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Tyndmyr
2010-08-17, 12:33 PM
Purely through class choices. Assume you have 20 level to make this poor bugger as ineffective as possible, and you begin with 18's in all stats. You may use any legal 3.5 Player classes in any legal combination you choose.

Nick_mi
2010-08-17, 12:40 PM
I saw a prestige class last night that looked horrible. maester from wild adventurer. Didn't look into it too much but it looked effin horrible.

Frosty
2010-08-17, 12:41 PM
So Commoner is out since it's an NPC class?

I'm thinking Sorcerer with really, REALLY crappy spell selections.

Shpadoinkle
2010-08-17, 12:41 PM
CW Samurai 20 is a strong contender.

hobbes1020
2010-08-17, 12:43 PM
What about 20 levels of monk?

Tyndmyr
2010-08-17, 12:44 PM
What about 20 levels of monk?

Needs a truenamer dip, IMO.

TooManyBadgers
2010-08-17, 12:44 PM
Monk 20 has nothing on Ex-Paladin 20.

SurlySeraph
2010-08-17, 12:46 PM
Truenamer 20. With no ranks in Truenaming.

This thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-99588.html) may be helpful if we get into more detailed builds.

Amphetryon
2010-08-17, 12:49 PM
Assuming the Psionic Sandwich Trick and similar don't qualify...

1/2 Elf CW Samurai 1/Fighter 3/Soulborn 1/Shadowcaster 1/Monk 1/Divine Mind 3/Paladin 1/Truenamer 1/Vigilante 3/Scar Enforcer 2/Incarnum Blade 3 seems pretty bad.

Mongoose87
2010-08-17, 12:49 PM
Truenamer 20. With no ranks in Truenaming.

This thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-99588.html) may be helpful if we get into more detailed builds.

Truenamer 20 with ranks in Truenaming is basically worthless, anyways.

Tyndmyr
2010-08-17, 12:50 PM
What about 20 levels of monk?

Yknow, this could actually be a decent contender, if the race is a venerable kobold. Not dragonwrought, of course.

Frosty
2010-08-17, 12:57 PM
Still better than Sorcerer 20 with bad spell selections. Spells are all a sorcerer has. If all of his spells are usless, then he'sno better than a commoner.

Tyndmyr
2010-08-17, 12:58 PM
Ah, but a sorcerer can use scrolls and such on his class list. He could actually be somewhat competent due to this ability alone. I fear this makes straight caster 20 builds too powerful, as the ability to use 9th level spells via scrolls is not trivial.

TooManyBadgers
2010-08-17, 12:58 PM
Truenamer 20 with ranks in Truenaming is basically worthless, anyways.

Truenamer 19 with ranks in Truenaming is basically worthless.
Truenamer 20 with ranks in Truenaming is a Gate-spamming powerhouse.
That class is silly.

Ormagoden
2010-08-17, 01:00 PM
One level of the following classes

Wizard
Sorcerer
Druid
Cleric (not cloistered)
Beguiler
Spell thief
Dread necromancer
Psy blade
Warmage
Fighter
Monk (EX)
Truenamer
Binder
Shadowcaster
Paladin (EX)
Bard

and the following bloodline levels

Intermediate gold dragon bloodline (2)
Intermediate air elemental bloodline (2)

No skills of any relevance would be taken.
Basketweaving, roof thatching, and profession turd collector at MAX ranks.







If race was an option i'd just pick the highest - to int and cha i could get and play a true namer with the flaw that makes you suck at a skill...that skill would be truespeech

Human Paragon 3
2010-08-17, 01:05 PM
Paladin 19/Assassin 1?

Ormagoden
2010-08-17, 01:05 PM
Paladin 19/Assassin 1?

Not viable

Draz74
2010-08-17, 01:06 PM
Wasn't there a build called Nup-Nup that never advanced beyond 0 HP? So if he ever took a standard action or another attack, he'd fall unconscious?

EDIT: Missed the "18s in all stats" thing. Hmmm.

Well, I guess it's a close call then between Truenamer (lacking Truenaming or Use Magic Device) and a Sorcerer with terrible spell selection and a Wilder with terrible Power selection. (At least the Truenamer and Wilder get Medium BAB.)

Frosty
2010-08-17, 01:07 PM
Paladin 20 who falls. Now you're a fighter with no bonus feats!

SurlySeraph
2010-08-17, 01:10 PM
No skills of any relevance would be taken.
Basketweaving, roof thatching, and profession turd collector at MAX ranks.

The problem is that then he'll be good at basketweaving, roof thatching, and turd collecting. Make up as many Performs and Professions as possible and only put one point in each to make sure he is not competent at any skill, no matter how useless.

Sir_Elderberry
2010-08-17, 01:12 PM
Truenamer 19/Ex-Paladin 1?

grarrrg
2010-08-17, 01:14 PM
begin with 18's in all stats.

First thought I had was use something like the Hellfire Warlock to reduce CON to nil. Pick a race with no Racial HD (LA is ok??) that has a high CON bonus (with matching or better penalties). Can you Hellfire Blast your way down to 0? or do you have to stop at 1? Either way. On your way to Hellfire Warlock pick bad/poor Invocations, maybe if you can find a way to tank your CHA and pick all Save or XX Invocations?
Plain ole Dwarf is a good first step towards the stats, but I'm sure someone else can do better.

Greenish
2010-08-17, 01:19 PM
Truenamer from that one race with racial vow of silence (forget the name). Utterances, I'm quite sure, have to be uttered.

Ormagoden
2010-08-17, 01:21 PM
Truenamer from that one race with racial vow of silence (forget the name). Utterances, I'm quite sure, have to be uttered.

Bumon or something like that

BobVosh
2010-08-17, 01:26 PM
Duskblade (whatever level they get 2nd level spells)/Paladin 8/Mystic Theurge All the Rest.

TooManyBadgers
2010-08-17, 01:29 PM
I've got it.

Backstory:

Harold always wanted to be a star. He would lie awake at night, thinking of screaming crowds and adoring faces. He attended his studies faithfully, year after year, gazing out his window at the circus tents that sometimes would arise over the distant hills. Sometimes he could make out the sounds of laughter on the wind. Harold wanted that. He wanted to be a part of that.

One sleepless night, Harold thought he caught the faint calliope music on the wind. He donned his slippers and ambled out of bed. He knew what needed to be done. Quickly grabbing what belongings he had acquired in his long and cloistered life, he slipped into the night.

After one shady deal with a back-alley cosmetologist, Harold was prepared to run away, to join the circus, to live his dream.


Class:
Conjurer Wizard 20.

ACFs:
Dropped familiar in exchange for Rapid Summoning. (UA)

Feats:
Metamagic, metamagic reducers, all that fun stuff.

Gear:
Spellbook sold in hushed under-the-table deal in exchange for permanent clown makeup.

Greenish
2010-08-17, 01:32 PM
Bumon or something like thatAh yes, Buomman.

I've got it.

Backstory:

Harold always wanted to be a star. He would lie awake at night, thinking of screaming crowds and adoring faces. He attended his studies faithfully, year after year, gazing out his window at the circus tents that sometimes would arise over the distant hills. Sometimes he could make out the sounds of laughter on the wind. Harold wanted that. He wanted to be a part of that.

One sleepless night, Harold thought he caught the faint calliope music on the wind. He donned his slippers and ambled out of bed. He knew what needed to be done. Quickly grabbing what belongings he had acquired in his long and cloistered life, he slipped into the night.

After one shady deal with a back-alley cosmetologist, Harold was prepared to run away, to join the circus, to live his dream.


Class:
Conjurer Wizard 20.

ACFs:
Dropped familiar in exchange for Rapid Summoning. (UA)

Feats:
Metamagic, metamagic reducers, all that fun stuff.

Gear:
Spellbook sold in hushed under-the-table deal in exchange for permanent clown makeup.
"All that fun stuff" ought to include Spell Mastery once or twice and Uncanny Forethought. Spellbooks, pff.

FMArthur
2010-08-17, 01:36 PM
Truenamer 10 / Risen Martyr 10

You are dead. The only spell that can bring you back to life is True Resurrection, at which point you are immediately taken whole into the upper planes again as per your 10th-level Risen Martyr capstone. Raise Dead and Reincarnate don't work on you because you are Deathless, and Resurrection doesn't work on you for being considered an Archon, Eladrin or Guardinal (depending on whether you are LG, CG or NG) as part of your Risen Martyr's 10th level class features.

