Legendary Weapons?

[SethFahad]

What do you think of legendary items and Weapons of Legacy book?

[Kelb_Panthera]

I think they're ok. Most of the optimizers will tell you that only a legacy item that you founded the legacy for is even worth considering.

[SethFahad]

Well, yes actually founding new legacies was what I had in mind.

Comparing it with the normal creation of magic items, do you think LW is overpriced or underpriced?

[Kelb_Panthera]

I'm afb right now, but I don't think the prices were unreasonable. They're a little cheaper than a comparable, standard magic item, but they also permanently take a chunk of your character's inherent abilities. The feats necessary for their use are gained as bonus feats when you complete the rituals, so that's no loss, but permanently giving up HP or BAB or skill points can make a noticeable if not significant difference in a character's final makeup.

[Tyndmyr]

Well, yes actually founding new legacies was what I had in mind.

Comparing it with the normal creation of magic items, do you think LW is overpriced or underpriced?

Overpriced. With optimization, and the custom item creation rules, you can sorta work one up to "decentish". Then there's the abuse of the feat mechanic that makes me sad, and the fact that you're permanently screwing over your character for an item that can still be lost or destroyed(see that DOMT? Stay the hell away from it).

In general, they're not amazing. The idea was fine. The actual weapons they created in the book range from subpar to terrible.

[SethFahad]

Maybe you can cover the loss of BAB or saves by granting the weapon resistance bonuses and +1 enhancements along with speed ability or haste...

[FMArthur]

Legendary weapons aren't coming from Weapons of Legacy IMO; even custom made Weapons of Legacy are underpowered for their cost and don't produce any particularly special or interesting effects. Legendary weapons come from well-built characters dedicated to making an amazing weapon, and none of that includes the garbage from WoL. It's a Kensai, a Psywar with Soulbound Weapon (my personal favourite) or some form of Soulknife stacking shenanigans - these things make people notice the weapon because they're coming from comparatively weaker or lower-level characters - stuff from the "late game" brought into the early game. Or some random weapon wielded by a legendary warrior is even more notable than anything produced from WoL's rules.

[Tyndmyr]

Maybe you can cover the loss of BAB or saves by granting the weapon resistance bonuses and +1 enhancements along with speed ability or haste...

Yeah, but the point of a legacy weapon shouldn't be to make up for it's own flaws. You don't gimp your character permanently for a temporary buff to compensate, do you? That's just silly, and nothing about that brings to mind anything like the historical concept of a legacy weapon.

[Serpentine]

What are Legendary Weapons?

For Weapons of Legacy, apparently (they said it, not me!) my group's system of replacing the mechanical costs with roleplaying ones is a good idea. I've never had a problem with it, anyway, and everyone seems to enjoy their items.

[Tyndmyr]

What are Legendary Weapons?

For Weapons of Legacy, apparently (they said it, not me!) my group's system of replacing the mechanical costs with roleplaying ones is a good idea. I've never had a problem with it, anyway, and everyone seems to enjoy their items.

Pretty much same here. Said weapons should be rare, and require effort to find. Challenges to overcome, that sort of thing. It's far more fun than -2 hp. There is already plenty of math involved with characters, we don't need more.

If you drop the negatives, and kick in some IC challenges, it works out just fine.

[Serpentine]

Well, rare... All my characters automatically get one :smalltongue: Actually, I'd better check that everyone's given theirs a proper Requirement...

[Aharon]

There's a guide for them over at BG (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=5907.0).

I like the idea of stacking lots of Lesser Metamagic on Legacy Items. I'm not entirely sure wether it works or not - you can only take each ability once, so it depends on wether Lesser Metamagic (Searing Spell) counts as being different from Lesser Metamagic (Transdimensional Spell).

As they don't have the restriction of metamagic rods (only one per spell), you can use an Item of Legacy to get out (for example) searing transdimensional deafening empowered maximized spells.

That's not bad, I think - but as I said, it hinges on wether Lesser Metamagic can be taken more than once for different metamagic feats.

There's also a way to further improve weapons of legacy: While they can't be enhanced with regular means, you can make them Bonded Items (DMGII), thus adding further improvements. Bonus points if you're also a kensai:smallwink:

@Tyndmir
What does DOMT stand for? Anyway, Legacy Items are pretty hard to destroy. They have +20 on all saves and the normal hardness is increased by 10. As other expensive items could be destroyed as well, I don't really understand the point. They have a better chance not to be destroyed than, for example, a random headband of intellect +6, which costs only 19000 gp less than an item created with the first progression.

[Tyndmyr]

Deck of many things. It can, among other things, cause you to permanently lose all magic items. Save? What save?

The above unfortunately has happened to me. Twice.