Words to live by: Quotable Quotes

[Crisis21]

This is just a little philosophy experiment of mine.

I'm pretty sure we've all come across quotes or sayings in our lives that either have a profound influence upon how we live our lives, or explain a philosophy we already follow in a way that is much easier to understand.

My request is for each of us to share one, maybe two, particular quote that we find very important to either how we live our lives, or at least to how we would like to live our lives. It can even be something that you just wish more people would take seriously.

If at all possible, try and post the source of the quote, as in who said it first. It does not matter if the individual is/was a real person or a fictional one.

I'm pretty sure that Spider-Man's "With great power comes great responsibility" is going to crop up many times in this thread, and I find it's a good one. However, my personal favorite is as follows:

"No one is useless in this world who lightens the burden of it to anyone else."
- Charles Dickens


Edit:
This is a discussion board; there'd better be some discussion in this thread or it's going to be locked.
~Sheriff of Moddingham
As the good Sheriff said, please see about discussing your opinions and feelings about some of the quotes already posted.

[Dallas-Dakota]

That's from Spiderman.:smallwink:
Or if you're realy looking back, possibly even from Socrates ''Rule Worth of Might''.

I personally live by ''Live your life, otherwise you'l soon find that much of your life has already passed by without you truly feeling alive.''

[Kaiser Omnik]

"You must be the change you want to see in the world."
- Gandhi

“Peace is not an absence of war, it is a virtue, a state of mind, a disposition for benevolence, confidence, justice.”
- Spinoza

Bonus!

"Philosophy begins with wonder."
- Socrates

[Marillion]

"Be your own light, your own refuge. Believe only that which you test for yourself. Do not accept authority merely because it comes from a great man, or is written in a sacred book, for truth is different for each man and woman."
~Siddhartha Gautama

"It is better to conquer yourself than to win a thousand battles. Then the victory is yours. It cannot be taken from you, not by angels or by demons, heaven or hell."
~Siddhartha Gautama

"Budo (the Martial Way) is not felling the opponent by our force; nor is it a tool to lead the world into destruction with arms. True budo is to accept the spirit of the universe, keep the peace of the world, correctly produce, protect, and cultivate all things in Nature."
~O-Sensei Morihei Ueshiba


"It is better for them to wonder why you do not speak than for them to wonder why you do."

[Ichneumon]

I want to second that quote by Gandhi and add this quote, a personal favorite:

"If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet depreciate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground. They want rain without thunder and lightning. They want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters. This struggle may be a moral one; or it may be a physical one; or it may be both moral and physical; but it must be a struggle." - Frederick Douglass, American abolitionist and former slave

[Dogmantra]

Mine's silly and taken from an internet flash series, but I really appreciate the sentiment.

(Having been asked "What are you doing?")
"I don't know. And I'm alright with that!" - Blockhead.

[Asta Kask]

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/science.jpg

From XKCD.

[Krade]

"It is better for them to wonder why you do not speak than for them to wonder why you do."
Basically the same, but I like this one better.

"Better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt."

My method on discovering wether or not someone is worth talking to is if they understand the saying "You can't argue with someone who's right." I give them one chance for me to explain it and after that I give up on trying to have intellectual conversations with them.

"I'm always right. Correct, however..."

[Zen Monkey]

The heart has reasons of which reason can know nothing.
-Blaise Pascal

[Roland St. Jude]

This is a discussion board; there'd better be some discussion in this thread or it's going to be locked.
~Sheriff of Moddingham

[Dogmantra]

My method on discovering wether or not someone is worth talking to is if they understand the saying "You can't argue with someone who's right." I give them one chance for me to explain it and after that I give up on trying to have intellectual conversations with them.

Hmm... I think I've figured out what the response is supposed to be, but I want to know for certain. Or maybe there's not a set response?

Anyway, I'm curious to know what the trigger is. Mind explaining?

[Crisis21]

My method on discovering wether or not someone is worth talking to is if they understand the saying "You can't argue with someone who's right." I give them one chance for me to explain it and after that I give up on trying to have intellectual conversations with them.

Oh, do I ever second this one. I have tried to debate with people before, both online and in real life (fortunately no one on this forum yet) who try to defend their position with volume and repetition and nothing else.

I consider myself a very reasonable person and I like to understand where someone is coming from whether I agree with them or not. Those people who cannot give me enough information about their side of an issue for me to even tell if I agree or not tend to be very irritating.

[Krade]

Hmm... I think I've figured out what the response is supposed to be, but I want to know for certain. Or maybe there's not a set response?

Anyway, I'm curious to know what the trigger is. Mind explaining?

For me, it usually comes up with me jokingly saying that I'm always right. It's part of my charming personality filled with feigned egotistical remarks.

Anyways, the point is that there is a difference between 'Right' and 'Correct' in the context of the saying, "You can't argue with someone who's right." There is one definition (from Merriam-Webster's website) of 'right' that doesn't coincide with 'correct', and that involves words such as 'just' and 'proper', both of which have about the same number of definitions as there are people on this planet.

Basically, if someone is 'right', then no amount of arguing will change thier mind because they KNOW thier way is the only way that works. I've met someone so 'right' that to him "You can't argue with someone who's right" obviously meant that you were wrong for trying to argue with someone who is right. This experience is what spurred my philosophy of not bothering to try and have intelligent conversations with people who don't understand it.

Edit: thought of another way of saying it that might make more sense. Someone who is 'right' doesn't think of thier opinions as opinions and instead they think of them as facts. As such, they will never, no matter the evidence against them, alter thier opinions. Fortunately, the people who don't understand the saying and the people the saying is referring to mostly overlap.

[Delwugor]

My method on discovering wether or not someone is worth talking to is if they understand the saying "You can't argue with someone who's right." I give them one chance for me to explain it and after that I give up on trying to have intellectual conversations with them

My one serious quote that I try to follow is:
"It takes strength to judge the weakness of others, I am not so mighty." Lord Mhoram

So I try to talk to everyone about anything without qualification. From that I've learned everyone deserves equal respect and will address both the CIO and the Janitor as "Sir".

[Concrete]

"Light a fire, Sing, scream, howl!
The world is dark and quiet."

Don't know who wrote, it, but I like it's meaning.
"The world sucks, do something about it."

[Zocelot]

I understand my philosophy on a deep level, but I can't fully explain it, I just know it. Finding somebody else's words would be even harder than making my own.

[RandomNPC]

I always get a kick out of these, let's see what I've got today.

Light a fire for a man and he will be warm for the night. Light a man on fire and he will be warm the rest of his life.

more seriously,
All my life I have had the urge to do better than everyone else.

and for some motivation,
The very young and the very old know best the songs the angels sing.
(4th editon M:tG Sierra Angel)

to bad I only remember origins on one of them.

[Joran]

I subscribe to Wil Wheaton's Law (yes Wesley from TNG):

"Don't be a D**k."

It's a succinct restatement of the Golden Rule:

"Treat others as you would like to be treated."

[Castaras]

Quotes I live by?

- It wasn't me it was my muse! ~ Millie (http://www.ozyandmillie.org/d/20000223.html)

Well, even if I don't live by it I'm always thinking it whenever I pick up my work and realise half of it has doodles over it. :smalltongue: :smallbiggrin:

A few others probably could lead to political rants so I'll leave it at that.

[ForzaFiori]

I have two favorites personally. I don't know who said either of them though.

"What would you do if you knew you couldn't fail?"

and

"If the world didn't suck, we'd all fall off."

Depending on my state of mind at the time, one of the two of those is sure to show my feelings on life.

[Dr. Bath]

I subscribe to Wil Wheaton's Law (yes Wesley from TNG):

"Don't be a D**k."

It's a succinct restatement of the Golden Rule:

"Treat others as you would like to be treated."

Yeah that's pretty much a what any good life philosophy boils down to. It's a good tenet to live by.

[RandomNPC]

Another tweak of the golden rule:

Treat others as they have treated you, for aren't they showing you how they want to be treated?

[Krade]

On the subject of the Golden Rule:

Appropriate link (http://www.rockpapercynic.com/index.php?date=2010-08-23)

[Mx.Silver]

Did somebody say philosophical discussion? :smallwink:

This is probably something of a minority attitude, but I actually dislike the practice of placing importance on 'profound' sayings and quotes. In fact, I tend to view the habit as being symptomatic of the soundbite culture that pollutes a lot of debate (mainly amongst the general public - it's much less prevelent in academia, especially in philosophy). Consequently, quotations - particularly when used in the style this thread deals with - rub me up the wrong way.

A particularly important reason is that, in an awful lot of debates, quoting an 'important' figure is generally little more than a disguised argument from authority. Anyone who's been involved in debates and arguments before has probably encountered someone who, when challenged, has trotted some pithy saying in support of there position and expected this to do the work for them. In most cases the source for this quote won't even be from someone revelant to the topic - e.g. quoting Ghandi in a discussion on science - but even when it is the fact remains that a quote is completely useless if it's presented without anythig to support the opinion it's advocating, regardless of how intelligent the person who originally said it was.

Now, it can be challenged that using this reason is a bit unfair. The fact that quotes are often used when committing the fallacy of argument from authority doesn't mean that quotes themselves are bad. This does seem like a fair challenge, since you can't really blame something for how it's used. However, I'm of the opinion that the practice of revering quotations actually encourages the appeal to authority in argument, or is at the very least symptomatic of an attitude which does.

Firstly, it contributes to an 'idolising' (some might say 'beatifying') of certain historical figures. Put simply, ascribe 'words of wisdom' to peaple carries with it the implication that they are themselves wise. No real harm there, but once done enough the idea that said individual is wise becomes entrenched in the public psyche and then the process begins to work in reverse: 'because person x is wise then what they say must carry wisdom'. This is much more likely to occur to historical figures since, as they aren't around any more, our knowledge of them becomes much more susceptable to myth. Hence people become more prone to simply bringing up words of a wise figure in debate, because it can be difficult to remember that, while they may have been great thinkers of their time and in their own fields, that is no reason to assume they still count as such in the discussions at hand.

The second problem is that it serves to undermine intellectual independance. Yes, a pithy quotation rolls of the tongue more easily then a longer explanation you might give, but a more informative explanation will always be of greater usefullness. This is in addition to the fact that relying on other's words of wisdom deprives you of the opportunity to try and come-up with something yourself.

Note that I'm not saying that venerating quotations represent the first step on some nasty slippery slope. Just that I find the practice to be a very poor alternative to reasoned discussion.


tl;dr: there's little real point in relying on quotes to say things for you. You're better off working it out for yourself.

[KenderWizard]

Another tweak of the golden rule:

Treat others as they have treated you, for aren't they showing you how they want to be treated?

Ooh, I like that one!

On the subject of quotes being too boiled down to truly be meaningful, and a symptom of today's "soundbite culture", I have a good idiotic-quoting related story, in spoiler because it's slightly off topic.
Recently a member of the Irish Seanad (like the Senate) fell into an expenses scandal. When defending himself, he said "As the great Francis of Assisi once said..." and then quoted someone else entirely. Probably because St Francis didn't have much to say on the subject of receiving public money, what with his vow of poverty and all!

Now let's not discuss anything of this story apart from the key "Man uses quotes very badly in public sphere", since I realise I've referenced both politics and religion. If anyone feels it's too much of either, I'll remove the whole story, since it doesn't make any sense at all without the expenses scandal and the vow of poverty.

Anyway, I find it very hard to sum up things I try to live by in quotes other people have said, so maybe I'll say a couple of things I try to live by, and if anyone knows a good quote that sums one up, they could tell me?

- Respect is earned, not blindly given.
- It's very important to think hard about everything except what foolish people might think of you.
- Do what's right by you, not what you think other people expect you to do.
- Smile at strangers.

And, to finish, my favourite quote of the moment:
Don't change colour to match the walls. Look like you belong, and the walls will change colour to match you. ~ Kender proverb (Dragonlance)

[Drakevarg]

"Ernest Hemingway once wrote, 'The world is a fine place and worth fighting for.' I agree with the second part." - William Somerset, Se7en

"I do not agree with what you have to say, but will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire

"I put no stock in religion. By the word religion I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called the will of God. I have seen too much religion in the eyes of too many murderers. Holiness is in right action, and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves, and goodness." - Hospitaller, Kingdom of Heaven

"A king may move a man, a father may claim a son. But remember that, even when those who move you be kings or men of power, your soul is in your keeping alone. When you stand before God you cannot say "but I was told by others to do thus" or that "virtue was not convinient at the time." This will not suffice. Remember that." - King Baldwin IV, Kingdom of Heaven

"Things are rarely just crazy enough to work, but they are frequently just crazy enough to fail hilariously." - XKCD

I got a boatload of 'em. :smalltongue:


- Smile at strangers.

I curtly nod at strangers. Does that count?

[Gullara]

Anyway, I find it very hard to sum up things I try to live by in quotes other people have said, so maybe I'll say a couple of things I try to live by, and if anyone knows a good quote that sums one up, they could tell me?

- Respect is earned, not blindly given.
- It's very important to think hard about everything except what foolish people might think of you.
- Do what's right by you, not what you think other people expect you to do.
- Smile at strangers.

And, to finish, my favourite quote of the moment:
Don't change colour to match the walls. Look like you belong, and the walls will change colour to match you. ~ Kender proverb (Dragonlance)

A better philosophy is to
"give everybody your respect until they do or say something to lose it"

[Kaiser Omnik]

Stuff

And there you managed to sound terribly elitist right from your second paragraph! Maybe the general public will know better now! Or, even I, poor foolish grad student who happens to like witty quotes! :smallsigh:

I won't bother replying to the whole text, especially things such as "idolization of quotable people" that have no roots in reality...but I'll just say this:

Who ever said this was about quoting autority instead of having reasoned discussion? If you know people who won't discuss properly and just quote, the problem is not with the use of quotes, but with those people, that's all...

[DarkSetzer]

“There is nothing like looking, if you want to find something. You certainly usually find something, if you look, but it is not always quite the something you were after.”
~ J.R.R. Tolkien

Words to live by.

[Gullara]

“There is nothing like looking, if you want to find something. You certainly usually find something, if you look, but it is not always quite the something you were after.”
~ J.R.R. Tolkien

Words to live by.

Is that from The Hobbit or Lord of the Rings?

[Delwugor]

A better philosophy is to
"give everybody your respect until they do or say something to lose it"

AWESOME!!!!! You earn the "Delwugor hefts his Axe in Salute" award ... it's very valuable. :smallbiggrin:
I've often felt the "You have to earn my respect" to be a bit arrogant. Why? What makes someone so special that I have to earn their respect?

[Gullara]

AWESOME!!!!! You earn the "Delwugor hefts his Axe in Salute" award ... it's very valuable. :smallbiggrin:
I've often felt the "You have to earn my respect" to be a bit arrogant. Why? What makes someone so special that I have to earn their respect?

Awesome, can I sig that?

If I don't get a response I'm doing it anyway:smallbiggrin:

EDIT: You were warned:smallamused:

[Lord Raziere]

"There is no truth, there is no certainty, there is only freedom and the knowledge and the belief to use it."- Me

"Those who go against the odds are brave. Those who go against the impossible make history"- a friend of mine who modified my original quote.

"Nothing is perfect"- pretty common but probably one of the wisest words ever spoken

"Don't Assume."- me

"Moderate everything, even your moderation."- Me.

"Look at all the bad things in the world, look at all the bad things that could possibly happen, look at all that you fear and all that could wrong. now point and laugh and do whatever you want anyways."- me

I know, I know I'm a self-quoting egotistical hack who probably made up half of those things in the spur of the moment.....but whatevs.... wisdom is wisdom no matter what the source.

[Gullara]

"There is no truth, there is no certainty, there is only freedom and the knowledge and the belief to use it."- Me

"Those who go against the odds are brave. Those who go against the impossible make history"- a friend of mine who modified my original quote.

"Nothing is perfect"- pretty common but probably one of the wisest words ever spoken

"Don't Assume."- me

"Moderate everything, even your moderation."- Me.

"Look at all the bad things in the world, look at all the bad things that could possibly happen, look at all that you fear and all that could wrong. now point and laugh and do whatever you want anyways."- me

I know, I know I'm a self-quoting egotistical hack who probably made up half of those things in the spur of the moment.....but whatevs.... wisdom is wisdom no matter what the source.

I'll expand on this one.

When you assume you make an ass out of you and me. ass(u)(me) :smalltongue:

[Zevox]

To my surprise, I've actually found a pretty succinct statement of my view of morality - in a video game.

"We each decide our own sense of right and wrong. The rest, I leave to my sword." - from Tales of Vesperia's Yuri Lowell.

Assume that the "sword" part is a metaphor for action in general, and that's a pretty decent way to summarize my view of the matter.

Besides that, I could spend all day quoting Thomas Jefferson on various matters, but they mostly hit too much on politics or religion to post here... and honestly, even those that don't immediately would probably veer to close to politics if I tried to explain why I agree with them. A pity.


A better philosophy is to
"give everybody your respect until they do or say something to lose it"
Oh, definitely. That is one of the few things I remember running across in R.A. Salvatore's books that is genuinely insightful and worthwhile. Not acting respectful towards others isn't going to cause them to want to gain your respect, it's going to cause them to dislike you and lead to hard feelings that, at worst, become hostility. That creates problems that could be avoided simply by ceasing to treat respect as something that must be earned.

Zevox

[Archpaladin Zousha]

I've always found this particular law from our good friend Murphy to resonate with every aspect of my life (and no, it's not the one you think):

Everything takes longer than you expect it to.

This is why if I need to be somewhere in a half-hour, I try to leave 45 minutes prior, or even an hour early if I'm walking somewhere. If I go into something expecting to be done quickly, I'm usually wrong.

[Silly Wizard]

My favorite quote:

"Ultimately, man should not ask what the meaning of his life is, but rather he must recognize that it is he who is asked." -Viktor E Frankl

On a less serious note, one about D&D that I heard someone else say on some other forum that escapes my memory:

"Get some stable, sane, and clean friends, and convince them of the joys of getting drunk and pretending you're wizards," -Peter Weller

[Dr.Epic]

Just about half the stuff from Watchmen I saw is quotable.

[Gullara]

Oh, definitely. That is one of the few things I remember running across in R.A. Salvatore's books that is genuinely insightful and worthwhile. Not acting respectful towards others isn't going to cause them to want to gain your respect, it's going to cause them to dislike you and lead to hard feelings that, at worst, become hostility. That creates problems that could be avoided simply by ceasing to treat respect as something that must be earned.

Zevox

That's where I first came across it. I wonder which book it was. One of the once centered around Drizzt for sure. Not that that narrows it down:smalltongue:.

[Zevox]

That's where I first came across it. I wonder which book it was. One of the once centered around Drizzt for sure. Not that that narrows it down:smalltongue:.
I think it was sometime after Wulfgar "died." I remember it was a diary entry talking about Captain Duedermont, but I couldn't really pinpoint it myself either, other than that it wasn't one of the early books.

Zevox

[The Succubus]

"Battle not with monsters, lest you become a monster and remember that when you gaze into the abyss, the abyss also gazes into you." - Frederich Nietchze.

One of my favourite quotes and a good warning about corrupting nature of power.

"Battle not with monsters, unless you have a +5 axe of monster bane and when you gaze into the abyss, be sure to give it a friendly smile as well as it gets very cold and lonely down there." - MasamuneSSX

[Mx.Silver]

And there you managed to sound terribly elitist right from your second paragraph!
And the apparrent elitism of an argument is relevent to its validity because? Or are you actually suggesting that academic debate doesn't tend have more rigorous standards than lay debate, as a general?


I won't bother replying to the whole text, especially things such as "idolization of quotable people" that have no roots in reality
The mythologising of historical figures is an easily verifiable phenomenon.


Who ever said this was about quoting autority instead of having reasoned discussion?
Nobody, in most cases the use of quotes does not impact negatively on a discussion. However, since an unsupported quote is useless, the actual utility of quotes is rarely going to be anything other than nil at the bast of times.

[Fifty-Eyed Fred]

There are various individual quotes I like simply because I both agree with them and find their style just as agreeable. The two in my signature, for starters.

Some more examples:
"If I have seen a little further, it is by standing on the shoulders of giants." - Isaac Newton
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
"Blessed is the man, who having nothing to say, abstains from giving wordy evidence of the fact." - George Eliot
"Taste every fruit of every tree in the garden at least once. It is an insult to creation not to experience it fully. Temperance is wickedness." - Stephen Fry
"If you just set out to be liked, you would be prepared to compromise on anything at any time, and you would achieve nothing." - Margaret Thatcher
"Life is too important to be taken seriously." - Oscar Wilde
"They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance." - Terry Pratchett

Oh, and I do believe Mr. Silver will appreciate the irony of this one:
"Quotation is a serviceable substitute for wit." - Oscar Wilde
:smallwink:

[KenderWizard]

"I do not agree with what you have to say, but will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire

*snip*

I curtly nod at strangers. Does that count?

I was trying to remember who said that defend to the death one today! I thought of the quote and was going to come say it here but I couldn't remember who said it. I'm sure google would have helped me out, though. And sure, nodding is a good first step! :smalltongue:


A better philosophy is to
"give everybody your respect until they do or say something to lose it"


AWESOME!!!!! You earn the "Delwugor hefts his Axe in Salute" award ... it's very valuable. :smallbiggrin:
I've often felt the "You have to earn my respect" to be a bit arrogant. Why? What makes someone so special that I have to earn their respect?

As far as the earned vs given respect thing goes, allow me to explain why I said "Respect is earned, not blindly given" rather than giving respect first, then taking it away if they lose it. Spoiler for length.


Firstly, I think there's a problem with the language around this. The respect I mean is not just a common politeness or willingness to listen to them, but a deep admiration of them, an assumption that if it looks like they're doing something wrong, you yourself are probably mistaken. When you ask someone "Who do you really respect?", you're not asking them "Who have you treated with common decency over your life?" you're asking "Who do you think is important and worthy of your admiration?"

So, yes, when I meet someone new, I will try to automatically give them the respect anyone deserves: to have their opinions taken seriously, their views listened to, to be treated fairly by me, that kind of thing. But I won't automatically Respect them, unless they have earned it in some way.

I don't know about elsewhere, but where I come from there has historically been a problem that a lot of people think that because someone holds a particular job, let's say, they're a teacher, that means they are automatically worthy of respect, and their word will be held as more important than a child's or a parent's if there's a dispute. And the children are taught that some things are wrong, but the teacher never is wrong. So if a teacher abuses this power, the children can't so anything about it because people think "Oh, but Mr X is a teacher, that's worthy of respect." Same goes for politicians, or people in authority in some way. Yes, in a perfect world, all teachers would be devoted to helping children learn and achieve their full potential, and therefore would be worthy of great respect, but they're human, and any of them could have ulterior motives or just be petty and mean, so they deserve Respect only when they have earned it. From society, not from me specifically, but society is only made of me and my friends and neighbours, and their friends, and so on.

In short, when I say I will not automatically give you respect until you've earned it, I don't mean I will treat you disrespectfully, but that I won't automatically take everything you say as the truth, or take your word as worth more than someone else's.

[Quincunx]

Is there a place for "gestures to live by"? :smallamused:

[truemane]

The one that best sums up the way I try to live my life is:

"Wherever you go, there you are."

It's often attributed to Siddhartha Gautama (the Buddha) but I don't think it has a definite source. I say the Buddha said it when I say it, because it's fun.

In AA they say: "An a-hole gets on a plane in New York, an a-hole gets off a plane in New Jersey." Same sentiment, different wording.

Another good one from Margaret Thatcher:

"Being in power is like being a lady. If you have to tell someone you are, you aren't."

And although it's s little fanciful, I have a soft spot in my heart for:

"Those who cannot hear the music think the dancers mad."

Often attributed to Nietzsche, but again, I don't think it has a definite source.

[Zevox]

Firstly, I think there's a problem with the language around this. The respect I mean is not just a common politeness or willingness to listen to them, but a deep admiration of them, an assumption that if it looks like they're doing something wrong, you yourself are probably mistaken. When you ask someone "Who do you really respect?", you're not asking them "Who have you treated with common decency over your life?" you're asking "Who do you think is important and worthy of your admiration?"
The language problem here is that you're not talking about respect, you're talking about something more along the lines of trust and admiration.

Zevox

[Marillion]

When you assume you make an ass out of you and me. ass(u)(me) :smalltongue:
No, when you make an assumption, you make an ass out of you and some guy named Umption, which has NOTHING to do with me!:smalltongue:

[Pyrian]

Now I want to make a character named Umption. :smallcool:

[Gullara]

No, when you make an assumption, you make an ass out of you and some guy named Umption, which has NOTHING to do with me!:smalltongue:

Interesting, how'd I miss that?

[Asta Kask]

"Phfft! Facts. You can use them to prove anything."
-- Homer Simpson

[Gullara]

"Phfft! Facts. You can use them to prove anything."
-- Homer Simpson

"I saw my chance and I took it. That's what heroes do."
-- Homer Simpson

[Delwugor]

Awesome, can I sig that?

If I don't get a response I'm doing it anyway:smallbiggrin:

EDIT: You were warned:smallamused:

It will provide instant protection from Orcs, Ogres and dancing Elves.

[KenderWizard]

The language problem here is that you're not talking about respect, you're talking about something more along the lines of trust and admiration.

Zevox

But it's different from both those things. I guess if I was going to use a different word, I'd say esteem, or to hold someone in high regard. And I could just as easily use politeness for the other kind of respect. I don't know which would be technically more correct, and I suppose it could be argued there's a sliding scale of respectfulness, ranging from basic manners to deference. Either way, I believe people can use the term respect to mean somewhat different things, which is the language problem I refer to.


No, when you make an assumption, you make an ass out of you and some guy named Umption, which has NOTHING to do with me!:smalltongue:

An excellent philosophy! :smallsmile:

[Drakevarg]

I was trying to remember who said that defend to the death one today! I thought of the quote and was going to come say it here but I couldn't remember who said it. I'm sure google would have helped me out, though.

It used to be my personal motto, before I decided to change it to "Art is Mankind's only redeeming feature."

[Delwugor]

In short, when I say I will not automatically give you respect until you've earned it, I don't mean I will treat you disrespectfully, but that I won't automatically take everything you say as the truth, or take your word as worth more than someone else's.

Good clarification!

[Marillion]

I was trying to remember who said that defend to the death one today! I thought of the quote and was going to come say it here but I couldn't remember who said it. I'm sure google would have helped me out, though. :smalltongue:


Technically, Voltaire didn't say that. Someone who was summing up his works said that. [/nitpick] :p

Personally, I much prefer "I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will defend to the death your right to shut up."


No, not really, it's just hilarious to see the look on some people's faces when I say that hehe

Also, "Do unto others before they do unto you.":smalltongue:

[Asta Kask]

Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned...


Thou Sun, who view'st at once the world below;
Thou Juno, guardian of the nuptial vow;
Thou Hecate hearken from thy dark abodes!
Ye Furies, fiends, and violated gods,
All pow'rs invok'd with Dido's dying breath,
Attend her curses and avenge her death!
If so the Fates ordain, Jove commands,
Th' ungrateful wretch should find the Latian lands,
Yet let a race untam'd, and haughty foes,
His peaceful entrance with dire arms oppose:
Oppress'd with numbers in th' unequal field,
His men discourag'd, and himself expell'd,
Let him for succor sue from place to place,
Torn from his subjects, and his son's embrace.
First, let him see his friends in battle slain,
And their untimely fate lament in vain;
And when, at length, the cruel war shall cease,
On hard conditions may he buy his peace:
Nor let him then enjoy supreme command;
But fall, untimely, by some hostile hand,
And lie unburied on the barren sand!
These are my pray'rs, and this my dying will;
And you, my Tyrians, ev'ry curse fulfil.
Perpetual hate and mortal wars proclaim,
Against the prince, the people, and the name.
These grateful off'rings on my grave bestow;
Nor league, nor love, the hostile nations know!
Now, and from hence, in ev'ry future age,
When rage excites your arms, and strength supplies the rage
Rise some avenger of our Libyan blood,
With fire and sword pursue the perjur'd brood;
Our arms, our seas, our shores, oppos'd to theirs;
And the same hate descend on all our heirs

And a cookie to the first to identify the quote. No Googling!

[Zevox]

And a cookie to the first to identify the quote. No Googling!
Looks like something out of the Aeneid. I'm not entirely sure though. In any event, what does it have to do with this topic? Seems pretty much like a random quote, without relevance to the "words to live by"/pseudo-philosophical theme this thread is supposed to have going.

Zevox

[Gullara]

It will provide instant protection from Orcs, Ogres and dancing Elves.

Excellent. Dancing elves always give be trouble. Something about evil abomination, or some such nonsense. On the downside some of my best friends are orcs and ogres.

[thubby]

i would say almost anything ever said by carl sagan. the man just exuded pure awesome
"For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring"
"Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were. But without it we go nowhere."
:smallbiggrin:

[Zocelot]

I've always found this particular law from our good friend Murphy to resonate with every aspect of my life (and no, it's not the one you think):

Everything takes longer than you expect it to.

This is why if I need to be somewhere in a half-hour, I try to leave 45 minutes prior, or even an hour early if I'm walking somewhere. If I go into something expecting to be done quickly, I'm usually wrong.

"Everything takes twice as long and costs five times as much as the original estimation"

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Looks like something out of the Aeneid. I'm not entirely sure though.
Correct. It's from Book IV of The Aeneid to be specific. And I agree, it doesn't seem to have much relevance to the topic.

[Anima]

"Life is a dish piled half with joy and half with bitterness. A person finds happiness not because they are blessed, but because they have found it in their heart. That which makes people truly happy is the effort they make to forget their sadness, and the effort they make to claim their happiness."
The Hue-King, from The twelve Kingdoms by Fuyumi Ono.

It may be quite a bit wordy for a quote, but it has left quite the impression when I heard it for the first time. To tell the truth, I didn't understood it at first, mostly because I was quite like the person this little lecture was addressed to. Thinking that life is unfair and only deals low blows, totally missing the fact that I myself am responsible for my own happiness. Even more so the fact that everything gained without effort feels shallow and ultimately unsatisfying.
To try to get your life back on the right tracks feels at least as good as having it there in the first place. It's basically what I have been living by the last few months.

[Astrella]

Correct. It's from Book IV of The Aeneid to be specific. And I agree, it doesn't seem to have much relevance to the topic.

Dido's dying speech? Not sure the whole Carthago business was book 4, but I think it was.

[Asta Kask]

None of you like to live your life for vengeance?

[Kobold-Bard]

(As in my sig): "Time you enjoyed wasting is not wasted time."

Love this one because I get really depressed at times because almost all my hobbies (online D&D being a big offender) as well as my choice of degree seem pointless ("historian" isn't exactly a useful vocation). This one is inscribed on a pocket watch I always have with me and it's important to me because enjoying your time on Earth is one of the most important things in life.

In a similar vein: "Everybody dies, but not everybody lives."

This one got me very annoyed at myself for being such a recluse and wasting my short time at uni being a 20 year old whiny emo-kid. Heard this one on an advert for a channel 4 show about a roofer who jumps off buildings and it literally changed my outlook. I forced myself to talk to people at work, and it's made it more enjoyable being there.

Between the two of them they've kept me out of the Depression Thread for months now, which is something I and (I imagine) everyone there appreciate.

[Asta Kask]

Ok, how about this one:


Rationality, in the sense of an appeal to a universal and impersonal standard of truth, is of supreme importance... not only in ages in which it easily prevails, but also, and even more, in those less fortunate times in which it is despised and rejected as the vain dream of men who lack the virility to kill where they cannot agree.

That is something I try to live by, which cannot be said of the Homer Simpson quote...

[Zordrath]

(As in my sig): "Time you enjoyed wasting is not wasted time."

Love this one because I get really depressed at times because almost all my hobbies (online D&D being a big offender) as well as my choice of degree seem pointless ("historian" isn't exactly a useful vocation). This one is inscribed on a pocket watch I always have with me and it's important to me because enjoying your time on Earth is one of the most important things in life.
That's a great one, thanks for sharing.

One of my favorite quotes is one I came upon in this very forum, the one about childishness by C.S. Lewis in Zevox's signature. I've always hated it when people dismissed things as 'childish' and therefore not worthwile, contrasting it with more 'adult' activities supposed to be worthier of one's time... I agree wholeheartedly with Lewis' take on the subject.

And finally, to contribute something new to the topic as well, I've always found Terry Pratchett to be insanely quotable:

"There are, it has been said, two types of people in the world. There are those who, when presented with a glass that is exactly half full, say: this glass is half full. And then there are those who say: this glass is half empty.
The world belongs, however, to those who can look at the glass and say: What's up with this glass? Excuse me? Excuse me? This is my glass? I don't think so. My glass was full! And it was a bigger glass!"

[Krade]

The correct answer is: "The glass is full. It is 50% filled with water and 50% filled with air.":smalltongue:

From Jim Gaffigan:
"There are two kinds of people in the world: There's people who really, really enjoy bowling, and then there's people who say, 'Wouldn't it be hilarious if we all went bowling?'"

A true statement if there ever was one.

[CrimsonAngel]

"Look at all the bad things in the world, look at all the bad things that could possibly happen, look at all that you fear and all that could wrong. now point and laugh and do whatever you want anyways."- me


Look at the world. Now look at me. Now back at the world. Now back to me.

[Skeppio]

(As in my sig): "Time you enjoyed wasting is not wasted time."
I don't quite understand this one. I can count several times I've enjoyed myself that were a waste of time. Mainly the two years I spent at Uni. I had a great time and thoroughly enjoyed the course, but I can safely say that I would have been far better off if I had never signed up for it.

Maybe I'm just thinking too logically.

[Froogleyboy]

Though some people may disagree with a lot that he said, Allister Crowley has always been a person I model myself after (the abstract philosophy side of him, that is) Here are a few of my favorite quotes by him:

“Ordinary morality is only for ordinary people.”

“I was asked to memorize what I did not understand; and, my memory being so good, it refused to be insulted in that manner.”

“Intolerance is evidence of impotence.”

[golentan]

I don't quite understand this one. I can count several times I've enjoyed myself that were a waste of time. Mainly the two years I spent at Uni. I had a great time and thoroughly enjoyed the course, but I can safely say that I would have been far better off if I had never signed up for it.

Maybe I'm just thinking too logically.

I think that the proper response to this is my favorite quote.

"If you worked to make a better life but didn't enjoy the work, in what sense did you succeed?"

While it's not good to ignore the future in favor of the present, I think too many people keep putting off their enjoyment "for a better tomorrow" that never comes or comes too late. If you enjoyed university, and learned something there about the course material or yourself or your friends, I think it's silly to say you'd be better off never having gone.

Edit: On lord Raziere's:
"An optimist believes we live in the best of all possible worlds. A pessimist agrees."

[Capt Spanner]

“There is nothing like looking, if you want to find something. You certainly usually find something, if you look, but it is not always quite the something you were after.”
~ J.R.R. Tolkien

Words to live by.

"Dinnae discount tha victories ye have, jus' cause ye dinnae plan fer 'em."

Similar sentiment, more succinctly put. (Yes, Rich, that is a favourable comparison to J.R.R.) This is really true for science. When they first invented radio astronomy they thought they'd find almost nothing. Instead, they revolutionised astronomy. If only I could remember who said it... :smalltongue:


My personal favourite, often (and, I suspect erroneously) attributed to Elvis Presley:

"Lord, grant me the strength to change the things I can change,
"The serenity to accept the things I cannot
"And the wisdom to tell the difference.
"Amen."

[Mystic Muse]

"No Man made a greater mistake than he who did nothing because he could only do a little"

It's attributed to Edmund Burke. Not Sure if he's the actual source.

Another saying attributed to him "Evil triumphs when good men do nothing"

I agree with both personally.

[Marillion]

My personal favourite, often (and, I suspect erroneously) attributed to Elvis Presley:

"Lord, grant me the strength to change the things I can change,
"The serenity to accept the things I cannot
"And the wisdom to tell the difference.
"Amen."
"Grant me the strength to change the things I can
The inability to accept what I can't,
and the incapacity to tell the difference."
~Bill Watterson :smallwink:

[Lord Raziere]

the original quote was:

"grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.
courage, for the things I can,
and the wisdom to tell the difference."
-Kurt Vonnegut, Slaughterhouse Five.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Dido's dying speech? Not sure the whole Carthago business was book 4, but I think it was.
Maybe my translation's different, but that's where I found it. Technically the Carthage business started at the beginning though. Still, it doesn't seem to be a quote to live by. :smallconfused:

[Kallisti]

"I would rather recollect a life misspent on fragile things than spent avoiding moral debt."

--Neil Gaiman, Fragile Things.

[Zeb The Troll]

Not acting respectful towards others isn't going to cause them to want to gain your respect, it's going to cause them to dislike you and lead to hard feelings that, at worst, become hostility. That creates problems that could be avoided simply by ceasing to treat respect as something that must be earned.

Zevox


As far as the earned vs given respect thing goes, allow me to explain why I said "Respect is earned, not blindly given" rather than giving respect first, then taking it away if they lose it. Spoiler for length.


Firstly, I think there's a problem with the language around this. The respect I mean is not just a common politeness or willingness to listen to them, but a deep admiration of them, an assumption that if it looks like they're doing something wrong, you yourself are probably mistaken. When you ask someone "Who do you really respect?", you're not asking them "Who have you treated with common decency over your life?" you're asking "Who do you think is important and worthy of your admiration?"

So, yes, when I meet someone new, I will try to automatically give them the respect anyone deserves: to have their opinions taken seriously, their views listened to, to be treated fairly by me, that kind of thing. But I won't automatically Respect them, unless they have earned it in some way.

I don't know about elsewhere, but where I come from there has historically been a problem that a lot of people think that because someone holds a particular job, let's say, they're a teacher, that means they are automatically worthy of respect, and their word will be held as more important than a child's or a parent's if there's a dispute. And the children are taught that some things are wrong, but the teacher never is wrong. So if a teacher abuses this power, the children can't so anything about it because people think "Oh, but Mr X is a teacher, that's worthy of respect." Same goes for politicians, or people in authority in some way. Yes, in a perfect world, all teachers would be devoted to helping children learn and achieve their full potential, and therefore would be worthy of great respect, but they're human, and any of them could have ulterior motives or just be petty and mean, so they deserve Respect only when they have earned it. From society, not from me specifically, but society is only made of me and my friends and neighbours, and their friends, and so on.

In short, when I say I will not automatically give you respect until you've earned it, I don't mean I will treat you disrespectfully, but that I won't automatically take everything you say as the truth, or take your word as worth more than someone else's.


The language problem here is that you're not talking about respect, you're talking about something more along the lines of trust and admiration.

ZevoxIn my view, KenderWizard has the right of it. There is a gulf of difference between "respecting" someone and "being respectful". When I was a soldier, we had a phrase we used a lot just out of earshot of officers whom we did not respect and that was "I respect the rank, not the man". This doesn't mean that I was mean or rude or failed to salute, it meant that I had no respect for the man or woman wearing the brass.

To respect someone means to hold them in high regard or esteem. To be respectful means to be courteous. One can easily be respectful to some one they do not respect. I am respectful to strangers, but I do not respect people freely, they must earn it.

[Kobold-Bard]

I don't quite understand this one. I can count several times I've enjoyed myself that were a waste of time. Mainly the two years I spent at Uni. I had a great time and thoroughly enjoyed the course, but I can safely say that I would have been far better off if I had never signed up for it.

Maybe I'm just thinking too logically.

Obviously there are limits to the sentiment of that quote, because there is a line between enjoying your fruitless endevours and just flat out achieving nothing/wasting your life. But if you enjoyed your time at uni, and it gave you some good memories then I'd say it was definitely worth while.

But that's just me.

And I loved that Durkon quote :smallbiggrin:

[Concrete]

"Courage is fear holding on a minute longer." -George Smith Patton.

"'There are no atheists in foxholes' isn't an argument against atheism, it's an argument against foxholes." - James Morrow.

"To one who knows the world
There is no sight more sad, more pitiful
Than a laughing child at play."
- Leopold Sands.

[KenderWizard]

"No Man made a greater mistake than he who did nothing because he could only do a little"

It's attributed to Edmund Burke. Not Sure if he's the actual source.

Another saying attributed to him "Evil triumphs when good men do nothing"

I agree with both personally.

They're really good ones, and very true!


In my view, KenderWizard has the right of it. There is a gulf of difference between "respecting" someone and "being respectful". When I was a soldier, we had a phrase we used a lot just out of earshot of officers whom we did not respect and that was "I respect the rank, not the man". This doesn't mean that I was mean or rude or failed to salute, it meant that I had no respect for the man or woman wearing the brass.

To respect someone means to hold them in high regard or esteem. To be respectful means to be courteous. One can easily be respectful to some one they do not respect. I am respectful to strangers, but I do not respect people freely, they must earn it.

That's a good example, and I'm glad of it, because I was finding it very hard to explain without using examples that would not be board appropriate!

[Marillion]

"If you don't stick to your principles when they're tested, they're not principles. They're hobbies."
~Jon Stewart

[Asta Kask]

money isn't everything, but i'd rather cry in a mercedes than a kia

[Pyrian]

^ I prefer Charlie's rule #15 (http://www.erfworld.com/wiki/index.php/Charlescomm): "Some things are more important than money. COROLLARY: Most things are not more important than money."

[Asta Kask]

"It is no use saying, 'We are doing our best.' You have got to succeed in doing what is necessary."

"You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life."

"Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen."


Winston Churchill

[zeratul]

a few quotes I like a lot...

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not.~ Kurt Cobain

Ideas are also weapons ~ Subcomandante Marcos

If you alone of all the nation shall decide one way, and that way be the right away according to your convictions of the right, you have done your duty by yourself and by your country. Hold up your head. You have nothing to be ashamed of. ~ Mark Twain

Our myths are steeped in blood and tragedy and the grim acceptance of fate. The difference between these myths and the lessons they teach us and the modern day are virtually non existent. A man's life, decided by the warmongers, by the blade of a knife, a bullet from a gun or a bomb is no different from the warmongers and warriors of legend. We write our own legends today, here and now, yet always with blood.~ A.A. Nemtheanga

When life gives you lemons, just shut up and eat the damn lemons ~ 3rd rock from the sun

[Devils_Advocate]

respect: To feel or show deferential regard for; esteem (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/respect)


The language problem here is that you're not talking about respect, you're talking about something more along the lines of trust and admiration.
Well, one could as easily say that what you're talking about isn't respect, but more along the lines of consideration or courtesy or just basic decency (I think).

Words can have multiple meanings. Sometimes a word may even have a common meaning that you are not yet familiar with. I humbly request that you deal with it.

I wouldn't say that I "respect" someone to indicate that I don't treat another person like crap. Were I to say that I respect someone -- and I don't think that I ever have said that, which isn't to say that there's no one who I respect -- I'd be talking about my attitude, not my behavior, towards that person. It's not really so much a choice, either. It's compelled by -- or perhaps simply is -- recognition of fundamental virtue. And it's a high bar. I certainly wouldn't say that I respect myself, for example; far from it.

[max-is-working]

I like this one from The Last Unicorn by Peter S. Beagle:

"Your true task has just begun, and you may not know in your life if you have succeeded in it, but only if you fail."

It seems sad, but it sounds true. When we fail we know it - strangers come up to us to tell us we failed, our so-called friends rub our faces in our failures, our family members do their best to remind us of our failures at least three times a year...

But as for success. Who exists who can truly see a successful life for what it is?

If our friends had been Mother Theresa's friends, they would have told her, "You're not rich enough." If our relatives had been Martin Luther King's relatives, they would have told him, "You need to spend less time on your so-called causes and more time with us."

You may not know in your life if you have succeeded in it, but only if you fail. You just have to do your best and hope it's enough!

[Jergmo]

"If you have much, give of your wealth; if you have little, give of your heart." ~Arab proverb

"You're only given a little spark of madness. You mustn't lose it." ~Robin Williams

I have few close friends, but I am adored by them for my compassion, generosity and my fairly whimsical nature. :smallsmile:

Here are a couple by me that we'd all do well to remember:

"Being intelligent merely means being stupid about life, instead of mostly clueless."
"Every once in a while, maturity must be tossed to the winds."

[Xyk]

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense.
-Buddha

All movements go too far.
-Bertrand Russell

Only a sith deals in absolutes.
-Obi Wan Kenobi (it's funny because that's an absolute statement)

[Marillion]

I like this one from The Last Unicorn by Peter S. Beagle:
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

More Beagley goodness below:


"The magician said again. "We can only go on."

"What is plucked will grow again,
What is slain lives on,
What is stolen will remain--
What is gone is gone."

"We are not always what we seem, and hardly ever what we dream."
~Schmendrick

"I always say perserverance is nine-tenths of any art--not that it's much help to be nine-tenths an artist, of course."
~Mabruk

"You are losing my interest and that is very dangerous. In a moment I will have forgotten you quite entirely, and will never be able to remember just what I did with you. What I forget not only ceases to exist, but never really existed in the first place."
~King Haggard

"I suppose I was young when I first saw them. Now I must be old--at least I have picked many more things up than I had then, and put them all down again. But I always knew that nothing was worth the investment of my heart, because nothing lasts, and I was right, and so I was always old. Yet each time I see my unicorns, it is like that morning in the woods, and I am truly young in spite of myself, and anything can happen in a world that holds such beauty."
~King Haggard

"That is most of it, being a wizard--seeing and listening. The rest is technique."
~Schmendrick

"It's really not so good to have time. Rush, scramble, desperation, this missed, that left behind, those others too big to fit into such a small space--that's the way life was meant to be. You're supposed to be too late for some things. Don't worry about it."
~Skull

"When I was alive, I believed--as you do--that time was at least as real and solid as myself, and probably more so. I said 'one o'clock' as though I could see it, and 'Monday' as though I could find it on the map; and I let myself be hurried along from minute to minute, day to day, year to year, as though I were actually moving from one place to another. Like everyone else, I lived in a house bricked up with seconds and minutes, weekends and New Year's Days, and I never went outside until I died, because there was no other door. Now I know that I could have walked through the walls."
~Skull

"I think I understand, but I'm sure I don't."
~Schmendrick

"Great heroes need great sorrows and burdens, or half their greatness goes unnoticed."
~Schmendrick


Related to your quote:
"Twice I did well, and that I heard never.
Once I did ill, and that I heard ever."