The reason you would want to have someone bring you back with something other than True Resurrection would be to lose a Risen Martyr level, die and repeat 10 more times (or 11? The class has a 0th level...) to lose them all to take something other than Risen Martyr, thus salvaging your beloved Truenamer. But you can't so you'd permanently and irreversably dead forever. I don't even know why your party would want you back, to be honest. :smallwink:

Gravious
2010-08-17, 01:44 PM
Cleric 1/Monk 3/Ex-Paladin 10/Druid 2/Sorcerer 3/Wizard 2

Cespenar
2010-08-17, 02:03 PM
Dwarf Scout 10/Dwarven Defender 7/Monk 3.

gomipile
2010-08-17, 02:14 PM
Level 20 Ex-Healer with nothing but metamagic feats, and all skill points spent on obscure perform skills.

Sleepingbear
2010-08-17, 02:21 PM
Are flaws and traits permitted as part of the build to ruin the character?

Eldan
2010-08-17, 02:41 PM
Wizard baleful polymorphed into a small animal with int 1.

DementedFellow
2010-08-17, 04:36 PM
Truenamer from that one race with racial vow of silence (forget the name). Utterances, I'm quite sure, have to be uttered.

I'm not sure about that. Even under a silence effect, the universe still hears you. Whether or not a vow of silence is a silence effect is open to interpretation, but mechanically speaking silence only hampers a Truenamer. You can still Truespeak by mouthing the words.

Kaeso
2010-08-17, 04:45 PM
What about 20 levels of monk?

What about 10 levels in CW Samurai and 10 levels in monk while wearing heavy armor?

Eldariel
2010-08-17, 05:23 PM
Yeah, any Ex-Caster is good. Tho I think what you want is 5 levels in Survivor and tons of dips overall to get BAB of like 1 or 2 with no casting ability beyond level 1 spells. You'll end up with skyhigh saves but who cares; with 18s in all stats, there's no way your saves would be bad anyways and if you can't do anything and have no AC, your saves aren't gonna help much.

Warmage 3/Rogue 1/Survivor 5/Ex-Druid 1/Ex-Cleric 1/Ex-Healer 1/Ex-Favored Soul 1/Monk 1/Marshal 1 (Watchful Eye Aura)/Scout 1/Spellthief 1/Uncanny Trickster 1/Monk of the Long Death 1/Dragon Disciple 1

Best he brings to the table is Warmage 3 casting and BAB 1 combat. He's pretty damn easy to kill physically tho making him fail a save is obviously a pain. Other than the saves tho, he has pretty much nothing going on for him. Purposely avoided casters with decent spell lists so he cannot use any Wands or Scrolls of those spells to be a Fighter.


He would probably still be a challenge to a level ~5 party (basically as long as level 1 spells do something and you don't need BAB to hit) since with that many HD, he's a giant pile of HP and with those stats he's still gonna hit hard compared to a level 1 character. The various precision damage types do something but are hard for him to trigger, as he needs separate trigger for each. All feats are obviously spent on obscure crap, and all skills on obscure Perform/Craft/Profession, depending on which is cross-class for the class in question.

Wonton
2010-08-17, 05:55 PM
I was going to suggest Green Star Adept, but they only lose 3 points of Dex, and it specifically says the minimum is 3. :smallfrown:

Glimbur
2010-08-17, 06:05 PM
I'm too lazy to do the legwork, but there is real potential in spending 19 levels to build the best wizard you can, with an emphasis on many PrC's so you get as little BAB as possible. Be sure to take lots of metamagic and item creation feats.

Level 20 is Forsaker.

KillianHawkeye
2010-08-17, 06:11 PM
Dwarf Scout 10/Dwarven Defender 7/Monk 3.

This one is hilarious! :smallamused:

FMArthur
2010-08-17, 06:25 PM
Would a Vow of Poverty Artificer be totally boned or can it still make stuff for the party? I'm not entirely sure.

Eldariel
2010-08-17, 06:45 PM
Would a Vow of Poverty Artificer be totally boned or can it still make stuff for the party? I'm not entirely sure.

He'd still be a HD 8 Med BAB Warrior with Infusions and VoP bonuses even without any gear (the rags and the quarterstaff you're allowed are all valid targets for Infusions) so he'd be just fine (comparatively) regardless of the result. He wouldn't be Tier 1 to be sure, but he'd kick the living out of the Ex-Healer 20 for example. Tho I think he may craft all he wants as long as he crafts for others.

DaragosKitsune
2010-08-17, 06:54 PM
Limbless Mute Incarnate Warforged Scout 20.

Thurbane
2010-08-17, 07:17 PM
Just pile on high LA templates, and then dip 1 level into as many casting classes as possible...BAB is going to be horrible (assuming no fractional BAB rules), and all he's going to be able to do is casting a handful of level 1 spells, at terrible CL. All feats = Skill Focus in useless skills.

1/2 Orc Vampire Bard 1/Cleric 1/Druid 1/Sorcerer 1/Wizard 1/Favored Soul 1/Wu Jen 1/Warmage 1/Dread Necro 1/Beguiler 1/Spirit Shaman 1/Shugenja 1

BAB +0

Fort +8
Ref +4
Will +24

Tohron
2010-08-17, 07:22 PM
First thought I had was use something like the Hellfire Warlock to reduce CON to nil. Pick a race with no Racial HD (LA is ok??) that has a high CON bonus (with matching or better penalties). Can you Hellfire Blast your way down to 0? or do you have to stop at 1?

You wouldn't actually have to reduce it all the way to 0 - with the Frail flaw you would just have to get it down to 5 or less in order to be completely incapacitated at 0 HP. The only remaining step would be to have pissed off a Deity with the Alter Reality SLA so they could make the ability damage permanent.

PId6
2010-08-17, 07:26 PM
Does Anything 9/Risen Martyr 10 count?

DanReiv
2010-08-17, 07:41 PM
Pixie Dungeoncrasher, using STR as dump stat, with a sorc/psion dip to make you diminutive.

Splash yourself against well...pretty much everything.

Randel
2010-08-17, 07:45 PM
Isn't there a really awful spell somewhere that sacrifices your characters soul for a one-time attack? If so, just be a wizard or sorcerer who only has that spell memorized and the rest are all useless garbage that can never hurt the enemy.

Or be a spellcaster who's last act was to put a permanent anti-magic field on yourself to protect against enemy spells.

kaptainkrutch
2010-08-17, 08:05 PM
Make sure that he's undead to get rid of that pesky 18 Constitution.


Pixie Dungeoncrasher, using STR as dump stat, with a sorc/psion dip to make you diminutive.

Splash yourself against well...pretty much everything.

He can't have a dump stat because he has all 18's.

Tyndmyr
2010-08-17, 08:07 PM
Are flaws and traits permitted as part of the build to ruin the character?

Standard two each. You must use the feats granted in some fashion, even if it's Skill Focus(Basketweaving).

The all 18s is to negate just dump statting your primary ability, which isn't very interesting.

enigmatime
2010-08-17, 08:14 PM
Ummm... OH!!! I'VE GOT IT!!! A shadowdancer thats afraid of shadows.

Makiru
2010-08-17, 08:16 PM
Let's just combine a few ideas here and just say Truenamer 19 / Forsaker 1. You were already bad at casting to begin with, now you just have...DR, I think.

Marnath
2010-08-17, 08:20 PM
A fully optimized level 20 batman wizard...that has suffered the backlash from destroying an artifact with Disjunction. No more arcane or divine spells for you, ever!

elonin
2010-08-17, 08:30 PM
Very similar to my idea but mine is easier to do. be a wiz 20 that got a bad result on contact other planes spell. Also makes you int 1.

Otherwise a monk 19 who then had an alignment change to chaotic to qualify for barbarian 1.

Tyndmyr
2010-08-17, 09:11 PM
Very similar to my idea but mine is easier to do. be a wiz 20 that got a bad result on contact other planes spell. Also makes you int 1.

Temporary, though. 5 weeks at most. So, while he'll undoubtedly suck for those five weeks, recovery afterward will put him at a normal wizard 20. The disjunction method is more permanent, but has the downside of requiring a supply of artifacts to destroy until you get unlucky. Depending on rolls, this could be problematic.


Otherwise a monk 19 who then had an alignment change to chaotic to qualify for barbarian 1.

Rather poor, yes, but I think we've already had a few worse contenders...ie, people who failed even harder at melee due to penalties, lower BaB, and less useful abilities(Rage is pretty good).

