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Viskocity
2010-07-15, 10:38 PM
I have seen a fair few threads which use this spell in combination with solar gating and other bits of cheese. Usually these combos end in either the earth being crushed under its own weight in gold and free magic items, or the user ascending to godhood through liberal application of infinite wishes. While reading, though, I came to wonder how exactly Simulacrum was intended to be used.

So, playground, can you tell me what the designers originally intended with this spell? Why would any sane person ever allow players to replicate SLAs and other abilities so freely? Is there some other purpose I have failed to see?

For convenience, the spell description is below.



Simulacrum
Illusion (Shadow)
Level: Sor/Wiz 7
Components: V, S, M, XP
Casting Time: 12 hours
Range: 0 ft.
Effect: One duplicate creature
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No
Simulacrum creates an illusory duplicate of any creature. The duplicate creature is partially real and formed from ice or snow. It appears to be the same as the original, but it has only one-half of the real creature’s levels or Hit Dice (and the appropriate hit points, feats, skill ranks, and special abilities for a creature of that level or HD). You can’t create a simulacrum of a creature whose Hit Dice or levels exceed twice your caster level. You must make a Disguise check when you cast the spell to determine how good the likeness is. A creature familiar with the original might detect the ruse with a successful Spot check (opposed by the caster’s Disguise check) or a DC 20 Sense Motive check.

At all times the simulacrum remains under your absolute command. No special telepathic link exists, so command must be exercised in some other manner. A simulacrum has no ability to become more powerful. It cannot increase its level or abilities. If reduced to 0 hit points or otherwise destroyed, it reverts to snow and melts instantly into nothingness. A complex process requiring at least 24 hours, 100 gp per hit point, and a fully equipped magical laboratory can repair damage to a simulacrum.

Material Component
The spell is cast over the rough snow or ice form, and some piece of the creature to be duplicated (hair, nail, or the like) must be placed inside the snow or ice. Additionally, the spell requires powdered ruby worth 100 gp per HD of the simulacrum to be created.

XP Cost
100 XP per HD of the simulacrum to be created (minimum 1,000 XP).

Mushroom Ninja
2010-07-15, 10:46 PM
So, playground, can you tell me what the designers originally intended with this spell? Why would any sane person ever allow players to replicate SLAs and other abilities so freely? Is there some other purpose I have failed to see?


My guess is that the designers never really though about or playtested the spell with respect to game balance. They probably thought "here's a cool magical effect, lets make a spell for it."

Optimystik
2010-07-15, 10:55 PM
It's a BBEG spell, to mess with the party by impersonating one of them. Kind of like Ice Assassin or Demise Unseen.

Douglas
2010-07-15, 10:56 PM
So, playground, can you tell me what the designers originally intended with this spell? Why would any sane person ever allow players to replicate SLAs and other abilities so freely?
I think that part is more of a consequence of the general attitude of not thinking about the possibility of players gaining any particular monster's abilities through any means other than playing a character that actually is of that monster race and taking the racial hit dice and level adjustment.


Is there some other purpose I have failed to see?
It strikes me more as a Secretive Manipulating BBEG spell than anything else. Assassinate or abduct a high ranking noble or officer, replace with Simulacrum, manipulate the victim's underlings. Alternatively, make a Simulacrum of yourself to get the perfect lieutenant to send after the PCs when they're still not really a true threat deserving your direct personal attention. For PC use, the costs involved in creating and (eventually) repairing a simulacrum are, I think, intended to be prohibitively high. A BBEG, on the other hand, can be the beneficiary of a DM handwave, and using this spell helps accomplish some major BBEG fantasy tropes.

ScionoftheVoid
2010-07-15, 10:58 PM
I have seen a fair few threads which use this spell in combination with solar gating and other bits of cheese. Usually these combos end in either the earth being crushed under its own weight in gold and free magic items, or the user ascending to godhood through liberal application of infinite wishes. While reading, though, I came to wonder how exactly Simulacrum was intended to be used.

So, playground, can you tell me what the designers originally intended with this spell? Why would any sane person ever allow players to replicate SLAs and other abilities so freely? Is there some other purpose I have failed to see?

For convenience, the spell description is below.

As with shapechanging and calling/summoning they probably didn't think players would take advantage of "free use" abilities such as SLAs and supernatural abilities. I think the spell is supposed to give a rather weak cohort-like ally, maybe assuming players would use it on animals and dinosaurs to get a glass-cannon type (lots of ability modifiers, halved HD). I don't think it's something from an older edition that went straight across without adjustment, so I have to guess that they really just didn't think about the possibilities when writing it.

dextercorvia
2010-07-15, 11:24 PM
It's a classic BBEG tactic in Fantasy lit, even down to using special snow. It also was in 2e and I assume earlier.

The Glyphstone
2010-07-15, 11:26 PM
So a combination of Legacy Weight/Grandfather Clause, "hey, this is a cool idea", and the same lack of detailed forethought that basically defined 3.X playtesting?

Sounds about right.

Optimystik
2010-07-15, 11:47 PM
Alternatively, make a Simulacrum of yourself to get the perfect lieutenant to send after the PCs when they're still not really a true threat deserving your direct personal attention.

This strategy is also known as "Volrathing."

Ravens_cry
2010-07-15, 11:47 PM
It's a classic BBEG tactic in Fantasy lit, even down to using special snow. It also was in 2e and I assume earlier.
Not to mention fairy tales. (http://www.mythfolklore.net/andrewlang/018.htm)

Lysander
2010-07-16, 12:24 AM
In addition to being used for the evil twin and fake BBEG tropes mentioned above it's also good for the wizard making duplicate of beloved dead relative trope and the cultists using bone of ancient evil magician to clone him trope.

OracleofWuffing
2010-07-16, 12:46 AM
The original intent could have been to fights within perfectly friendly groups about how it's impossible for a simulacrum to melt into nothing. You see, melting is the process of a solid becoming a liquid. "Nothingness" generally isn't considered a liquid (as there would be no particles to... er... be a liquid?), hence a clear contradiction between the rules as written and what general purpose definitions would expect.

...Conflict is good for building character, I guess?

Zen Master
2010-07-16, 01:54 AM
Does anyone remember the exact phrasing of the spell, back from 2e?

It said something similar to: If the simulacrum is awakened while the original caster is still alive, it goes mad. If more than two simulacrums of the same person exist, they will ceaselessly hunt down and destroy each other until only one remains.

It was a 'return from the dead' spell back then, as far as I recall. Don't have the books anymore, so I can't look it up =(

Fortuna
2010-07-16, 01:59 AM
Does anyone remember the exact phrasing of the spell, back from 2e?

It said something similar to: If the simulacrum is awakened while the original caster is still alive, it goes mad. If more than two simulacrums of the same person exist, they will ceaselessly hunt down and destroy each other until only one remains.

It was a 'return from the dead' spell back then, as far as I recall. Don't have the books anymore, so I can't look it up =(

You may be thinking of clone.