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tcrudisi
2010-08-13, 09:35 PM
First, the why: I was running a module up at GenCon and the players can learn something extra if they have a passive insight 40. This is a level 1-4 mod. No, I'm not going to say what it is since that would be a spoiler ... and it's not important to the module, as you learn it eventually... you would just learn it MUCH sooner if you had the passive insight 40.

Now, the how:
+5 trained
+5 wisdom
+2 level (assuming level 4)
+2 item (assuming I ran Tyma 1-1 and got the Diadem of Acuity)
+2 background (Merchant Prince)
+12 feat (Traveler's Insight which gives +1 for each language known)

Languages known? start as human for 2, Merchant Prince gives +1, Linguist x3 gives +9 ... for a total of 12 languages known.

That puts me at passive insight 38.

I can't quite make it. I realize I'm not getting a racial bonus, but if you look at a race like Shardmind, they get 3 languages (instead of 2) and +2 racial to insight... for a +3. Human instead gets a bonus feat for +3 languages... for a +3. It's a wash.

So playgrounders - any ideas?

*edit* I'm aware that there are things that group members can do (I'm looking at you Mantle of Clarity or Shaman with Watcher Spirit Adept feat), but I really want to make it without outside help.

mobdrazhar
2010-08-13, 10:09 PM
um... linguist is +3 languages not x3

tcrudisi
2010-08-13, 10:16 PM
um... linguist is +3 languages not x3

I meant that I took it 3 times for a total of 9 languages from those feats.

Swordgleam
2010-08-13, 10:18 PM
Can you imagine the psychological impact of being that insightful? You would know exactly how everyone around you felt at all times. It would almost be like being an empath. You might go crazy.

devinkowalczyk
2010-08-13, 10:40 PM
The character then turns to solipsism because he cannot handle the amount of necessary lies that must be told, believing the whole world is a lie.


WOOO FIGHTING TIME WITH AN INT, WIS, AND CHARISMA OF 6!

(a 40 seems ridiculous and pointless to have, in my opinion)

OldFart
2010-08-13, 11:39 PM
Warlord w/ Canny Leader. Insight is class skill via Merchant Prince. Combine with what you have above and you get passive insight of 40.

tcrudisi
2010-08-14, 12:58 AM
Warlord w/ Canny Leader. Insight is class skill via Merchant Prince. Combine with what you have above and you get passive insight of 40.

You, sir, are brilliant. I actually considered that a class might give +2 to Insight, but when I thought about it, I couldn't think of any class that gave it to themselves, so I didn't look very hard into it. Obviously, that was a mistake.

Thanks.

HMS Invincible
2010-08-14, 02:25 AM
You, sir, are brilliant. I actually considered that a class might give +2 to Insight, but when I thought about it, I couldn't think of any class that gave it to themselves, so I didn't look very hard into it. Obviously, that was a mistake.

Thanks.

Couldn't you just ask a wizard to cast a spell to boost your insight? Or hell, an aid another check or some bs that the DM can buy to give you the +2.

mobdrazhar
2010-08-14, 04:12 AM
Couldn't you just ask a wizard to cast a spell to boost your insight? Or hell, an aid another check or some bs that the DM can buy to give you the +2.

aid another doesn't work for passive insight though which is what he needs

Kurald Galain
2010-08-14, 06:25 AM
There's items that boost the amount of languages you know. Most of them are headslot, though.

If you want a silly loophole, wear Reading Spectacles, which lets you read every language in existence, and convince your DM that this qualifies.

Crossfiyah
2010-08-14, 11:30 PM
Go sorcerer and max arcana instead

Angelmaker
2010-08-16, 06:48 AM
There's items that boost the amount of languages you know. Most of them are headslot, though.

If you want a silly loophole, wear Reading Spectacles, which lets you read every language in existence, and convince your DM that this qualifies.Which obviously donīt qualify - since reading spectacles only lets you read the language without you knowing it.

Still, interesting read.

BlckDv
2010-08-16, 09:24 AM
I cranked out a +40 Insight at lvl. 4 in Char. Builder last night; then re-did it as a +39 that would be "book legal" as a fresh level 4. I could not get the +40 solo without the +2 from the level 8 item mentioned already.

Things I did that are not already in the thread:

Used the level 5 Wondrous Item lamp that gives +1 to Insight and Perception. (Thus my +39 instead of +40)

Made my class a Hybrid Warlord/Cleric, with Canny Leader from Warlord, and made myself a Cleric of Sehenine, with trained Diplomacy, History, Intimidate, Insight. Being a Hybrid let me do an 8 Str, 10 Con, 10 Dex, 13 Int, 18 Wis (20 with racial from Human), 13 Cha build. I took only Warlord powers that do not have attack rolls, and Cleric powers that use Wisdom, so this guy is actually combat capable.

I conceive of the character as a negotiator for hire. He will aid any group with contracts and haggling, for a commission. (Obviously focusing on the "Trickery" aspect of his god)

tcrudisi
2010-08-16, 11:05 AM
I cranked out a +40 Insight at lvl. 4 in Char. Builder last night; then re-did it as a +39 that would be "book legal" as a fresh level 4. I could not get the +40 solo without the +2 from the level 8 item mentioned already.

Things I did that are not already in the thread:

Used the level 5 Wondrous Item lamp that gives +1 to Insight and Perception. (Thus my +39 instead of +40)

Made my class a Hybrid Warlord/Cleric, with Canny Leader from Warlord, and made myself a Cleric of Sehenine, with trained Diplomacy, History, Intimidate, Insight. Being a Hybrid let me do an 8 Str, 10 Con, 10 Dex, 13 Int, 18 Wis (20 with racial from Human), 13 Cha build. I took only Warlord powers that do not have attack rolls, and Cleric powers that use Wisdom, so this guy is actually combat capable.

I conceive of the character as a negotiator for hire. He will aid any group with contracts and haggling, for a commission. (Obviously focusing on the "Trickery" aspect of his god)

I should have clarified a bit more -- I wanted him to be LFR legal, not book legal. As such, in the Tyma 1-1 module for level 1-4 characters (played on high), you can choose the Diadem of Acuity which gives +2 insight. In LFR, you can use any magic item that you get as loot as long as it is not more than 4 levels above you. Since the Diadem is level 8, you can start wearing it as level 4 ... provided you get it as loot.

I like the idea of making him a hybrid as that really shores up his combat deficiencies, although I did the same thing with picking powers that allowed others to make attacks instead of him (or well, as much as possible).

It's kinda funny -- I posted the build itself on the 4e charop forums once OldFart mentioned that I could go Warlord and hit it. When I did that, someone over there mentioned hybriding Warlord|Cleric as well, saying that it had a nice Inquisitor feel to it. Was that you? If not - great minds think alike. :-D If I ever play the character, I'll definitely do that.

Thanks for the advise, everyone. Trying to reach Passive Insight 40 by level 4 was a really fun challenge and I hope I do get to play the module so I can surprise the DM with it. :smallbiggrin: