How do you forge a stamp?

[ExtravagantEvil]

Hello playgrounders!
I, ExtravagantEvil, commander of all that is dark and mildly irksome, come asking how to commit a minor act of rebellion. There is a stamped image on back of extra credit slips for my Chemistry class (Mole dollars). I need to know how to copy this stamp so I can mass produce these, and I'm honestly doing this now to one up the chemistry teacher, for she has brought up the idea of their forging at day 1. Now, I see it as a challenge and want to win :smallamused:. So is it possible to forge a stamped image (may upload picture of it later), and can someone explain the reference with Chemistry and Moles?
Thank you for helping my dastardly deed :smalltongue:.

[Zeofar]

I think you mean a stamps link stamps with rubber bottoms, not embossing? Sure, you can forge a stamp, but as far as I know, like most tasks of forgery, you have to have some ability in the craft itself. Just carve out the negative zone on a blank rubber stamp. Alternatively, find someone who knows how to engrave things and have them do that. There might even be a service that does custom rubber stamps - If you could give them the design, they might be able to, but I'm not sure how their custom stamp service works.

Also, what exactly do you mean "the reference with Chemistry and Moles"? Do you not know what moles are?

[ExtravagantEvil]

I know what a mole is, but the concept of the Mole dollar is what confuses me, apparently a scientest came up with some theory, and said it dealt with everything from molecules to moles (I think, paraphrasing) and that is the purpose of Mole Dollars.

[Jack Squat]

By the title of this thread, I was thinking postage stamp, and was going to mention that not only is it illegal, but it's a lot of trouble to save 46 cents.

This is an ink stamp, right?

On one of those large erasers ought to be a nice base for this, depending on size. Potatoes work too, and are easier to carve on, but it's a short-term thing. You'll also need something to cut at the eraser/potato. An exacto blade will work for this, but it's easier to use one of those clay carving tools that's a loop of metal. I forget what they're called, but we used them all the time to cut designs into rubber resist.

On the back of the paper with the stamped image, scribble hard with a pencil, so that the area has a nice carbon build-up to it. Then put the stamp scribbled-side down over the eraser and carefully trace over the image. Press firmly so that the graphite will transfer over.

When this is done, take the knife/tool and scrape away the waste material, while leaving the design intact. Then just apply ink and have at it.

[Zanaril]

I know what a mole is, but the concept of the Mole dollar is what confuses me, apparently a scientest came up with some theory, and said it dealt with everything from molecules to moles (I think, paraphrasing) and that is the purpose of Mole Dollars.
This kind of mole? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mole_%28unit%29)

[KenderWizard]

In case you don't want to read the Wiki link, a mole of a substance is that mass of the substance that contains a particular number of atoms (if it's a pure element) or molecules (if it's a compound). The number is fixed and called Avagadro's constant, and it's a ridiculously huge number, being as how atoms are so tiny and all. Anyway, it comes out that a mole of Carbon-12 has a mass of 12 grams, a mole of Hydrogen-1 has a mass of 1 gram, and so on. They're very useful, and yet very frustrating to deal with sometimes.

I'm impressed that the Chemistry teacher in question went to the trouble of making an extra-credit stamp with a chemistry joke on it without explaining the chemistry joke!

[Mando Knight]

I'm impressed that the Chemistry teacher in question went to the trouble of making an extra-credit stamp with a chemistry joke on it without explaining the chemistry joke!

I'm pretty sure that the mole-mole joke is stock high school chemistry humor... my high school chem teacher had an extra credit assignment that like one person a year usually took her up on: make a bean-bag mole for the room.

[Coidzor]

I'm pretty sure that the mole-mole joke is stock high school chemistry humor... my high school chem teacher had an extra credit assignment that like one person a year usually took her up on: make a bean-bag mole for the room.

Yeah, but they usually explain what a mole is.

Also, Mole Day. Less delicious than Pi Day.

[Gorgondantess]

Also, Mole Day. Less delicious than Pi Day.

Fried Mole. Yummm.:smallbiggrin:

[Kneenibble]

Press the stamp in fine wet sand and pour hot parrafin into the impression. It is not a distributable copy, but it can forge the image.

Mole, I imagine, comes of moles, meaning a lump or mass, of which molecule is the diminutive.

[Mando Knight]

Yeah, but they usually explain what a mole is.
It's pretty early in the semester. They might not have gotten quite that far, especially if it's a high school course.

Mole, I imagine, comes of moles, meaning a lump or mass, of which molecule is the diminutive.
Interesting. I suppose then that the critter known as a mole is derived from the same word, due to its habit of leaving lumps or masses of dirt around due to its tunneling.

[golentan]

Press the stamp in fine wet sand and pour hot parrafin into the impression. It is not a distributable copy, but it can forge the image.

Mole, I imagine, comes of moles, meaning a lump or mass, of which molecule is the diminutive.

I prefer plaster for making copies: You can wait for it to harden before removal and not run the risk of disturbing it. It also gives you reusability on the mold.

If you can't get access long enough, using Kneebiter's trick and then plastering the imitation does it. A clean impression is needed, though, or the image will come out distorted.

I also prefer not-parafin. If you use SORTA-clear Silicone "rubber," it works great and should give something like the right texture for the stamp.

[Jack Squat]

You guys are assuming he has access to the actual stamp. It sounds like he's wanting to create a stamp from the image the stamp left behind.

[golentan]

You guys are assuming he has access to the actual stamp. It sounds like he's wanting to create a stamp from the image the stamp left behind.

That's... not going to happen without years of practice, a brilliant eye and a steady hand. Access to the stamp needs 5 seconds worst case.

[BizzaroStormy]

if you have the image, a decent photocopier should be able to give what you need. Next, cut out the image itself and trace the image onto a block of wood. Carve out bits that arent part of the image and bam, you can has stamp.

[Temotei]

Yeah, we got mole dollars, too.

I also had the opportunity to take many, many dollars when the teacher wasn't looking, but I never did it because, even though I didn't like my chemistry/biotech teacher (same woman), I suppose I have a sense of honor about that kind of thing. :smallamused:

[Jack Squat]

That's... not going to happen without years of practice, a brilliant eye and a steady hand. Access to the stamp needs 5 seconds worst case.

I don't have any of those, and I could do it. You transfer the image over and work slow on the carving.

Now, since I have access to the equipment, I'd probably use a computer to trace and cut the design out on resist and then etch away the waste, but I'm going to assume that the OP doesn't have access to a cutter and a blasting cabinet.

[Szilard]

These are stamps on extra credit slips, right?
Have a file of the extra credit slip, scan a picture of the stamp onto your computer, place on the extra credit slips, and print. Alternitively, scan the entire thing and print all of it.

A friend of mine just scanned an image of a stamp to stamp his late journals back in English last year.

[Zeofar]

Also, I meant to have this in my post, but I apparently forgot - Office Depot does custom rubber stamps. Don't have an idea what their pricing is, though.

As to what a "mole dollar" is, I have no idea. It seems like it is some sort of chemistry "reference" joke. An actual mole is any number of atoms/molecules/particles/objects equal to Avogrado's constant, a very large number (6.022*10^23).

[golentan]

I don't have any of those, and I could do it. You transfer the image over and work slow on the carving.

Now, since I have access to the equipment, I'd probably use a computer to trace and cut the design out on resist and then etch away the waste, but I'm going to assume that the OP doesn't have access to a cutter and a blasting cabinet.

Line thickness won't come out right, and shapes tend to distort. It's visibly different.

The "scan and print" sounds like a good option, I must admit.

[Danne]

Just have to add, your teacher may have included a way to prevent forgeries. My teacher in AP chem had a similar thing ("mole bucks," we called 'em) and she and the other chem teachers used a special ink that they prepared themselves which would react a certain way when treated with the right chemicals. If your teacher has done something similar, then you can't forge them without having the right ink, and you could get in big trouble if you try.

[RabbitHoleLost]

That's... not going to happen without years of practice, a brilliant eye and a steady hand. Access to the stamp needs 5 seconds worst case.

Or a Staples.
I'm pretty sure Staples can make stamps.

[ExtravagantEvil]

Just have to add, your teacher may have included a way to prevent forgeries. My teacher in AP chem had a similar thing ("mole bucks," we called 'em) and she and the other chem teachers used a special ink that they prepared themselves which would react a certain way when treated with the right chemicals. If your teacher has done something similar, then you can't forge them without having the right ink, and you could get in big trouble if you try.

