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EdroGrimshell
2010-07-14, 02:00 PM
Okay, so most of my previous D&D buddies moved away recently :smallfrown:, now I'm starting a solo campaign with the DM, who has stayed. I'm not used to solo or urban campaigns, so i need advice.

Rules:
-Gestalt
-2 Flaws, 1 Trait
-All books allowed (even campaign specific)
-dragon and dungeon magazines allowed
-3rd party materials allowed if i can get it

Dusk Eclipse
2010-07-14, 02:08 PM
A Wizard//Rogue sounds like a good simple solution, you got decent bab, a lot of skills, Spells (if you specialize don't ban enchantment, in an urban campaing it might prove much more useful).
mmmmm check cityscape web enchantment, it has some good options.

jiriku
2010-07-14, 02:11 PM
Skill use tends to be more important in urban games, while raw destructive capability is less important (characters have to act more like law-abiding citizens and less like outlaws roaming the wilderness). Choose a class that offers more than 2 skill points per level, or that provides access to many spells that can replace skill usage.

In a solo game, stealth is a MUCH more viable way of solving problems than normal (you don't have clumsy allies clanking around alongside you).

Diplomacy (both the skill and the actual set of behaviors) and/or enchantment magic may matter a lot more than usual. You can't do everything by yourself, and without allied players to support you, if you're going to get help it's going to come from NPCs. Also, since you'll never (by definition) have a numerical advantage over your opponents, it's pretty easy to run into situations where you're too badly outnumbered for solo combat to be a viable solution to a problem. Thus, it's helpful to have mechanical abilities that convince NPCs to support and assist you.

Self-sufficient classes are also more important in solo play, because sometimes you're going to need something done and no one's there to do it but you. Good classe options include:

swordsage
bard
beguiler
druid
ranger
factotum
rogue
warlock
cleric
dread necromancer

At least one side of your gestalt should include one of these classes.

EdroGrimshell
2010-07-14, 02:34 PM
@Dusk Eclipse
This is the generic advise i was expecting.

@Jiriku
100% True. I happen to have a preference for arcane casters but dislike the beguiler (don't ask)

For one side...swashbuckler/rogue with daring outlaw may be good, and it offers both offense and stealth abilities. On the other side, i'm debating on wizard or warlock.

Dusk Eclipse
2010-07-14, 02:37 PM
@Dusk Eclipse
This is the generic advise i was expecting.



Is that a good thing or a bad thing? :smallconfused:

Kylarra
2010-07-14, 02:39 PM
I'd say Psion//Factotum personally. Int-synergy and extra action abuse ahoy.

HunterOfJello
2010-07-14, 02:40 PM
If you're going to play a gestalt character, you should invest one side in a spellcasing class.

A Wizard//Factotum would be an amazing character, especially if you had the Factotum progress into the Chameleon prestige class later on. That way you could get access to Cleric spells also or Wizard/Sorc spells from your banned list.

~

If you wanted half of the gestalt to be in melee then Warblades and Duskblades both use Int to their benefit.

~

And if you decide on playing a divine caster then Cloistered Cleric//Swordsage or Druid//Swordsage would be a great character to play. (The Cityscape web enhancements have a number of nice changes for druids that live in cities)

jiriku
2010-07-14, 02:54 PM
For one side...swashbuckler/rogue with daring outlaw may be good, and it offers both offense and stealth abilities. On the other side, i'm debating on wizard or warlock.

Do you have any info from the DM on how readily you'll be able to purchase access to specific spells for your wizard list, or how readily you'll be able to buy specific items for use with warlock/rogue UMD? The availability of spells vs. items should definitely factor into your decision.

I am unconvinced that daring outlaw is better than straight rogue for a solo urban campaign. The loss of skill points is considerable, and a warlock especially has little use for the swashbuckler's full base attack bonus or insightful strike. I'm not sure the extra hit points are worth it.

Eternal Drifter
2010-07-14, 03:06 PM
Solo Urban Campaign?

I recomend Cityscape if the version you're playing is DND 3.5. Full of tips and tricks for the Urban adventurer!

If you're playing a Spellcaster, I recomend Deceptive Spell (Metamagic) feat to avoid the city guards attacking you for breaking laws, and the mending spell to pretend that you never opened that sealed letter, and other stuff.

If playing a ranger type, Urban Tracking (originally in Arcana, but updated in Cityscape), is useful to track down targets in the city. If they leave the city, you've got Track for that.

EdroGrimshell
2010-07-14, 03:12 PM
@Dusk Eclipse
More neutral actually, it's just generic

@Kylarra
I like the factotum, but psionics is generally not my thing

@HunterOfJello
A good bit of advise and i am using Intelligence as a primary stat, with Dex as a secondary.

I think i'll be going a specialist wizard (possibly focused specialist) on one side and either factotum or rogue/swashbuckler (using daring outlaw of course) on the other side.

I'd now like to ask about feats, spell selection, and PrCs. Not exactly sure what level were starting at, probably from 3rd to 6th level, that's what the DM usually does.

