Avenger 3.5 conversion

[Castiel]

I was wondering if anyone knew of an Avenger (the 4e class) conversion into 3.5. The class is one of my favorites, but the more I look at 4e the less I like it. I still want to play an Avenger however, so if anyone could help that would be great. If there isn't already a conversion, what steps would you take in order to do that?

[DrWeird]

You're welcome. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070401a)

[Xefas]

You're welcome. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070401a)

Somehow I think he meant something similar mechanically or similar in flavor to the 4e Avenger class, rather than purely name-wise. As far as I know, Avengers are a Divine Striker class.

I might be interested in doing the homebrew, but I don't know anything about Avengers beyond that.

[DrWeird]

Probably, but I'll guess he'll have to make due, or use some divine-variant rogue.

[Castiel]

I might be interested in doing the homebrew, but I don't know anything about Avengers beyond that.

If you'd really be into I wouldn't mind typing up a basic run down of some abilities and the basic flavor.

[Xefas]

If you'd really be into I wouldn't mind typing up a basic run down of some abilities and the basic flavor.

Eh, why not? Even if it doesn't inspire me, someone else might come along. I guess just specify what tier of power (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1002.0) you want along with the above, and I'll take a look.

EDIT: Also important, are you especially for or against Tome of Battle mechanics? Also, do you want anything weird in it like Incarnum or Invocations? Anything in particular? (Saying, "No, just go nuts with whatever" is fine too).

EDIT2: The more I read about this class online, the more I get the feeling it might work well with divine-based Invocations, and maybe mixed with a little Tome of Battle (if you're cool with Tome of Battle, if not, it can still work).

[Castiel]

So… I do like tome of battle, so thats fine. Don't know much about invocations (don't have the books), but go nuts, as long as I can figure out what books they're from. Other than that do anything you want. I'm rushed for time right now, but Ill be able to type more later. The class revolves round a mark and hunt like ability. Ill type more up later.

[Xefas]

So… I do like tome of battle, so thats fine. Don't know much about invocations (don't have the books), but go nuts, as long as I can figure out what books they're from. Other than that do anything you want. I'm rushed for time right now, but Ill be able to type more later. The class revolves round a mark and hunt like ability. Ill type more up later.

Actually, I did a little bit of digging on the internet and found a surprising amount of information about the class just on forums and stuff. From what I gleaned, it's an armorless, glass-cannon melee fighter, with a whole lot of damage and not a lot else.

They revolve around something called the "Oath of Enmity" and "Censures" of Pursuit and Retribution. Flavor wise, they're like very violent, semi-stealthy paladins. A "Holy Assassin", if you will.

Is that all correct? I've actually started laying out the plans for the class. When it's done, I'll post it in another thread, and then post a link here.

EDIT: Oh, and Invocations are from the Warlock class in Complete Arcane, and the Dragonfire Adept class in Complete Mage. They're like at-will magic effects. These will obviously be Divine in nature, rather than Arcane.

[Dead_Jester]

I think it would work better as a a ToB discipline and base class. The class features (the oaths, maybe some more stuff related to stealth and pumping out divine wrath left and right) would make the ''foundation'' of the Avenger, and you could make a custom discipline for the spells (or prayers, whatever Divine dudes get in 4th ed).

You'd need to rebalanced them though, or make the encounters and dailies higher level. The utilities become counters and boosts, so no problems here. You'd also need to remove quite a few unless you are making more than one discipline (which you could, just make one for each censure), because a discipline doesn't have nearly the same amount of maneuvers as a 4th ed spell list.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Actually, I did a little bit of digging on the internet and found a surprising amount of information about the class just on forums and stuff. From what I gleaned, it's an armorless, glass-cannon melee fighter, with a whole lot of damage and not a lot else.

They revolve around something called the "Oath of Enmity" and "Censures" of Pursuit and Retribution. Flavor wise, they're like very violent, semi-stealthy paladins. A "Holy Assassin", if you will.

Is that all correct? I've actually started laying out the plans for the class. When it's done, I'll post it in another thread, and then post a link here.

EDIT: Oh, and Invocations are from the Warlock class in Complete Arcane, and the Dragonfire Adept class in Complete Mage. They're like at-will magic effects. These will obviously be Divine in nature, rather than Arcane.

Actually they are not as squishy as most strikers are, they get the highest starting amount of HP of strikers (though barbarians might have more, I have never really paid atention to them so I am not sure)

And they get a lot of mobility based powers, in fact they get some serious movement modes quite early a fly speed at level 1 (extremely limited but flying none the less) and phazing which is similar to incorporeality at level 5...ish.

[demidracolich]

Yes, barbarians have defender level hp.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Yes, barbarians have defender level hp.

With pitiful defenses I presume?

[demidracolich]

Yep, neither their primary or secondary ability scores apply to ac, they are only proficient with up to hide. Also their barbarian agility class feature only applies when in light armour. Thus they have lower AC than any other class. Though with the unerrated version of hide armour expertise they would have become OP. (Which is why the errataed it)

[Crossfiyah]

Avengers are divine strikers, dealing high amounts of damage when enemies fufill the terms of their oath.

Either by moving away from them, attacking them when they are not the oathed target, or being surrounded by allies, depending on which oath is taken.

They always get to roll twice and keep the higher result against their oathed target as long as no other enemies are adjacent to them.

They have some of the highest defenses in the game, and defender level hit points.

They have great mobility, phasing, teleportation, and flight powers.

(NutAvengersshell)

[Crossfiyah]

Yep, neither their primary or secondary ability scores apply to ac, they are only proficient with up to hide. Also their barbarian agility class feature only applies when in light armour. Thus they have lower AC than any other class. Though with the unerrated version of hide armour expertise they would have become OP. (Which is why the errataed it)

Anyone playing a good Barbarian either takes Chainmail or forgoes a bunch of Con in favor of pumping Dex.