FMArthur
2010-08-17, 10:12 PM
Very similar to my idea but mine is easier to do. be a wiz 20 that got a bad result on contact other planes spell. Also makes you int 1.

Otherwise a monk 19 who then had an alignment change to chaotic to qualify for barbarian 1.

This is strictly better than Monk 20. Did you think Monks lose their (admittedly underwhelming) class features when they stop being Lawful?

drengnikrafe
2010-08-17, 10:23 PM
Doesn't a blighter lose all druid class features? So Druid 19 / Blighter 1.

The Glyphstone
2010-08-17, 10:52 PM
I'm going to throw my hat behind the two people suggesting Anything 10/Risen Martyr 10. Can't be useful to anyone if you're dead.

Tinydwarfman
2010-08-17, 11:44 PM
Does Anything 9/Risen Martyr 10 count?

We have a winner. You can't get better then dead.

Also, for the living I nominate a level 20 Wizard who took Vow of Poverty ditching his spellbook (which was also his item familiar) and now only knows Hold Portal. (which was his arcane mastery spell, or whatever that feat is that lets you cast a spell without your spellbook)

Of course, there are much worse builds, but I like the sheer hilarity of a 20th level wizard who can only spam Hold Portal.

Tyndmyr
2010-08-18, 12:07 AM
This is strictly better than Monk 20. Did you think Monks lose their (admittedly underwhelming) class features when they stop being Lawful?

Technically, they lose the ability to take more levels in monk. Oh, the tragedy.

Whyareall
2010-08-18, 01:42 AM
One running Windows 7.

Heh.

Thurbane
2010-08-18, 02:12 AM
VoP Karsite Sorceror with the Forlorn flaw: can't cast spells, can't have any items, can't have a familiar...

Kylarra
2010-08-18, 02:17 AM
We have a winner. You can't get better then dead.

Also, for the living I nominate a level 20 Wizard who took Vow of Poverty ditching his spellbook (which was also his item familiar) and now only knows Hold Portal. (which was his arcane mastery spell, or whatever that feat is that lets you cast a spell without your spellbook)

Of course, there are much worse builds, but I like the sheer hilarity of a 20th level wizard who can only spam Hold Portal.Well, Hold Portal and Read Magic. :smallbiggrin:

Wonton
2010-08-18, 02:22 AM
One running Windows 7.

Heh.

You mean Vista, right?

Haarkla
2010-08-18, 04:33 AM
Sorcerer 7 (with really crappy spell selection)/Paladin 4/Loremaster 9 (advancing paladin casting)

Then fall.


Take classes in the following order: Sorcerer 5/Paladin 4/Sorcerer 6/Loremaster 9/sorcerer 7

Dr.Epic
2010-08-18, 04:36 AM
Multiclass as often as possible. 2-3 levels in just about every class. You will have none of the high power class abilities.

Kami2awa
2010-08-18, 06:27 AM
Run Vista with all Adobe software and Norton AV.

Analytica
2010-08-18, 07:01 AM
I'm not sure about that. Even under a silence effect, the universe still hears you. Whether or not a vow of silence is a silence effect is open to interpretation, but mechanically speaking silence only hampers a Truenamer. You can still Truespeak by mouthing the words.

No, it's not a vow of silence. They can moan and wail, things like that. It's a vow against speaking any words in any language. :smallsmile:

hewhosaysfish
2010-08-18, 07:05 AM
Ummm... OH!!! I'VE GOT IT!!! A shadowdancer thats afraid of shadows.

Even better: a shadowdancer in a stick-figure comic with no shadows in it!

EDIT:
Hangonaminute. I'm AFB ATM but can anyone think of a way to make a character permanently glow e.g. playing a Lantern Archon (although they aren't playable. Bleh, you know what I meant).

Because a shadowdancer who permaently emits bright light out to a 20ft radius would be pretty screwed.

Whyareall
2010-08-18, 07:07 AM
You mean Vista, right?

Whoops, yeah, meant that.

Evard
2010-08-18, 08:26 AM
Even better: a shadowdancer in a stick-figure comic with no shadows in it!

EDIT:
Hangonaminute. I'm AFB ATM but can anyone think of a way to make a character permanently glow e.g. playing a Lantern Archon (although they aren't playable. Bleh, you know what I meant).