Person_Man
2010-07-14, 03:30 PM
The beautiful thing about solo campaigns is that you can actually use stealth and trickery effectively. You can Hide without worrying about your friends revealing you. Use Disguise and Bluff to make your way into a stronghold without "going on a solo adventure." When ambushed, you can turn into a rat and scamper away, not worrying about the fate of others. When you finally encounter the BBEG, you can trick him into drinking poison, lure him into a trap, or use real hit and run tactics, all without other players to screw up your plans. This is especially true in urban campaigns.

If it were me, I'd go with Human Rogue 1 or 2/Binder or Incarnate X//Urban Druid (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070228a) 20 with the Able Learner feat. That would give you massive Skills, full casting, and the ability to Wild Shape into tiny sized vermin and constructs.

jiriku
2010-07-14, 03:41 PM
Well, if you play a factotum, heaping piles of Font of Inspiration are usually the way to go.

Prestdigitation is always handy. As far as spells, there's a 0-level spell in SpC called amanuensis that let's you rapidly (and perfectly) copy text. Useful for various larcenous activities, and a cantrip to boot. Mending has been mentioned - it's terribly useful. So are knock, hold portal/arcane lock, plus message and invisibility. Basically, any spell that makes it easy to break the law without getting caught. There's a 1st-level spell floating around the SpC somewhere that lets you read books at a rate of 1/round. Alter self is ridiculously good, as always. Most 1st-level illusions and enchantments are good choices: charm person, sleep, disguise self, silent image. Suggestion is a killer spell in a campaign that features more roleplaying interaction.

EdroGrimshell
2010-07-14, 03:53 PM
I was thinking of one of three races for this campaign; Human, Grey Elf (yah i know), or Changeling. But i think changeling would be the best for this. The changeling has some really good Racial Class Features for both the wizard and the rogue.

Kylarra
2010-07-14, 04:36 PM
The main reason I suggest psionics is lack of components necessary to do your schtick...

Tyrmatt
2010-07-14, 05:05 PM
Anything int based with Factotum. Lets you achieve a reasonable rate of success in all necessary skill checks and stuff you won't have in a solo game combined with something Int based to wreck major damage on your enemies.

EdroGrimshell
2010-07-14, 07:07 PM
The game will be starting at 6th level, with WBL + 500gp.

Thefurmonger
2010-07-14, 07:11 PM
I recently played a campaign almost exactly like this.

I went with a Beguiler 5/MB 1/Beguiler X//Duskblade

And I can tell you its a great combo, Int to everything, tons of skills, great in melee, good stealth and more spells then you can shake a stick at.

IonDragon
2010-07-14, 08:24 PM
For solo gestalt, I'd take something with plenty of versatility and some synergy. Possibly a skills class (Rogue, Factotem, etc), and a Tier 1 (Wizard, Cleric, Druid).

Maybe
Druid//monk2,paladin2,something good or possibly Rogue
Or for something simpler
Druid//Cleric
Can't go wrong with that, really. The Natural Spell feat does not stipulate that you can only cast Druid spells while Wild Shaped so you would have access to all of your Cleric buffs as well, and only one Primary stat because in Wild Shape you get to replace your physical stats.

General advice for Gestalt:
Avoid MAD
Since you're running solo, you want out of combat versatility, but you want to bear in mind that you only get one action in combat per turn.
Considering it's urban, that may change your priorities.

The following is a secretIt's going to be much more evident in a solo game than in a normal game, but you're going to get much more out of the game, and save the GM tons of work if you help write the story. Now I don't mean you go over the the GM's house, and you guys get out a notebook and start brainstorming adventure hooks and NPCs (though there's no reason you couldn't, just most people don't). I mean the more information you give him on your character the better the game will be. Personality, family members, where he comes from, how he grew up, what sort of person he is, what exactly you mean by his alignment, short therm goals, long term goals.... You will not overstep your bounds if you use a modicum of consideration, and if you do the GM will work with you to work in the idea if it is possible. Don't be afraid to think up some NPCs that may be relevant to yourself. You probably don't want to go stat them up, but give general demeanor (possibly level), race, and age. It's amazing how few players realize this.

Thurbane
2010-07-15, 03:59 AM
Swashbuckler//Beguiler could be fun for a solo urban game...grab a Haleing Belt and UMD some wands for healing.

gorfnab
2010-07-15, 05:48 AM
Other classes to consider would be Artificer, Mystic Ranger (Dragon #336) with the feat Sword of the Arcane Order, and Cloistered Cleric. In an urban lower level campaign these could pair nicely with other classes in gestalt because of their skills, spells, and other abilities.

Morph Bark
2010-07-15, 05:53 AM
I recommend Factotum//Warblade or Factotum//Artificer for this, since then you will have not to worry about utility and skills, nor with magic items as much for the latter or melee for the former. Druid//Totemist works great too though, especially if he prioritizes Con. In that case Vow of Poverty would actually be rather viable too, if you allow BoED.

If the player goes Ranger, the Urban Ranger variant is recommended.

