[4e]Race:Kor

[marli]

Hi im reskinning a race in 4e for may campaign
Id love some suggestions on balance


i want to replece the dwarves power with:
A)
encounter
Minor Action.
Effect
place a second of your character in a burst 5 (as a guide things such a a rope can be strung between them at this point as a minor action)
the character has two bodys.
any effects that effect one body effects the other.
(flanked, prone,stunned, pushed, pulled etc)
Targeting is resolved individully(so a single attack on the primary body is just one attack on the character, but if both bodies are targeted by an area effect it two seperate attacks on the character)
Although a character may chose to have an action originate from different bodies they still only have the same amount of action to share between the bodies.
A single move action can be split between bodies buth the total move must be valid. .character cannot have bodies complete action at he same time unless they could do that anyway.

The effect can be ended by a standard action if both bodys occupy an ajacent square. or with a short rest at range.

The charcter can activate this power if they take falling damage the the reduces them to below 0 as immidate interupt EVEN IF ALREADY USED.

or

B)
encounter
players get ADVANCED MAGE HAND
you may use any melee power via this mage hand
but all skill stat mods are replaced with DEX/INT(not sure which) except STR which is 6(-2)

[Crossfiyah]

Hi im reskinning a race in 4e for may campaign
Id love some suggestions on balance


i want to replece the dwarves power with:
A)
encounter
Minor Action.
Effect
place a second of your character in a burst 5 (as a guide things such a a rope can be strung between them at this point as a minor action)
the character has two bodys.
any effects that effect one body effects the other.
(flanked, prone,stunned, pushed, pulled etc)
Targeting is resolved individully(so a single attack on the primary body is just one attack on the character, but if both bodies are targeted by an area effect it two seperate attacks on the character)
Although a character may chose to have an action originate from different bodies they still only have the same amount of action to share between the bodies.
A single move action can be split between bodies buth the total move must be valid. .character cannot have bodies complete action at he same time unless they could do that anyway.

The effect can be ended by a standard action if both bodys occupy an ajacent square. or with a short rest at range.

The charcter can activate this power if they take falling damage the the reduces them to below 0 as immidate interupt EVEN IF ALREADY USED.

Ok...I don't have anything even close to resembling a clue what the hell you're talking about here. Can you please rephrase this in the form of a coherent paragraph?


or

B)
encounter
players get ADVANCED MAGE HAND
you may use any melee power via this mage hand
but all skill stat mods are replaced with DEX/INT(not sure which) except STR which is 6(-2)

Only useful to melee classes. And only melee classes that use Dex/Int, I think. I don't really know this isn't that clear since you use the term skill stat mods, which doesn't usually apply to melee powers.

Racial powers that are only useful to a certain type of build are frowned upon and should not be used. You need something useful to melee, ranged, weapon and implement users. Not just melee characters.

[Ihouji]

I assume you are replacing stand your ground?

A) Seems kind of useless unless you are a defender, but even then I don't think it is worth losing the ability to save against knock down.

B) Useless unless you are a rogue, swordmage, or artificer and all have far better racial choices.

In most cases I would rather just keep stand your ground.

Edit: I don't really see balance being a problem with them though.

[Crossfiyah]

I assume you are replacing stand your ground?

A) Seems kind of useless unless you are a defender, but even then I don't think it is worth losing the ability to save against knock down.

B) Useless unless you are a rogue, swordmage, or artificer and all have far better racial choices.

In most cases I would rather just keep stand your ground.

Edit: I don't really see balance being a problem with them though.

Only because they're useless. They won't be overpowered, but balance will still be an issue in that only certain classes can benefit from it.

[Ihouji]

Only because they're useless. They won't be overpowered, but balance will still be an issue in that only certain classes can benefit from it.

Only certain classes (defenders and melee) really benefit from stand your ground as is. I don't see a real problem, its just replacing one ok but most of the time useless power for another ok but most of the time useless power.

Maybe make mage hand run off of Int, Wis, or Con similar to the dragon born power and allow it to be the origin for spells as well. That would make it a more well rounded ability that is also focused more on the dwarf stat block.

[Crossfiyah]

Only certain classes (defenders and melee) really benefit from stand your ground as is. I don't see a real problem, its just replacing one ok but most of the time useless power for another ok but most of the time useless power.

Maybe make mage hand run off of Int, Wis, or Con similar to the dragon born power and allow it to be the origin for spells as well. That would make it a more well rounded ability that is also focused more on the dwarf stat block.

...No?

Everybody benefits from stand your ground. Not being pushed, pulled, or slid as many squares means its harder to enemies to move you into dangerous positions, like over cliffs.

Also, a saving throw to not fall prone is absolutely money, do you even know what stand your ground does?

And anyway, I'm pretty sure he meant replacing using your second wind as a minor action, as its more of a power than stand your ground, which is a trait.

[Ihouji]

...No?
Everybody benefits from stand your ground. Not being pushed, pulled, or slid as many squares means its harder to enemies to move you into dangerous positions, like over cliffs.

Also, a saving throw to not fall prone is absolutely money, do you even know what stand your ground does?


Yes I do and playing any ranged class well means you are almost never in a position to be hit. You always stay near, but not at the rear of the party while marching and position yourself with one or multiple escape routs should you be engaged. Thats why most ranged classes have abilities that involve shifting or teleporting as part of an attack or utility so they can shift or teleport then move so as to not provoke AoOs.

Never being hit means movement reduction and knockdown saves will almost never come into play. Its one of the many reasons that most of the classes dwarfs are most beneficial to are melee classes or melee gish classes. Also movement penalty reduction for armor, beneficial for mainly melee, Con bonus contributing to high HP again most beneficial for someone getting hit a lot aka melee.

Thats not to say dwarfs can't play ranged just that the racial bonuses are more well suited to melee and defenders in particular.

[Shyftir]

Dwarves are traditionally best suited for melee. That's not a weakness in a class ability. That's a design choice based on flavor.

[Crossfiyah]

Yes I do and playing any ranged class well means you are almost never in a position to be hit. You always stay near, but not at the rear of the party while marching and position yourself with one or multiple escape routs should you be engaged. Thats why most ranged classes have abilities that involve shifting or teleporting as part of an attack or utility so they can shift or teleport then move so as to not provoke AoOs.

Never being hit means movement reduction and knockdown saves will almost never come into play. Its one of the many reasons that most of the classes dwarfs are most beneficial to are melee classes or melee gish classes. Also movement penalty reduction for armor, beneficial for mainly melee, Con bonus contributing to high HP again most beneficial for someone getting hit a lot aka melee.

Thats not to say dwarfs can't play ranged just that the racial bonuses are more well suited to melee and defenders in particular.

If you're playing a ranged character and you're never being hit, you have an awful DM who has no idea what he is doing. Lurkers and skirmishers are designed to get at the squishy ranged characters in the back, and artillery monsters don't care where you are.

[Ihouji]

If you're playing a ranged character and you're never being hit, you have an awful DM who has no idea what he is doing. Lurkers and skirmishers are designed to get at the squishy ranged characters in the back, and artillery monsters don't care where you are.

Or it could be I have a high perception and understand that to hit me the enemy ranged unites have to come into range of the melee and get torn apart in 1-2 rounds.

But back on topic What is the race you are reskinning to? Perhaps I could make a 3rd option for it that would be more useful to all classes.

[Crossfiyah]

Or it could be I have a high perception and understand that to hit me the enemy ranged unites have to come into range of the melee and get torn apart in 1-2 rounds.

But back on topic What is the race you are reskinning to? Perhaps I could make a 3rd option for it that would be more useful to all classes.

Like I said, bad DM.