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View Full Version : Tricked out Summon Monster, also Gauntlets



Popertop
2010-08-11, 01:21 AM
I have a Level 12 Wizard being written up, and he's going Conjuration, gonna summon me up some beasties.

Eschew Materials(I don't know why honestly, but I had to. For some reason my wizard is paranoid of being without components)
Improved Familiar(Stirge, might switch to Imp if I feel like it)
Spell Focus(Conj)
Augment Summoning(obviously)
Quicken Spell
Empower Spell
Conjuration Specialist(I know it's not optimal, but it fits with the theme, if/when I roll this guy up for actual campaign, I'll prolly go Divination)

What are some ways both in and out of core to trick out Summons?
Right now all I know is Animal Growth, but I'm pretty sure there's better than that. I like to get Hellhounds and sneak them around if that helps at all.

My other question is about the damage that Gauntlets do.
Spiked gauntlets have 1d4 small and 1d6 medium(or something like that),
but for regular it has 1d2 for small and 1d3 for medium(which is the same amount that an unarmed character of that size would deal).
Does this mean it follows the same rules as unarmed damage?
What about the Monk's extended unarmed damage progression, how does it interact with that?
I think I read somewhere about gauntlets doing unarmed damage a size step larger than the wielders size, but I don't know about what source that might be from.
I'm asking this because I'm going to roll up a Monk/ShouDisciple who wears a pair of Metalline Gauntlets(so he can freely switch between different materials, and he can flurry with them too) and I don't know what kind of Unarmed damage he will do.

Thurbane
2010-08-12, 09:41 PM
You might find some of my ideas in this Spontaneous Summoner (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=132360) build useful...

Greenish
2010-08-12, 09:51 PM
My other question is about the damage that Gauntlets do.
Spiked gauntlets have 1d4 small and 1d6 medium(or something like that),1d4 for Medium.

but for regular it has 1d2 for small and 1d3 for medium(which is the same amount that an unarmed character of that size would deal).
Does this mean it follows the same rules as unarmed damage?Gauntlets make your Unarmed Strikes deal lethal damage, but don't change anything else.

What about the Monk's extended unarmed damage progression, how does it interact with that?It shouldn't change the damage, since "[a] strike with a gauntlet is otherwise considered an unarmed attack". You'll take -4 penalty for dealing non-lethal damage though, I believe.
I'm asking this because I'm going to roll up a Monk/ShouDisciple who wears a pair of Metalline Gauntlets(so he can freely switch between different materials, and he can flurry with them too) and I don't know what kind of Unarmed damage he will do.I don't think you can flurry with gauntlets, since they're not special monk weapons. You aren't proficient with them either, so -4 to hit.

(As an aside, if you're allowed to use gauntlets as monk US, just make the other from adamantium and the other from alchemical silver. You'll pierce most DR a lot cheaper.)

Thurbane
2010-08-12, 09:54 PM
One of the best options for a weapon that you can stack enchantments onto that will work with a Monk's US is the Ward Cestus, in the 3.0 AEG.

Private-Prinny
2010-08-12, 10:04 PM
First off, Conjuration Specialist is the best choice for a Wizard-based summoner. You may also want to consider Malconvoker (Complete Scoundrel p.48). I played a level 12 Malconvoker once, and it was honestly my favorite character that I have ever played.

My build looked like this. Adapt to taste.

Conjurer 3/Master Specialist 4/Malconvoker 5
Human Male, Neutral

Variants: Rapid Summoning (UA), Enhanced Summoning (UA), Focused Specialist (CM)
Banned Schools: Evocation, Illusion, and Necromancy

Level progression:

1. Conjurer 1 (Augment Summoning, Cloudy Conjuration, Spell Focus: Conjuration)
2. Conjurer 2
3. Conjurer 3 (Improved Initiative)
4. Master Specialist 1 (Skill Focus: Spellcraft)
5. Master Specialist 2 (Expanded Spellbook)
6. Malconvoker 1 (Deceptive Summons [Extend], Unrestricted Conjuration, Fiendish Summoning Specialist)
7. Malconvoker 2 (Planar Binding)
8. Malconvoker 3 (Skill Focus: Bluff)
9. Malconvoker 4 (Deceptive Summons [Fury], Summon Elemental)
10. Malconvoker 5 (Fiendish Legion)
11. Master Specialist 3 (Greater Spell Focus: Conjuration)
12. Master Specialist 4 (Minor School Esoterica, Craft Contingent Spell)

Add extra Evil creatures to your summoning list, nab Planar Binding spells for free, and get what is effectively +5 metamagic (Extend+Twin) on your summons. Extra HP equal to your caster level, infinite elementals to scout, some minor free feats from Master Specialist, and the Malconvoker 4 ability basically doubles Augment Summoning bonuses.