Because a shadowdancer who permaently emits bright light out to a 20ft radius would be pretty screwed.

Hahah so basically a shadow dancer that has been cursed by a god to have farie fire or something on them.... hmm i must look into this because I may be DM'ing a one shot and one player may be playing a shadow dancer... Causing him to glow will get him mad and make him laugh quite a bit :P

Most worthless PC would be one that went up against a diplomacy heavy Bard... Cause now the character (or maybe the hole party) works for the bard.

Kyrthain
2010-08-18, 08:38 AM
Problem with that is that PC's are immune to diplomacy

Telonius
2010-08-18, 08:39 AM
Sorcerer 7 (with really crappy spell selection)/Paladin 4/Loremaster 9 (advancing paladin casting)

Then fall.


Take classes in the following order: Sorcerer 5/Paladin 4/Sorcerer 6/Loremaster 9/sorcerer 7

Hm, I'm actually wondering if a fallen Cloistered Cleric might not beat that. Poor BAB, no spellcasting, no Turn Undead. Even a 9-INT wizard still has a familiar. All he's got is simple weapons, light armor, and 6+int skillpoints.

Lord Loss
2010-08-18, 08:42 AM
I'd use a
LE Truenamer 10/Ex-Paladin 10 with no ranks in truenaming.

Evard
2010-08-18, 09:37 AM
Really, PC's are immune to diplomacy? Never had it used that way (as a player or DM) hmmmmmm

Druid that forgets he/she has spells and an animal companion (yes this really has happened).

FMArthur
2010-08-18, 11:38 AM
To those suggesting 'Vow of...' feats: the character can still break the vow any time they choose to and all they lose is the benefit of the feat. So a Vow of Silence Truenamer isn't actully any worse off than a Truenamer who wasted a feat on Exotic Weapon Proficiency (beach ball).

enigmatime
2010-08-18, 11:54 AM
Monk 3/Paladin 4/ Blackguard 3 (is that a PrC?)/ Druid 2/ Blighter 1/ Hermit 7 (PrC I made up that causes you to lose all other class abilities and you go blind and you can't get your sight back by any spell or whatever)
The race is Half-Elf Half-Dwarf
Armor: Loin cloth
Weapon: Your boring stories (3d6 sonic damage, 47 Will Save to avoid stabbing out your ears)
Your character must live in an isolated area.

Eldariel
2010-08-18, 12:03 PM
Hm, I'm actually wondering if a fallen Cloistered Cleric might not beat that. Poor BAB, no spellcasting, no Turn Undead. Even a 9-INT wizard still has a familiar. All he's got is simple weapons, light armor, and 6+int skillpoints.

He still has BAB 10; that's quite high in this kind of contest. With the 18 Str he'll make a "fine" Warrior.

Tyndmyr
2010-08-18, 12:07 PM
So a Vow of Silence Truenamer isn't actully any worse off than a Truenamer who wasted a feat on Exotic Weapon Proficiency (beach ball).

I consider the beach ball profiiciency better, on the basis that it makes me chuckle.

Edelweiss
2010-09-08, 07:25 PM
How about a half ogre rogue (20) with sacred vow feats... including vow of peace and vow of non violence..?

FMArthur
2010-09-08, 07:34 PM
This thread ended last month. It should have ended even sooner when I posted the most unbeatably useless build on the first page. :smalltongue:

Edelweiss
2010-09-08, 07:38 PM
Yes well... I'm new >_> and a little slow I guess. I've just been looking through the entire RP section of the forums and reading stuff mostly. I enjoy a lot of people's ideas.

Darklord Xavez
2010-09-08, 07:47 PM
A sorcerer specializing in spells such as continual flame. He can't do damage spells, but he can make you a torch!
-Xavez

elonin
2010-09-08, 08:09 PM
This is strictly better than Monk 20. Did you think Monks lose their (admittedly underwhelming) class features when they stop being Lawful?

Yes. Thought that was like a paladin who knowingly commits an evil act.

KellKheraptis
2010-09-08, 08:57 PM
Social Feat Rogue 19/War Hulk 1? I think that's the one that bans use of all Int/Wis/Cha skills. You'd have no SA to fall back on, crappy BAB for a fighting class, all feats used on social crap, and no use of all the feats and skills spent to be Prince Charming. Oh, and IIRC you become illiterate too :P

mobdrazhar
2010-09-09, 04:13 PM
Monk 19/Soulknife 1

BeholderSlayer
2010-09-09, 04:32 PM
Monk 20 ???? :smalltongue:

Edit: Wow, that's a popular answer!