EdroGrimshell
2010-07-15, 12:11 PM
I recommend Factotum//Warblade or Factotum//Artificer for this, since then you will have not to worry about utility and skills, nor with magic items as much for the latter or melee for the former. Druid//Totemist works great too though, especially if he prioritizes Con. In that case Vow of Poverty would actually be rather viable too, if you allow BoED.

If the player goes Ranger, the Urban Ranger variant is recommended.

Okay, i've decided, a changeling Factotum//Artificer going into chameleon on the factotum half. Not sure what to do for the artificer side though, probably straight artificer.

Aetolus
2010-07-15, 02:10 PM
I'm playing a character now that uses rogue, ranger, conjurer, human paragon, darkhunter, and daggerspell mage. I've got 20th level spell casting and 19BAB, and boatloads of skills. There are many ways to lay it out across the gestalt line, but I have it laid out like this:
rogue1 /human paragon3/ conjurer3/ daggerspell mage1/ darkhunter5/ daggerspellmage2-10//Conjurer2/rogue2/ranger3/conjurer4-8/ranger4-11/rogue3
I built this character to be frustrating to dm. He spends most of his waking time invisible. If anyone decides to cast true seeing, he'll cast a fog spell made invisible with metamagic. The foe that has true seeing can choose to see things that are invisible, or choose not to, but not both. Darkstalker will circumvent all miscellaneous forms of detection
He is mostly wizard, so he must sleep. Rope trick will ensure that he is not disturbed while he is vulnerable.
Ocular spell, sneak attack, death attack and daggercast can all be delivered more or less at the same time for a likely one shot, or at least a severe maiming as combat begins.
With access to true strike, and wraithstrike, as well as a perfect BAB, and perpetually unaware foes, there isn't any reason that he should miss a kill shot.
He makes an effective assassin, thief, sabatouer, spy, blaster, party mage, skillmonkey, even melee combatant to some extent.

For feats I selected:
Blind fight, weapon finesse, weapon focus: dagger, cloudy conjuration, track, twf, alacritous cogitation, ocular spell, staggering strike, craft contingent spell, itwf, darkstalker, invisible spell gtwf

There is no campaign setting material, no dipping, no double PrCing, no theurgic prc's, no base classes from out of core, all prc's that are started are finished by 20. Any dm should like this.

If you want more details just ask.

Kylarra
2010-07-15, 02:24 PM
I built this character to be frustrating to dm.
.... Any dm should like this.
Yeah.:smalltongue:

Also if my math is correct, by fractionals you should lose 1.5 BAB, but eh, minor nitpick.

EdroGrimshell
2010-07-15, 02:25 PM
I'm playing a character now that uses rogue, ranger, conjurer, human paragon, darkhunter, and daggerspell mage. I've got 20th level spell casting and 19BAB, and boatloads of skills. There are many ways to lay it out across the gestalt line, but I have it laid out like this:
rogue1 /human paragon3/ conjurer3/ daggerspell mage1/ darkhunter5/ daggerspellmage2-10//Conjurer2/rogue2/ranger3/conjurer4-8/ranger4-11/rogue3
I built this character to be frustrating to dm. He spends most of his waking time invisible. If anyone decides to cast true seeing, he'll cast a fog spell made invisible with metamagic. The foe that has true seeing can choose to see things that are invisible, or choose not to, but not both. Darkstalker will circumvent all miscellaneous forms of detection
He is mostly wizard, so he must sleep. Rope trick will ensure that he is not disturbed while he is vulnerable.
Ocular spell, sneak attack, death attack and daggercast can all be delivered more or less at the same time for a likely one shot, or at least a severe maiming as combat begins.
With access to true strike, and wraithstrike, as well as a perfect BAB, and perpetually unaware foes, there isn't any reason that he should miss a kill shot.
He makes an effective assassin, thief, sabatouer, spy, blaster, party mage, skillmonkey, even melee combatant to some extent.

For feats I selected:
Blind fight, weapon finesse, weapon focus: dagger, cloudy conjuration, track, twf, alacritous cogitation, ocular spell, staggering strike, craft contingent spell, itwf, darkstalker, invisible spell gtwf

There is no campaign setting material, no dipping, no double PrCing, no theurgic prc's, no base classes from out of core, all prc's that are started are finished by 20. Any dm should like this.

If you want more details just ask.

Alright, two things

1) I don't want my DM throwing the DMG at me.
2) I like role-playing my character more than the actual game.

Morph Bark
2010-07-15, 02:26 PM
Okay, i've decided, a changeling Factotum//Artificer going into chameleon on the factotum half. Not sure what to do for the artificer side though, probably straight artificer.

Do it after Factotum 8 though, Cunning Surge rocks Snake's box.

And every other box within 10 miles.

EdroGrimshell
2010-07-15, 03:56 PM
Do it after Factotum 8 though, Cunning Surge rocks Snake's box.

And every other box within 10 miles.

That's what i was planning

Aetolus
2010-07-15, 03:57 PM
I said I built it to frustrate my DM, I didn't say you had to frustrate yours...
The invisible bounty hunter here doesn't abuse action economy like the factotum, so if you're talking roleplay vs rollplay...
I just rechecked the fractionals, I'm quite positive they're correct.