It was fun, to say the least.

Popertop
2010-08-13, 12:15 PM
yeah that sounds right up my alley.

but what are some other schools that you could ban for this?

I like evocation in general they have some useful spells in there,
and I have a generally sneaky disposition, so I'm inclined against
giving up Illusion.

Diarmuid
2010-08-13, 01:37 PM
Dont forget about the Rapid Summoning ACF from....UA? or maybe PHB2. Give up bonus feats or familiar or something and your summons are standard actions instead of full-round spells.

Private-Prinny
2010-08-13, 02:21 PM
yeah that sounds right up my alley.

but what are some other schools that you could ban for this?

I like evocation in general they have some useful spells in there,
and I have a generally sneaky disposition, so I'm inclined against
giving up Illusion.

I gave up those schools because that's what was covered by the rest of my party. In general, though, those are the schools that I would suggest banning. You need Abjuration for Magic Circle, Conjuration is your specialty, you can't ban Divination, and Transmutation is simply too good to give up.

That leaves you with Evocation, Enchantment, Illusion, and Necromancy as banning choices.

Chaelos
2010-08-13, 02:29 PM
+1 to the Malconvoker. One of my favorite Prestige Classes in the game, right there.

DarthCyberWolf
2010-08-13, 02:49 PM
There's the Imbued Summoning metamagic feat in PHB2. Allows you to cast any spell 3rd level or lower with a range of touch on the summoned creature as part of the casting of the summon spell.

OMG PONIES
2010-08-13, 03:54 PM
+1 to Private-Prinny's build. However, here are some little conjurer tricks I've always enjoyed myself:

1. The feat Metamagic School Focus allows you to reduce metamagic costs by 1 3 times per day. What does this mean? Well, along with Imbue Summoning, it means that your 3 biggest, baddest summons get a free buff spell of level 3 or lower as part of the standard action it takes to summon them. You can still cast a swift action spell or a quickened spell that round, and we all know how important the action economy is. There are some restrictions, but you can place a lot of yummy spells on your minions.

2. One level of Paragnostic Apostle. Not only do you get bardic knowledge, which just makes me feel cool, but you get the power to give all of your summons fast healing which scales with your caster level. This is a good thing.

3. Magic items: the Circlet of Rapid Casting allows you to summon some flankers in a hurry, or to buff your summons even further than Imbue Summoning already has. The Summoner's Totem lets you buff up your spells once you've run out of free Imbues, and the Ring of Mighty Summons gives you creatures at full HP, for half the time. Oh what's that, you're a Malconvoker? Well then, your summons are all extended, so you get full HP for the regular duration of the spell.

4. If you're not looking to go the Malconvoker route, pick up the feats Augment Elemental, Rashemi Elemental Summoning, and Summon Elemental. You now have big, bad rock and air elementals with super silly powers. All day long. Granted, you have to be human, and it's specific to a Forgotten Realms region, but your DM may let it fly due to awesomeness. If your DM allows setting mixing, you can also grab Mastery of the Twilight Forest (I think it's called) from the Player's Guide to Eberron, arguing that you're still summoning air and earth elementals, both of which are residents of Lamannia.

Thurbane
2010-08-13, 05:56 PM
No Rapid Spell (CD)? Turns your Summon spells into 1 standard action instead of 1 round casting time, for +1 level.

Private-Prinny
2010-08-13, 06:18 PM
No Rapid Spell (CD)? Turns your Summon spells into 1 standard action instead of 1 round casting time, for +1 level.

Which is what you take the Rapid Summoning variant from UA for. Instead of a +1 level adjustment that you have to plan ahead, you just trade out your familiar to get it applied to all summons for free.

Thurbane
2010-08-13, 06:46 PM
Which is what you take the Rapid Summoning variant from UA for. Instead of a +1 level adjustment that you have to plan ahead, you just trade out your familiar to get it applied to all summons for free.
Ah missed that...nice little variant there. :smallsmile: