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Window459
2010-08-15, 02:23 AM
so i was reading up on DR and realized that its kinda crappy IMO seeing as it only protects from weapon damage, so can anyone think of a to make it betterish?

Kylarra
2010-08-15, 02:35 AM
Dwarven Defender's DR works on all damage.

Kaww
2010-08-15, 02:45 AM
Dwarven Defender's DR works on all damage.

Where did you get that from?

It reduces dmg from all attacks, NOT all dmg. Read pg 291 DMG.

Keld Denar
2010-08-15, 02:47 AM
Well, there is already Energy Resistance, which is like DR for energy damage. If you are talking about having DR work against energy attacks, that kinda detracts from Energy Resistance. One thing I would recommend is to double all player sources of DR. DR is something the authors over rated in the hands of a player, and in general the amounts you get are too little, too late. If you doubled it, it would be a lot more enticing.

ex cathedra
2010-08-15, 05:31 AM
I would suggest a specific exception (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e) to Keld's suggestion, but for the most part it's a solid idea.

Kylarra
2010-08-15, 10:10 AM
Where did you get that from?

It reduces dmg from all attacks, NOT all dmg. Read pg 291 DMG.
Specific trumps general. :smalltongue: Odd, but DD needs all the help it can get.


Damage Reduction (Ex)

At 6th level, a dwarven defender gains damage reduction. Subtract 3 points from the damage the dwarven defender takes each time he is dealt damage. At 10th level, this damage reduction rises to 6/-. Damage reduction can reduce damage to 0 but not below 0.

oxybe
2010-08-15, 12:49 PM
the closest i can think of is hardness (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/exploration.htm#tableCommonArmorWeaponAndShieldHar dnessAndHitPoints), which subtracts the value from all damage taken, physical or energy.

Yora
2010-08-15, 12:53 PM
I always consider DR to protect against anything that deals bludgeoning, piercing, or slashing damage. This includes natural attacks, unarmed attacks, stoned dropped from above, characters falling into a pit, stepping on caltrops, and so on. I'm quite sure that this is what the designers meant to say when they wrote "weapon damage".

Snake-Aes
2010-08-15, 01:00 PM
I always consider DR to protect against anything that deals bludgeoning, piercing, or slashing damage. This includes natural attacks, unarmed attacks, stoned dropped from above, characters falling into a pit, stepping on caltrops, and so on. I'm quite sure that this is what the designers meant to say when they wrote "weapon damage".

Somewhere it is pointed out it also applies to falling damage, crushing damage and the like, as they're equivalent to bludgeoning.

Frosty
2010-08-15, 01:16 PM
I'm pretty sure that falling damage bypasses all DR.

Snake-Aes
2010-08-15, 01:21 PM
Found it in a kobold-quarterly FAQ
http://www.koboldquarterly.com/k/front-page181.php


Could you elaborate, please, on why damage reduction applies to falling damage? I’ve always been in the “damage reduction doesn’t help with falling damage” camp, because I’ve never viewed falling damage as weapon damage.
The only sources of damage that ignore damage reduction are spells, spell-like abilities, and energy attacks; that is, attacks that have the acid, cold, electricity, fire, force, or sonic descriptor, including non magical forms of these energy types, such as vials of aid or alchemist’s fire. It’s possible, of course, for a spell or spell-like ability to produce an effect that is subject to damage reduction, but I can’t think of one off the top of my head.

Falling is not a spell or spell-like ability, nor does it have an energy descriptor. It does not ignore damage reduction. Other mishaps involving falling things are likewise subject to damage reduction, such as cave collapses, avalanches, or being swept way in a strong wind or water current.

Frosty
2010-08-15, 02:14 PM
Hmm...looking through the DMG, it appears that you are correct. The Fall damage bypassing DR thing must've been a common houserule or something...

Starbuck_II
2010-08-15, 02:49 PM
I'm pretty sure that falling damage bypasses all DR.

By RAW it does. But those who read Kobold Quaterly get a houserule. Falling isn't a weapon so DR doesn't apply.

Snake-Aes
2010-08-15, 02:55 PM
By RAW it does. But those who read Kobold Quaterly get a houserule. Falling isn't a weapon so DR doesn't apply.

There is actually the gap in raw. DR text says "damage from attacks", while later it also says "spells, spell-like and energy damage ignores it". Since neither mention any sort of exclusivity, stuff like "rocks fall" or "you fall on rocks" are completely open to interpretation.

The Dark Fiddler
2010-08-15, 03:00 PM
Frankly, I'd say DR working on falling rocks and falling damage and such depends on the source.

Your DR natural, like from Mineral Warrior? Then lucky you, falling hurts less.

Your DR from your armor? Sucks for you, take full damage.

Panigg
2010-08-15, 03:40 PM
DR is coming too little too late. What good is a DR 3, when that mob is hitting for 50 damage?

Snake-Aes
2010-08-15, 03:46 PM
DR is coming too little too late. What good is a DR 3, when that mob is hitting for 50 damage?

At the same time what good is ac when the mob is hitting with +30 to attack?
DR is more complicated to balance because against weaker enemies it is absolute. If you aren't losing on too much stuff to gain dr, there's no reason not to have it.
Especially because, contrary to people's beliefs, games where you get more fights over the span of the levels (thus slightly underpowered fights) don't make the game any bad.(give it a shot. 4 level-appropriate encounters a day = boring)

Wings of Peace
2010-08-15, 03:58 PM
Specific trumps general. :smalltongue: Odd, but DD needs all the help it can get.

Not entirely.



Rules Compendium: Damage reduction doesn’t reduce the damage from energy attacks, spells, spell-like abilities, and supernatural abilities. Nor does it affect poisons or diseases delivered by inhalation, ingestion, or contact.

Granted in most of the listed situations the Dwarven Defender's mighty 6/- Damage Reduction at 10th level wouldn't make an immense difference either way.