking for? I'm going for a knowledgy, sneaky,melee with a hint of range kind of guy. I'm hoping to eak out as much damage as possible as well as not be so squishy. Any help would be most appreciated. We are starting for all intensive purposes lvl 1 so i need a complete build to lvl 20.

nonsi
2010-07-13, 07:54 AM
I'm not sure you're in the right forum, but what the heck.

It seems like you're looking for a lot of things, and - purely based on gut feeling - I'm not sure a Bard-Rogue combo is the best solution. It's not a usual combo for a CO to choose, that's for sure.

So first of all, start by prioritizing the things you wish to excel at, then the things you wish to be good at, then the things you want to be decent at.

Shadowpanther
2010-07-14, 12:50 PM
Ah!! Finally a response!!
Firstly, I decided on the "cool concept" However building and making it play worthy is a challenge in itself. That is why i posted here, in my earlier post i neglected to inform ALL 3.5 books are open and available to use.

Things to excel at"
Bardic knowledge and abilities to buff a party.
Melee combat
Charisma, i need to be as charismatic as possible.
Sneak and lock picking.

Things to be good at:
Throwing or "thrown weapons" i was under the impression that you can sneak attack with those. considering most range is 30 ft.
not being squishy
Dex related skills.

Things to be decent at:
Bardic spells.

Thanks for the help Nonsi You Are the Man!! or women!!..thing...

Telonius
2010-07-14, 01:53 PM
The problem you're going to run into is that not a lot of things will advance your Bardic Knowledge, and the things that do, tend not to advance your sneak attack.

Option A: Rogue3/Bard4/Arcane Trickster10/(Bard or Bard-y PrC)3, Obscure Lore feat
Pros: Lots of sneak attack, high spellcasting, high skill points, charisma-heavy
Cons: Bardic Knowledge checks take a hit, low HP, low BAB

Option B: Bard4/Rogue2/Druid4/Fochlucan Lyrist10
Pros: Better BAB, Bardic Knowledge, higher HP
Cons: No sneak attack advancement

nonsi
2010-07-15, 02:32 AM
Ah!! Finally a response!!
Firstly, I decided on the "cool concept" However building and making it play worthy is a challenge in itself. That is why i posted here, in my earlier post i neglected to inform ALL 3.5 books are open and available to use.

Things to excel at"
Bardic knowledge and abilities to buff a party.
Melee combat
Charisma, i need to be as charismatic as possible.
Sneak and lock picking.

Things to be good at:
Throwing or "thrown weapons" i was under the impression that you can sneak attack with those. considering most range is 30 ft.
not being squishy
Dex related skills.

Things to be decent at:
Bardic spells.

Thanks for the help Nonsi You Are the Man!! or women!!..thing...

- Buffing the party is all about "Inspire ______", which is directly tied to your Bard levels. So is Bardic knowledge.
- Melee combat would require SA (which makes it feel odd that you reject the TWF option) + Uncanny Dodge. Just don't forget to take Elusive Target (CW). It's a substantial defensive feature for a melee-intense sneaky dude you wouldn't wanna pass up.
- Lock picking requires no more than 1 Rogue level.
- Sneakiness + being the party's "face" + Dex skills basically just require skill points - of which you'd be getting plenty as it is
- To be good at thrown weapons you'll need to find the right feats (far from my specialty).

I think that your bast bet would be to have your GM agree to a homebrew feat along the lines of Daring Outlaw.
Call it "Lyrical Outlaw"
Requirements: SA 3d6, Uncanny Dodge, Inspire Competence, Able to cast 1st level arcane spells.
Benefits: Your Bard & Rogue levels stack for the following features:
- Determining your SA damage.
- Bardic Knowledge
- Progression of "Inspire <whatever>" features (including getting new ones).

The only reservation to the above is MAD (and you WILL feel it).


You have a totally different alternative at achieving most of your goals, but with a substantially different theme: Rogue 1 and then DFA all the way (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19870954/The_New_Dragonfire_Adept_Handbook!?pg=1).
You won't have party buffs or bardic knowledge, but you'll top the previous option on all other aspects and you'll be awesome.

Btw, Fochlucan Lyrist is highly overrated. People tend to see only the higher levels, but in most cases, the majority of the campaign occurs below average party level 15 - and until then all your features painfully lag behind (unless, campaign-wise, you manage to compel a druid to teach you druidic and take Ur-Priest for divine spells instead - but you'll still suffer from MAD).

As for Arcane Trickster - many homebrewers out there believe it should have d6HD (probably plus med BAB).