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super dark33
2010-07-18, 08:14 AM
ther are smarte races and ther are less, but what is the basic strategy for every race? if you have an idea, tell me.

for exemple- orc just charge in and start hand-to-hand fight. but how dwarvs fight? like viking, in a shield wall or like romans, in squares? wath do you think?

Snake-Aes
2010-07-18, 08:18 AM
It's not that simple. Intelligent beings adapt their strategies to the resources they have. A bunch of orcs isn't reduced to "CHAAAAAAAAAARGE" randomly. They'd flank, they'd go for the softer ones first, they'd try to neutralize a caster. Intel defines how quickly they figure those out.

Aroka
2010-07-18, 09:34 AM
For culturally developed fighting techniques, Int isn't necessarily even that big a determinant. For one thing, every orc society will have - and certainly will have had - outliers in that department, and some of them will have revolutionized tactics and strategy (different things, incidentally), and the revolutions that work will have been kept. Any society that fights, fights, fights, and fights will get pretty good at it.

Individual Int is more a determinant of ability to improvise new techniques and act independently but remain useful (which is why you'd want to see it in your captains and lieutenants in your typical D&D setting, where combat more closely resembles modern high-tech warfare than medieval warfare). Drow elves are usually depicted as highly independent small-unit guerilla-style fighters, and Int bonuses help make sense of that. Orcs are probably not so great at improvising, being a bit dim, but when they hit on a tactic that works, they'd use it. Ambushes, responding to enemy tactics and troops (different tricks work against archers, heavy cavalry, cavalry skirmishers, foot skirmishers, heavy infantry, etc.).

Orcs would probably be clannish and savage, their armies composed of groups led by strong and charismatic individuals (with unsuccessful leaders challenged, killed, and replaced by capable underlings; that's CE hierarchy). That doesn't mean tactical inferiority - German tribesmen destroyed three Roman legions in Teutoburg, after all. They'd probably take advantage of terrain and ambushes, use barbarians as champions and shock troops going ahead of the main line, but also take advantage of the fact that a single orc is pretty much superior to a single human or dwarf in personal combat. Two-handed weapons would probably be common, but they'd hardly neglect shields (against missile fire) and archers of their own. They'd probably use goblin "client tribes" for cannon fodder and goblin warg/wolf-rider skirmishers.

Dwarves would probably focus on the heavy infantry and siege engines, with a defensive posture: get within range of the enemy, pummel them with siege engines, and take the charge. If they had cavalry available (mercenaries or bear-riders or what have you), they'd probably be kept in reserve and used to either strike a weak flank, or to create a breach for the infantry to exploit. Dwarves can't chase down enemies in medium or light armor, but they also have no reason not to give every man the heaviest armor available (and can probably best afford it, since they're usually the ones doing the mining and steel production). They might even adopt a doctrine where they'd rather hold and reinforce a position after an enemy retreat than chase down the enemy. Dwarves also seem likely to fight defensive wars more than offensive,

Tunnel-fighting with goblins and other underground enemies is a field all of its own, though, and would require more specific and imaginative tactics. Individual training and ability would be very important there, since tunnels wide enough for only a few fighters would be common, and you'd want each dwarf to take down many, many opponents before dying. Units would probably be arranged in very specific formations to provide healing support for the front lines, and might employ pikes or other specialist weapons to make use of the formation.

Elves would probably focus on archers, light infantry, skirmishers, and light cavalry, hit-and-run tactics, and the homefield advantage (even when outside their own territory, so long as they have a forest to fight in). With Wizard as a favored class, you'd expect most units to have ample low-level magical support for utility, buffing, and battlefield control; a volley of arrows, a glitterdust or grease, and maybe a few rounds of furious melee should wreak havoc on the enemy.

This is all highly setting-dependent, though; what are the races actually like, what is their environment like, who do they fight, who have they fought, etc.

Hurlbut
2010-07-18, 10:39 AM
Dwarves at War: they would fight in small squads (not so different from the adventuring groups). Their experience with the orcs and goblines mean they use tactics and terrain to negate their numerical superiority. When fighting in their hill/mountain warren, they would use traps set in stone in some of the less used areas. They have hidden side entrances so they can flank the invaders outside the main entrance. If they use Rune magic fairly often, they would have Rune Circles to augment their defenses. They fight in formations with discipline for the main battle.

Aroka: it doesn't matter what armor or weight they have, they ignore the encumbrance of any of it. So their speed is always same.

For more information on Dwarves at War, I recommend getting Dragon magazine #328

Darklord Xavez
2010-07-18, 10:41 AM
For more information on Dwarves at War, I recommend getting Dragon magazine #328

Or Races of Stone.
-Xavez

Aroka
2010-07-18, 11:55 AM
Aroka: it doesn't matter what armor or weight they have, they ignore the encumbrance of any of it. So their speed is always same.

That's why they can't chase enemies. Any unit with speed higher than 20 ft. can avoid close combat with dwarven infantry. (Makes skirmishing against dwarves a good idea.)

Hurlbut
2010-07-18, 11:57 AM
Sure, but most of time they just stroll up onto the dwarves' doorstep. :smallbiggrin:

Aroka
2010-07-18, 12:12 PM
Sure, but most of time they just stroll up onto the dwarves' doorstep. :smallbiggrin:

Yep - that's the defensive posture. Dwarves would also have pretty excellent combat engineers - in fact, it's quite possible most of the dwarves in an army will have civilian experience with working with machines, forges, and building. They'd have an easy time setting up temporary fortifications and reinforcing positions, building siege engines on the spot, and so on, and forcing the enemy to commit into battle against them. Stationary defenses are pretty good for defeating skirmishing tactics, forcing the enemy to either use siege engines of their own (which the dwarves are better at), or to try to overcome the fortifications, where the dwarves have the advantage again due to heavy armor and general toughness.

Dwarven armies on the move would be more vulnerable, although they'd no doubt drill for quick responses to assaults, and develop some specialized troops to counter quick raids (bear cavalry!). However, there's an easy way around this, too: in many settings, dwarves have access to a lot of underground tunnels, natural and artificial, which they could use for much safer travel in an environment that favors them. Here the risk is that the enemy knows where to meet them, though - dwarves coming out of such tunnels would only be able to field a tiny amount of their forces at a time (sort of a reverse Thermopylae), and would have a hard fight establishing a "beachhead" to get the rest of the troops into the field.

Hurlbut
2010-07-18, 12:27 PM
Dwarven armies on the move would be more vulnerable, although they'd no doubt drill for quick responses to assaults, and develop some specialized troops to counter quick raids (bear cavalry!). However, there's an easy way around this, too: in many settings, dwarves have access to a lot of underground tunnels, natural and artificial, which they could use for much safer travel in an environment that favors them. Here the risk is that the enemy knows where to meet them, though - dwarves coming out of such tunnels would only be able to field a tiny amount of their forces at a time (sort of a reverse Thermopylae), and would have a hard fight establishing a "beachhead" to get the rest of the troops into the field.It's true for any heavy infantry based army in the Ancient and Classical periods. It's only when you let the skirmishers/guerrillas or arrogance get to you mentally that you lose the 'battle'.

The ranged troop cannot kill off a heavy infantry formation standing firm and together alone. To scatter or dispatch it, you have to get up close and dirty or demoralize it.
A steadfast formation of heavy infantry is a tough nut to crack, so it come down to the mental battlefield (cunning leaders outmaneuvering and outwitting the other side, battering the soldiers' morale, so forth)