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Etcetera
2010-08-26, 09:54 AM
Due to the fact I'm still completely unable to get my head around making characters that work.

I'm trying to make a level 7 Wild Reaper (or similar) for a campaign in a swamp fighting against undead and warforged.

Wild Reapers lose Wild Empathy, 2 Skill points, Trackless Step, Venom Immunity, Wildshape Plants/Elementals and a few other abilities, but gain a slightly expanded spontaneous casting, turn undead at level 12, plus disease immunity and fast healing at higher levels.

The character will be evil, cos' it's more fun that way.

Does anyone have any advice on how to create a character that is not really rather bad?

Crafting is pretty much out.

All sources can be used.

Greenish
2010-08-26, 10:13 AM
So you're still a druid with prepared casting, animal companion and wild shapes to animals?

Well, take Natural Spell, turn into an animal, and kill enemies.

Zephyros
2010-08-26, 11:11 AM
While applying Divine metamagic silliness to the above^^

(and/or devotion feats)

Leon
2010-08-26, 12:13 PM
And become the cookie cutter with a slightly different flavor?



Due to the fact I'm still completely unable to get my head around making characters that work.

I'm trying to make a level 7 Wild Reaper (or similar) for a campaign in a swamp fighting against undead and warforged.

Wild Reapers lose Wild Empathy, 2 Skill points, Trackless Step, Venom Immunity, Wildshape Plants/Elementals and a few other abilities, but gain a slightly expanded spontaneous casting, turn undead at level 12, plus disease immunity and fast healing at higher levels.

The character will be evil, cos' it's more fun that way.

Does anyone have any advice on how to create a character that is not really rather bad?
Crafting is pretty much out.
All sources can be used.

Do you have some basis of what you wan the the PC to be like - what race, Vital stats etc

Etcetera
2010-08-26, 01:48 PM
A tall, sinister human considering himself above all else. One of the last of a circle of Druids who held a swamp against all interlopers until the tide of refugees became too strong after an evil takeover and now finds himself working with them for his own survival. Wields a scythe for flavour.

Stats are: 90 points to spend on stats on a 1 to 1 basis, (min 10 max 18).

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2010-08-26, 02:19 PM
Just in case you somehow skip over this, I'll make it big:
Bone Talisman (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20040721a)
You can get one dose of Unguent of Timelessness for 150 gp, put it on eight free spell foci, and it will last 60 hours per caster level. From level 3 this gets a Druid full progression Turn Undead, though it's extremely iffy whether you would be able to power divine feats with this. Cast it a bunch during downtime, or hire an NPC druid with a much higher caster level to cast it on your timeless foci, and take the talismans along on your adventures.

Greenish
2010-08-26, 02:21 PM
And become the cookie cutter with a slightly different flavor?If "a druid with natural spell" is a cookie cutter…

I guess we'll all get cookies!

Leon
2010-08-26, 03:14 PM
If "a druid with natural spell" is a cookie cutter…

I guess we'll all get cookies!

Its the common response i see from people in these type of threads and while it may work its not that interesting.



A tall, sinister human considering himself above all else. One of the last of a circle of Druids who held a swamp against all interlopers until the tide of refugees became too strong after an evil takeover and now finds himself working with them for his own survival. Wields a scythe for flavour.


A good solid base to work a idea.
Next question: Do you want to keep Wildshape as it is or Variant it out for other things or lean toward the Wild Feats that draw off it as power (Complete Divine has a Few of these)

For a Companion I'd Suggest a Monitor Lizard or a Crocodile (from the 4th lvl Animal Companion list) and to take Natural Bond to lessen the difference of level.

Keld Denar
2010-08-26, 03:23 PM
Natural Spell should really just be a class feature of Druids. Kinda like Entangling Exhalation for Dragonfire Adepts. Yea, everyone takes it. No, nobody really questions it anymore. The difference between a druid with it and a druid without it is so astronomical its bearly measurable.

Greenish
2010-08-26, 03:26 PM
Its the common response i see from people in these type of threads and while it may work its not that interesting.But it's just one feat! That hardly constitutes a "cookie cutter" build.

Etcetera
2010-08-26, 03:46 PM
Next question: Do you want to keep Wildshape as it is or Variant it out for other things or lean toward the Wild Feats that draw off it as power (Complete Divine has a Few of these)
.

Looking at the wildshape variants I'd probably just just keep it as it is. Maybe wings for an hour would be useful though.

Swok
2010-08-26, 03:49 PM
Stats are: 90 points to spend on stats on a 1 to 1 basis, (min 10 max 18).

Bluh?

You do start at 0 for each stat, right?

Etcetera
2010-08-26, 03:54 PM
Bluh?

You do start at 0 for each stat, right?

Yeah.

Fortunately.

Leon
2010-08-26, 06:22 PM
Natural Spell should really just be a class feature of Druids. Kinda like Entangling Exhalation for Dragonfire Adepts. Yea, everyone takes it. No, nobody really questions it anymore. The difference between a druid with it and a druid without it is so astronomical its bearly measurable.

Every Druid you say?
Your apparently not counting the Druids I've played - Never taken the feat, used the shapes a couple of times.

Seen "NS/wildshape/Allday Druid in action a couple of times in games and it didnt look like what i'd find fun and also been banned from playing a Druid in a few because of what other people had done with the class and permanently soured those DMs opinions of the class despite reassurances that i don't play ATV druids

As a aside - saying take Natural Spell is not great help to someone who has asked for help with creating a PC with a theme, its a
step but not the full path.

On to the Topic

My Suggestion for Stats
Str 14
Dex 16
Con 16
Int 14
Wis 18 +1 for Lvl stat
Cha 12


I'm just going to guess at standard WBL for lvl 7 unless you say otherwise and come up with what I'd consider for gear idea's


I'll think some more later on things for you

Leon
2010-08-27, 12:30 PM
For gear since you are staying with Wildshape you will probably want to get a hold of a couple of Wilding clasps - 4k a pop (found in magic of faerun)

A Peripht of Wisdom +2 (4k gold) if you want to boost your wisdom

I quite like the Ring of Sustenance (2.5k gold)

Possibly some armour with the Wild Enhancement


Feats Suggestions.

Natural Bond (Complete Adventurer)
Extend Spell
Storm Bolt (reserve spell feat from Complete Mage)
Knowledge Devotion (Complete Champ)
Xyz Wild Feat
Natural spell (if you really must)
Focus: Conjuration (its not a great feat but a lead into the next one)
Augment Summons
Spontaneous Healer (Complete Divine)

Etcetera
2010-08-27, 12:32 PM
Yeah, I decided to take Spell Focus (Conjuration) and Augment Summoning, as well as natural bond and eagle's wings.

Greenish
2010-08-27, 12:43 PM
If you've access to setting specific books, Eberron has handy druid feats, for example for summoning vermin with SNA, getting free Extends to SNA's or adding new spells and skills to druid list.

Keld Denar
2010-08-27, 04:55 PM
As a aside - saying take Natural Spell is not great help to someone who has asked for help with creating a PC with a theme, its a step but not the full path.

Druids are pretty easy to do. It is kinda a meme to say "take Natural Spell at 6 and Skill Focus: Underwater Basketweaving for your other 6 feats", but like most meme's, its based on a kernel of truth. Being able to cast while WSed is important. Its kinda like Melodic Casting, which allows you to cast spells while performing bardic music. It makes it a lot more fun since you can bring more resources to bear on any given situation because you don't have to sacrifice one to do the other, especially at low levels when you only have 1 or 2 wild shapes per day.

If YOU don't like Natural Spell, that’s fine. That doesn't make it any less of a good feat. The air of condescension and superiority, however, is not appreciated.

Leon
2010-08-28, 12:06 AM
If YOU don't like Natural Spell, that’s fine. That doesn't make it any less of a good feat. The air of condescension and superiority, however, is not appreciated.

No i don't like it.
I'm free to state that and make a point to people that there is much more to playing a druid than taking the feat and still playing a effective PC.



Being able to cast while WSed is important

Maybe so but its not a necessity.

Don't like my Air then tough, don't read my posts - Your not required to. Only person that i care for what they think of my posts is the person I'm helping.

FMArthur
2010-08-28, 01:38 PM
Keld, if you're not careful we may eventually see a forum rule about bear puns in Druid threads. I seem to recall a number of recent threads that quickly degenerated into nothing but puns... :smalltongue:

Weezer
2010-08-28, 01:43 PM
Yeah, I decided to take Spell Focus (Conjuration) and Augment Summoning, as well as natural bond and eagle's wings.

I looks like you're focusing on summoning, good choice, it can be very powerful.
If you've got access to the Ebberon Campaign Setting you should take Ashbound Summoner, you get free extend for Summon Natures Ally and all summoned creatures get +3 to hit.

Leon
2010-08-29, 12:33 AM
Also from a Ebberon Book (Magic of Ebberon i think)

Augment Elemental if you plan on using Elemental summons - given a Swamp based Druid water elementals fit right in.

+2 enhancement bonus on attack rolls and damage rolls and temporary hit points equal to twice its Hit Dice.

Stacks with regular Augment Summons (which boosts stats)