Kelb_Panthera
2010-09-09, 04:37 PM
Aww.... come off the monk hate you guys. It's not completely unusable. Sub-optimal certainly, but not completely worthless.

Icewraith
2010-09-09, 04:48 PM
Half-Elf Barb 6 Frenzied Berserker 3 Evoker 7 (Banned Schools Conjuration and Transmutation) Master Specialist 4

(I don't remember the level prereqs for FB off the top of my head, the point is to get frenzy more than 1/day, perhaps get the feat extra rage and apply it to frenzy.)

Grab a familiar, the feats necessary to go FB, at later levels sudden empower and maximize, at high level sacred vow and vow of poverty/peace.

If you ever take damage you go into a furious berserker rage in which you may inadvertently kill your familiar and violate the alignment restrictions on your exalted feats. You also can't cast any of the blasting spells evocation specializes in during combat, but you dropped the good battlefield control school (also can't teleport) and the buff school so you can't pump yourself up with your magic in preparation for combat. The sudden damage-boosting feats you took are likewise useless. The poor wizard BAB hinders your power attacks.


I'd add something like incantatrix 1 on here just to drop Abjuration (the other buff-heavy school and no dispel magic!) but the Iron Will prereq makes it less likely you'd fail your will save. I believe Master Specialist has a similar effect.

Other possibilites include a 1-2 level dip in fighter for armor of God acf from Complete Champion. I don't have books but I believe it lets you dump your will save for some sort of combat boos, prolonging your familiar-endangering, alignment imperiling rampage.

A character was submitted that at level 20 is permanently dead. I say to you that a character that is actively at cross-purposes as it levels is useless past level 1, not just once it hits level 20.

Also, any races out there that penalize int, con and str to add to the misery?

ericgrau
2010-09-09, 05:17 PM
Ya monk 20 is a mile away from the worst even if you're a monk hater. That's just silliness.

I was gonna say wizard 1 / druid 1 / cleric 1 / bard 1 / sorcerer 1 / what-did-I forget 1 but I actually had an idea for a character like that once who used all the dips instead of use magic device to be able to use magic items. UMD is better in the long run, but the character still isn't the worst.

Hmm... what about every noncaster mid BAB class: rogue 1, scout 1, ninja 1, monk 1, swordsage 1, assassin 1, dragon disciple 1, hmm 13 more to go. I was going to say shadowdancer 1 but that actually gives something useful. Even assassin 1 => dragon disciple 1 is iffy because of the defensive spells it makes available. Rogue gives umd too, also iffy. Any help on the other classes?

kestrel404
2010-09-09, 06:01 PM
How about:
Cleric 19/Ur-priest 1

Thalnawr
2010-09-09, 06:05 PM
Divine Mind 20?

Zieu
2010-09-11, 01:27 PM
A paraplegic Barb/Fighter? Can't charge without use of his legs...

Awnetu
2010-09-11, 01:52 PM
I use the Bonded Summoner from the miniatures handbook. I then spam my elemental until I die. As the race that takes ability damage upon breaking its vow of silence.

theMycon
2010-09-11, 10:07 PM
You mean Vista, right?

Now, now... Vista's actually a pretty good OS- when folk didn't know they were dealing with a MS product, they gave it a 98% approval rating, and it is more secure & better at multi-threading than anything Mac has put out.

If you want a truly bad OS, Windows ME was an epic failure. They basically dropped all mention of it and pretended it never happened the moment XP came out.

Zaq
2010-09-12, 01:24 AM
If we're counting "fall and lose your class features" as a viable answer, consider an Incarnate 20 who is Mindraped into being True Neutral.

I do like the "Truenamer without Truespeak" answer, but I think we can improve it by going Truenamer 19 / War Hulk 1. Not sure where we got the prereqs for War Hulk, but who cares, at this point?

Knaight
2010-09-12, 01:56 AM
Is there any way to lose psion casting? If there is, Psion Uncarnate looks like it has potiential. You get to be a ghost who can't affect the material plane, as you don't actually get powers. Joy oh joy.