I doubt that my chem teacher has had the forethought to do something like that, she is not anticipating anyone A. To try to forge the stamp, and B. She graduated from college last year, and just got the job, so there is that new naivety associated in this time frame. Its also, not as if I will claim credit anyways, as stated before, it is to take a challenge, and to win, so there is nothing to say other than "I managed to forge it, veni vidi vici."


You guys are assuming he has access to the actual stamp. It sounds like he's wanting to create a stamp from the image the stamp left behind.

Yes, this is true, I have no access to the actual stamp itself, I only have an image made by said stamp (not all that intricate, a very basic looking design, will post it tommorow).

[Keris]

Mole, I imagine, comes of moles, meaning a lump or mass, of which molecule is the diminutive.
Mole is a translation of the German Mol, which was derived from Molekül, the German translation of molecule. Bit of a roundabout route, but since the unit was named about a century after molecule entered the English language, here we are.


Interesting. I suppose then that the critter known as a mole is derived from the same word, due to its habit of leaving lumps or masses of dirt around due to its tunnelling.
The name for the animal is a shortening of moldwarp (meaning "earth-thrower"). Moldwarp is itself a combination of molde and weorpan (which is what we get the verb warp from), and molde came from Proto-Germanic *mulda.
So yes, it comes from the dirt they push around, but no, it's not from moles. The Romans used moles to denote, among other things, the heavy masses used to breakwaters, which is a meaning mole has retained. It may also be related to Latin mola ("millstone"), from which we eventually get worlds like mill and molar.


She is not anticipating anyone to try to forge the stamp
Didn't she "bring up the idea of their forging at day 1". :smallconfused:

[ExtravagantEvil]

Didn't she "bring up the idea of their forging at day 1".

Ah yes, true, but she did say basically "You could just put the dollars on the copy machine, but I have this nifty stamp on the back I'd need to see"
Note: Paraphrased, close enough I suppose
So she brought it up, and doesn't seem to think anyone would go to such lengths for 1 point per dollar of extra credit.

[Gullara]

It's pretty early in the semester. They might not have gotten quite that far, especially if it's a high school course.


When I was in high school moles were the first thing we covered.

[THAC0]

Ah yes, true, but she did say basically "You could just put the dollars on the copy machine, but I have this nifty stamp on the back I'd need to see"
Note: Paraphrased, close enough I suppose
So she brought it up, and doesn't seem to think anyone would go to such lengths for 1 point per dollar of extra credit.

For the record, I don't think that was a challenge issued to you. Your forgery attempts may be met with unfortunate consequences.

[Sholos]

There's also the fact that she may *gasp* be keeping track of how many points she hands out and to who.

[Zen Monkey]

Did your teacher design this stamp, or did she just buy it someplace where you could also order one? It seems like recreating a store-bought item is a lot more work than just buying your own cheap rubber stamp from some supply company online. :smalltongue:

[Coidzor]

These? (http://blog.whatitslikeontheinside.com/2006/10/dont-spend-it-all-in-one-place.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v627/The_Science_Goddess/MoleBucks.jpg

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ed071p286.1

[Mando Knight]

I doubt that my chem teacher has had the forethought to do something like that, she is not anticipating anyone A. To try to forge the stamp, and B. She graduated from college last year, and just got the job, so there is that new naivety associated in this time frame.

Careful, youngling. Being overconfident in your ability to outwit those who have been put into authority over you is the surest and swiftest way for things to backfire.

[Coidzor]

Or possibly these? http://www.flinnsci.com/store/ImageGen.ashx?image=AP6564cat.jpg&class=bigimage

http://www.flinnsci.com/store/Scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=16405&noList=1

As far as the image goes, anyway.

[ExtravagantEvil]

Different design for the mole, but a similar concept (ours look like actual dollar bills with an anthropomorphic creature I call "Mole Washington" on it).

Edit: They are like the first one in your second post, I was initially responding to your first post. Sorry for confusion

[ExtravagantEvil]

Careful, youngling. Being overconfident in your ability to outwit those who have been put into authority over you is the surest and swiftest way for things to backfire.