[Skeppio]

It's probably been said on this thread, but I like "Be yourself. No-one else is qualified to be". I don't know who said it first, and I'm probably paraphrasing it, but I think it's a good one.

[Elfin]

The italic in my signature isn't actually a quotation from anyone, but it is a snippet by which I try to live my life.

[Fifty-Eyed Fred]

I posted some favourite quotes of mine earlier, but the saying I have in all probability most lived by is "you reap what you sow".

[max-is-working]

I like "E pur si muove," attributed to Galileo (though there's no evidence that he said such a thing). I like it. A statement that says that even though authority and those in power declare something doesn't mean it's true. For example, not even a law silencing teachers or preventing teachers from teaching something can make what is true suddenly untrue.

[Stadge]

It's not the best of quotes, but it has stuck with me ever since I first heard it:

"If nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do" - Angel, (Angel the series, can't remeber the writer of that specific episode though)

[Xyk]

I like "E pur si muove," attributed to Galileo (though there's no evidence that he said such a thing). I like it. A statement that says that even though authority and those in power declare something doesn't mean it's true. For example, not even a law silencing teachers or preventing teachers from teaching something can make what is true suddenly untrue.

I like this one.

[Knaight]

Nobody, in most cases the use of quotes does not impact negatively on a discussion. However, since an unsupported quote is useless, the actual utility of quotes is rarely going to be anything other than nil at the bast of times.

This is questionable. Among the reasons for a used phrase to become a quote is the presentation of information or an argument in a concise, clear, and eloquent manner. If the information or argument of the quote needs to be made, then one might as well use the quote, at which point it is providing a use. A quote is not the be all end all of a discussion, and should not be used as such, but it is a useful tool.

Regarding quotes:
"The ability of accurate observation is frequently called cynicism by those who do not possess it."
-Bertrand Russel.

"The strength of our convictions must be commensurate with the strength of our evidence else we risk birthing a new dogma, and no one needs that."
-Wedorska Stymazka

[Asthix]

...I tend to view the habit as being symptomatic of the soundbite culture that pollutes a lot of debate (mainly amongst the general public - it's much less prevelent in academia, especially in philosophy).

...the fact remains that a quote is completely useless if it's presented without anythig to support the opinion it's advocating, regardless of how intelligent the person who originally said it was.

Not completely useless, that's an unfair qualification. Following what Knaight said, quotes have been used for a long time as a meme to disseminate social concepts. You make your comments from the competitive debate / academia side of things, but fail to accept the value 'laypeople' can get from them.


...I'm of the opinion that the practice of revering quotations actually encourages the appeal to authority in argument, or is at the very least symptomatic of an attitude which does.

Maybe so but what you call authority another may call teacher. There will never be a day when all are well reasoned individualists at the rate we're going, so you should accept that not all people can make well formed arguments about an important subject through discussion with their peers (because of numerous real world demands on their time) and that quotes do have merit to those people not well versed on both sides of an issue already. Also consider that appeals to authority are not always due to the willing ignorance of the one appealing.


...Yes, a pithy quotation rolls of the tongue more easily then a longer explanation you might give, but a more informative explanation will always be of greater usefullness.

'Pithy quote' really is an oxymoron. A quote pretty much is by definition forceful and concise. Also, I disagree about longer always being more useful.*
(*See at the rate we're going)


Note that I'm not saying that venerating quotations represent the first step on some nasty slippery slope. Just that I find the practice to be a very poor alternative to reasoned discussion.

tl;dr: there's little real point in relying on quotes to say things for you. You're better off working it out for yourself.

Yeah but some people just don't want to do that. They're much happier just leaving it at a quote. Their response would be to point out that some antonyms of pithy are long winded and verbose. Booo-ring!:smallsigh:

Finally, I found a quote from someone on this site and I liked it so much it's in my sig.

[shadow_archmagi]

"You must be the change you want to see in the world."
- Gandhi


This is a personal favorite of mine. It's what I think whenever I go out of my way to do something that will never benefit me in any way shape or form. Like picking up litter or grabbing extra grocery carts from the parking lot and taking them inside with me on my way in so that they're not cluttering up the place.

If everyone were willing to take two extra steps to make the world a bit nicer, then it would be a lot nicer. So I work on being willing.

[CynicalAvocado]

Wyrd bið ful aræd. fate remains wholly inexorable

[Chambers]

"Logic is the beginning of wisdom, Valeris, not the end." - Spock, Star Trek VI.

This quote reminds me that we always need to consider emotions and feelings, and consider them as valid, when examining a situation or issue. So many philosophical theories simply ignore or downgrade emotions, but for the theory to accurately describe and proscribe human activity, the theory must account for how people actually behave. And a lot of times we are led by our emotions, as well as by logic.

[AKAAATT]

Marty: You know in Greece they cut off the head of the messenger who brought bad news.
Visser: Now that don't make much sense.
Marty: No. It just made them feel better.
Visser: [laughs] Well first off, Julian, I don't know what the story is in Greece but in this state we got very definite laws about that.

[Seffbasilisk]

“If you limit your choices only to what seems possible or reasonable, you disconnect yourself from what you truly want, and all that is left is compromise.” - Robert Fritz

"Not all who wander are lost." - JRR Tolkien

"If you're going through hell, keep going." -Winston Churchill.

[Em Blackleaf]

I love quotes! I believe Ralph Waldo Emerson maybe the most quotable person in history.
Two of my favorite quotes are:
"A chief event of life is the day in which we have encountered a mind that startled us."
and...
"Earth laughs in flowers."

-Ralph Waldo Emerson

Some more favorite quotes:
"Poetry is the art of creating imaginary gardens with real toads." -Marianne Moore

"Love is being stupid together." -Paul Valery

Those are just a few. I'll maybe post more if I think of more. *shrug*

[Mathis]

A good quote is a very nice source of small moralboosts in everyday life. Many of my favourites have been mentioned already but here is one I havn't seen yet:

"When I was young I was taught what impossible meant. Now that I'm older I've learned that it means something closer to perhaps."
I wish I knew where I heard it, but unfortunately I do not. Will edit it in later if I remember.

[Cealocanth]

“If you limit your choices only to what seems possible or reasonable, you disconnect yourself from what you truly want, and all that is left is compromise.” - Robert Fritz

That's a good one. I like how it encourages free opinion. It's really amazing how many people said pretty much the same thing, about how you need to look at life through your own eyes.


"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new." -Albert Einstein

This is one of my favorites.

[chiasaur11]

"Guess who's drunk!"-Wallace Wells, 2010

Words to live by, even in these troubled times.