Otherwise, Cloistered Cleric 14/Survivor 5/Ur Priest 1 with Vow of Peace, Vow of Poverty, and Vow of Nonviolence.

BobVosh
2010-09-12, 03:42 AM
If we're counting "fall and lose your class features" as a viable answer, consider an Incarnate 20 who is Mindraped into being True Neutral.

I do like the "Truenamer without Truespeak" answer, but I think we can improve it by going Truenamer 19 / War Hulk 1. Not sure where we got the prereqs for War Hulk, but who cares, at this point?

And then turned into a bunny rabbit.


Now, now... Vista's actually a pretty good OS- when folk didn't know they were dealing with a MS product, they gave it a 98% approval rating, and it is more secure & better at multi-threading than anything Mac has put out.

I'm not terribly surprised, I always liked vista. Now the cost for it is stupidly high, but thats another matter. I even like the default interface, especially over 7.

I'm going with a wizard with 3 con, and any templates that don't add to con, spell casting, give unbeatable regeneration, or allow him to beat face in. 19 ECL in templates. Also 9 int.

Morithias
2010-09-12, 04:02 AM
With the exception of MR. Dead up there i would have to say take 5 single level classes, then 3 levels in one class, and somehow negate all of their powers, using things like loss spellbooks, commoner levels, fallen paladin etc. Although he isn't dead, the fact is playing with RAW those 5 level 1 classes each give him a 20% decrease in experience, meaning he can never level up again or improve in anyway. At least with things like cleric 19/ Urpriest 1, if you somehow level up, there's nothing stopping you from fixing your build with more levels. With this you have to use a variant rule to fix yourself.

Totally Guy
2010-09-12, 04:25 AM
Is it possible to cheat like this:

Halfling
Fighter 1, Ranger 1, Paladin 1, Druid 1, Sorcerer 1, Monk 3.


At which point experience point penalties kick in and stop the guy getting any more experience ever. :smallwink:

Thane of Fife
2010-09-12, 07:59 AM
I don't know if there are 20 full-casting classes, but if there are, perhaps one level in each, with Spellgifted (Divination)? Fall in as many of those as you can and all you should need worry about is magic items.

Morph Bark
2010-09-12, 08:39 AM
Standard two each. You must use the feats granted in some fashion, even if it's Skill Focus(Basketweaving).

The all 18s is to negate just dump statting your primary ability, which isn't very interesting.

I would presume the all 18s are natural, not after racial adjustments?


If so, Elf Fighter 20 with Vow of Poverty and lots of Weapon Focus feats. For martial weapons.

EDIT: If 3.0 is allowed, OA Samurai 20 instead.

Awnetu
2010-09-12, 09:33 AM
I would presume the all 18s are natural, not after racial adjustments?


If so, Elf Fighter 20 with Vow of Poverty and lots of Weapon Focus feats. For martial weapons.

EDIT: If 3.0 is allowed, OA Samurai 20 instead.

CW is worse.

Morph Bark
2010-09-12, 09:48 AM
CW is worse.

Disputable; but in this case CW Samurai can also still use his class features. :smallamused:

Zaq
2010-09-12, 11:00 AM
And then turned into a bunny rabbit.

...I think that'd disqualify you from War Hulk, which would give you back your ranks in Truespeak. Better keep it simple on this one.

SirLagsalot
2010-09-12, 12:13 PM
Artificer with VoP?

ShneekeyTheLost
2010-09-12, 12:20 PM
* Make your typical quntessential Batman Wizard/Incantatrix/Initiate of Sevenfold Veil type build, using all the early entry tricks.

* Load up all the most broken feats you can think of. Craft Contingency should be a must here.

* Cap the build with Forsaker. Loose all spellcasting in the entire build. Loose the ability to use magic items, too. And now you have to destroy magic items to activate your SR 10 and ability to bypass DR/Magic with your leet physical attacks.

Harris the Ford
2010-09-12, 12:24 PM
druid 19/ blighter 1

you basically lose all of your druid cool stuff and start out as a level 1 blighter with druid bab and saves. Enjoy playing a level 1 character at level 20!

Ilmryn
2010-09-12, 12:46 PM
Duskblade (whatever level they get 2nd level spells)/Paladin 8/Mystic Theurge All the Rest.

Even worse: Replace Duskblade with Hexblade.