View Full Version : [3.5/PF] Thought Exercise -The Supreme Defender

2010-07-26, 01:18 AM
Ok, simple enough thought exercise. Inspired by a TD non the less.

Ok. So here it is, you have a lv5 Commoner and he is EXTREMELY important for whatever reason you wish to conceive. He must live through 5 waves of Monsters.

Your Goal: Build a defense of ANY kind using-
-Any core spells, who's total spell levels don't exceed 26.
-Any core Items/Resources whos total Item cost doesn't exceed $100,000.
-For the sake of fairness, lets say NO Dimensional Shenanigans and Wish.
-Commoner must stay on his Hill, which is located in the dead center of a 5 mile valley. The Commoners hill is roughly 20x20x60
-In order for a Wave to continue onward to the next one, all members of the original Wave must be eradicated.
-If a Item/Weapon/Etc has a Charge (DOES NOT PERTAIN TO SCROLLS) then at the END of the Wave, *1* Charge is restored to said Item.
-You may NOT spend someone elses XP, you have a pool of 25,000 XP to spend.

Additionally, if you LIKE you can build the Commoner as you wish. Feats, Skills, etc.

The waves will consist of:
-Wave 1-
5 Fire Elementals [Large]
-Wave 2-
8 Earth Elementals [Huge]
-Wave 3-
4 Orge-Mage 6 Trolls
-Wave 4-
2 Purple Worms, 1 Elder Green Dragon
-Wave 5-
3 Astral Deva, 2 Unicorn, 1 Solar

If you have additional questions or concerns, feel free to post. As this is a thought exercise some of the rules may be flexible. ;]

2010-07-26, 01:40 AM
Would items have full charges every wave, or would they stay expended?

2010-07-26, 02:38 AM
Are infinites allowed? Because you can easily go pun pun with a casting of Shapechange.

2010-07-26, 02:50 AM
Infinities are lame, basically any situation can be resolved with a healthy dose of Pun-Pun.

Anyway, I'd say the main goal of this exercise is making the Commoner untouchable. The waves look 'easy' enough to handle after you achieve that goal.

Something like (greater) invisibility, fly or maybe some sort of prison/sphere effect to keep him out of harm's way. If you stick him in a Force Cage, the monsters shouldn't be able to get to him, right?
Another idea could be creating a Simulacrum of him and use that as bate.

Edit: besides, if we're going to go with the usual cheesed out optimization the commoner doesn't even need any help. He'd simply have a family of Battletitans looking after him...

2010-07-26, 03:19 AM
Without inifinte loops, 26 spell levels is enough to cast Simulacrum (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/simulacrum.htm) 3 times. Assuming it is being cast by a level 20 Wizard, he can create a 40 HD simulacra each casting, which mimics a 80 HD monster.

Simulacrum (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/simulacrum.htm) also costs 100 gp per HD, but with 100,000 gp budget, thats enough for 1,000 HD of monsters and won't be a significant problem. Use it to mimic a couple of Abominations (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/abomination.htm) and call it a day.

2010-07-26, 03:49 AM
Permanencied Prismatic Sphere takes care of everything but the Solar. For him, purchase Mirror of Opposition, and you'll have an unwounded version of the same guy to fight him inside the sphere.

Take Shapechange cast by a 20th level caster with the rest of the spell levels, just in case.

Human Paragon 3
2010-07-26, 11:52 AM
Have him fail his save on a Maze spell.

2010-07-26, 01:57 PM
That Solar is going to rip him a new one, mostly because he can replicate anything you can do better. Got 3 Simulacrums? He has 300. 3 Planar Bindings? He has 1000000. Or are we assuming the Solar is being fair and not using his powers to full effect?

2010-07-26, 07:29 PM
Eh, sorry all. Haven't been able to reply my internet dropped.
However, I am back.
So..To answer a few questions:
NO PUN-PUN.. I shouldn't even need to say it -_-; And indeed, Infinite are lame.

Items would get back 1 Charge at the end of each wave
You cannot use spells Outside of Core*
So Simulacrum is a viable option..however..Its borderline redundant.
You also cannot use Simulacrum as it requires someone to cast it. The component is 100 XP (not gp) So, Im going to rule against you spending someone elses XP.

Assume that the Commoner must remain within said location for the 5 waves.
You have a 5 miles Field, in the middle of it is a small hill. Think king of the hill. The commoner must remain on the hill for the 5 waves. We will save 20x20? (If height is a problem, 60ft)

So yes. Lets make the objective to make him as Untouchable as possible.
(I must remind you tho, the waves cannot continue UNTIL the previous one has been eliminated)

Any further questions?
Also, the Deva will play as fair as you do.
Mazing the Commoner would take him off the Hill so that option is out.

The Glyphstone
2010-07-26, 08:14 PM
-Buy custom items of +Ridiculous to Diplomacy of every conceivable bonus type.
-Diplomance the waves into Fanaticism.
-Make them fight to the death for your amusement.

Never mind, a single +30 competence item is 90,000. We don't have enough cash to get Diplomacy high enough.

2010-07-26, 08:22 PM
Have him fail his save on a Maze spell.

I approve of this.

2010-07-26, 08:28 PM
I approve of this.

That would break one of the rules, *Commoner must stay on his hill
So as creative a point as it may be (and non the less Kudos) Its not solving the problem ^_^

2010-07-27, 01:05 AM
My money is on sticking the commoner in a Forcecage shaped in a windowless cell and saturating the hill with Antimagic Field. Nothing in the waves can break down the cage and AMF prevents teleporting into it.

Case closed?

2010-07-28, 11:01 AM
Is the Force-Cage Immune to the Anti Magic Field? :smallconfused:

2010-07-28, 03:21 PM
Is the Force-Cage Immune to the Anti Magic Field? :smallconfused:

Up to the DM. The rules really don't do a good job of defining whether that aspect of the Wall of Force spell carries over to the Forcecage spell.

I know, because people debated the topic to death when OotS 627 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0627.html) came out.