Too true, one should never underestimate an opponent, and I seek no true glory from my forging of these dollars, for I am not a true taker of risks, I simply will say proudly, that I have managed to forge them, for she flaunted the lack of ability to get them successfuly forged, due to the stamp.

[Coidzor]

http://eu-es.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=89540&fbid=5340361436&op=1&o=all&view=all&subj=2218775098&aid=-1&oid=2218775098&id=685511436

http://eu-es.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30010207&fbid=1002758475932&op=1&o=all&view=all&subj=2218775098&aid=-1&oid=2218775098&id=1433940008

This, basically?

Not managed to find anything mentioning a stamp within 10 pages of my google search. This thread is on page 3. If I knew of any science or homeschooling school supply catalogs I'd recommend you check those.

[THAC0]

Too true, one should never underestimate an opponent, and I seek no true glory from my forging of these dollars, for I am not a true taker of risks, I simply will say proudly, that I have managed to forge them, for she flaunted the lack of ability to get them successfuly forged, due to the stamp.

Saying "Hey guys, I put a stamp on the back so you can't just run them through a copy machine" isn't flaunting anything.

Now, maybe she presented it differently, but from the information you've provided in this thread, there was no flaunting or challenging going on.

And, as for her being a first year teacher and therefore naive, remember that she was in your place some 4-6 years ago, and therefore is quite familiar still with how students can try to pull things over on teachers. :smallwink:

[tcrudisi]

A mole is a unit, or have you heard, containing 6 times 10 to the 23rd...

I'll never forget that as long as I live. :smallfrown:

[Xyk]

Go to your local teacher store and buy the same stamp. Use it.

[Coidzor]

Although I do encourage you to try out some of the techniques posted earlier in the thread and how they turn out for you. Barring the whole actually trying to use them on her. Which is far too risky.

Who knows, you might even find you enjoy working with plaster or etching woodblocks.

[AslanCross]

Wow. The last time a group of people tried to forge something in the school I used to teach in, we almost axed them.

Of course, they were counterfeiting chits for the school fair, and so things with real money value were involved.

Ultimately they were caught because they uh...documented their counterfeiting process rather well (videoing and taking pictures of themselves while they photocopied the chits and cut the sheets in Starbucks), and someone leaked the footage and photos.

I'd strongly recommend against this, because your teacher might not take it well. New teacher or not.

[Knaight]

A mole is a unit, or have you heard, containing 6 times 10 to the 23rd...

I'll never forget that as long as I live. :smallfrown:
Based on the number of molecules required for 12 g of Carbon 12. Take one year of chemistry, its beaten into your head. Once you have two under your belt, it probably has the capacity to outlast the memory of most people.

[onthetown]

When I saw the title of this thread, I instantly thought of dwarves toiling away in mines and working the bellows to create little stickery masterpieces.

Honestly, it's been brought up before, but wouldn't that be illegal? You could also face being given a 0 or having all extra credit taken away if you're caught, especially if she knows the special thing that makes her stamp unique.

[Coidzor]

Honestly, it's been brought up before, but wouldn't that be illegal? You could also face being given a 0 or having all extra credit taken away if you're caught, especially if she knows the special thing that makes her stamp unique.

Illegal? I don't think so, it doesn't seem to cross the usual monetary or property damages/repercussions that forgery of the illicit sort implies. A poor decision to try to use them, definitely, due to the whole cheating thing. As an exercise of intellectual curiosity and experimentation, the idea has taken hold of my imagination at least.

I mean, is one thing to try to reproduce a dollar bill or some kind of warrant-type document or letter of wossname, and is another to see if you can reproduce the marks a stamp leaves on paper. Using the resultant stamps for extra credit would only be intellectually honest if he could swing cracking her system and showing how he did it to her. But then it's probably more trouble than it's worth considering he could have invested an equal amount of time in reading and gotten a better grade as a result.

Although, if she's doing something special in regards to chemically treating the paper or ink, cracking that could definitely impress her.

Musings... If it's just a stamp, she's either got a special ink she's using or she might use a special paper that acts differently when wet... or litmus paper if she's feeling like a spendthrift. Or treated with invisible ink of some sort. Or chemically treated to burn a different color.